Taking dogs from their litter too young 'makes them aggressive'

The Daily Mail ^ | 8-26-11

[afraidfortherepublic]

Seperating puppies from their litter too early can turn them into aggressive dogs, say scientists. They are significantly more likely to display problematic behaviour as adults than those who stay for at least two months.

This raises the risk that they will be abandoned by their owners. Researchers studied 140 dogs aged between 18 months and seven years.

Half had been taken from the litter and adopted between the ages of 30 and 40 days, and half had been taken at 60 days.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2029876/Taking-dogs-litter-young-makes-aggressive.html#ixzz1WGgFtGaK

[Salamander]

I think “aggression” is the wrong term, here.

It’s more like “social conditioning” where the pup doesn’t get a chance to fully understand the subtle workings and rules of the hierarchy of the pack, be it human or canine and behavioral problems crop up, such as uninhibited hand nipping, too-frenzied play, etc.

Some would call that “aggression” but I’d call inappropriate pack behavior.

I like your individualized approach because all puppies are not the same at any particular age.

Some may need a lot more time.

One of Odin’s litter-mates [the “bully”] was returned to the breeder, beaten, broken and terrified.

The woman’s husband dealt with his “Doberteens” obligatory authority challenging by bashing him into submission.

It was a terrible, tragic thing to see.

The dog *had* the potential to be bold, bright and fearless like Odin but his ignorant [coward!] master ‘took it personally’ and whipped his adolescent confidence right out of him.

He went to another home and a “soft” owner who doesn’t mind him being timid for the rest of his life.

That also breaks my heart.

His bloodlines are famous for their ScH prowess and he’s little more than a shadow of himself.

Bad owners can totally destroy good dogs.

[Salamander]

Actually, that’s not really odd at all.

Severely malnourished animals lose the ability to digest food and thus, their appetite.

Eating makes them feel horrible so they just don’t.

Often, the only way to save them is with IV feedings and massive amounts of vitamins and probiotics until their innards regain their normal motility and function.

Phoebe, one of my ‘hard luck’ Ibizans came here weighing *12* pounds at 3 months of age.

She was a runt and the skank who bred her didn’t bother to hand feed her, letting her fend for herself amongst her much bigger siblings.

Consequently, Phoebe lived on puppy crap and pine shavings.
[seriously]

When we got her off the plane, she looked awful and within minutes I realized she was in shock and dying and it was a mad rush to find an open vet in a strange city.

$300 and 2 hours later, she’d been IV rehydrated and pumped full of glucose and vitamins and could actually stand up and walk own her own.

All the people in the SuperPetz store cheered when the ‘dead puppy’ I’d carried in came walking unsteadily out of the in-house vet clinic door.

It was still touch and go for *weeks* but she survived.

Today is her 9th birthday and although she still has a touchy tummy, she’s done pretty well for a dog who was *thisclose* to dead when I got hold of her.

A year later, I got her horribly tormented sister, Pookie.

It took a very long time to convince her that the end of the world was not imminent.
[sight hounds are harder to rehabilitate than anything else I’ve ever had to deal with]
She turns 9 today, also and sadly, after finally becoming as happy as she can be, considering, she is dealing with degenerative myelopathy, too.

There’s no ‘cure’ for that so we help her get by as best she can.

At this point, she and Phoebe live together in a separate room because Odin and Gypsy are just too rough-house for her.

They don’t mean to knock her over but she’s terribly unstable and I don’t want to her to deal with more stress than she has to.

*sigh*

At least it’s not painful for her.

[I wish I could say the same for me]

:(

[kaylar]

Pups learn a lot the from their mom in the first 2 months

I read that mama dogs know which puppies are preset to be alpha dogs, and they are sterner with them than with the less dominant pups : Growling at them when they get too pushy and so forth. Humans see this and think the mama dog "hates" that puppy, and so "rescue" it-making sure the alpha puppy never learns good dog manners as it would have if left with the mama dog, and so becoming more likely to be a discipline/behavior problem for their human family.

[Salamander]

The irony is that he tried to “get me back”.
[as if]

In an effort, I suppose, to make himself look similar to the new squeeze, he mentioned an incident in which he sat in the car while a ‘bro’ accosted me in front of a 7-11 one night as I was going in to get a ginger ale.

He actually said, verbatim “You know, I almost got out of the car and did something”.

Oh, wow.
I’m impressed.

That’s like saying “You know, I’ve almost got b@lls”

The New Improved hubster doesn’t even put up with some guy *looking* at me “wrong”, let alone grabbing me and groping me.

The reason hubby has *such* a grudge against him to this day is that some of the beatings permanently damaged my spine and neck.

I have “primary/peripheral nerve damage” and spend a lot of time in agony because of that and hubby has to sit and watch me suffer, unable to “kick the pain’s ass”.

He really, -really- holds that against the ex.

Truly, God gave me my good guy.
I really think I’d be dead by now if not for him.

[Salamander]

“Boxers scare the hell out of some people”

Only when I’m wearing nice clothes.

It’s all that SPIT!!!!

LOL

Dobes are called “Velcro dogs” because of their need to be stuck to you, 24/7.

[Odin is a JB Weld dog]...;]

He actually wiggles his ginormous carcass *up* behind me on top of the sofa back and tries to wrap his whole body around my neck like a fur stole.

Hubby laughs because he’ll come in the LR to see me typing away on FR with an apparent second head on my shoulders.

When he’s asleep on his back and I reach down to skritch his chest, his “arms” automatically come up, wrap around and lock *my* arm against him, hugging onto it for dear life.

Such a big baby boy...:)

[Salamander]

True.

Litter policy ~should~ be unless the dam is actually devouring a pup, mind your own business.

She knows what she’s doing.

[freekitty]

Not sure; but possible. Pups need all the time they can with their mom’s and litters. It socializes them and teaches them how to be a dog which is what they are.

What I have a problem with are the people that advocate spaying beginning at 8 weeks. Geez, puppies haven’t finished growing until 2 to 3 years of age. This will definitely stop the growth and do some damage .

[afraidfortherepublic]

**Emma went through a 3 stage heart worm treatment.

**

I don’t know where you are, but I live in Wisconsin and here we give heart worm prentative only from May through Oct. So, they have to have a test the following May to be sure that they are HW free before you start a new course.

My husband has a friend who is well enough off and who raises German Shorthair Pointers. He has lost 5-6 personal dogs in the length of time I’ve known him. He is an experienced dog owner/trainer and an educated man, but he doesn’t believe in heartworm preventative. He says it’s “too expensive”. (He doesn’t scrimp on anything else.) I’ve stopped mouorning his dead dogs. I can’t believe that any responsible owner would deny their fine dog HWP.

I’ve had dogs in 3 states — TX where we gave HWP year around, Washington where we didn’t give it at all, and WI where we give it half the year. There is a uestion about that too because some recommendations now say give it all year. My vet doesn’t recommend that yet.

“Too expensive” is having your dog getting heart worms and treating it!

[Clintonfatigued]

I realize that this is about dogs and not human beings, who have far more complex mental and emotional systems. But does it make you question the wisdom of kindergarten? It does me.

[wintertime]

I agree.

If children are taken from their homes and institutionalized at earlier and earlier ages in so-called kindergarten and pre-K programs the amount of illiteracy and dyslexia will increase.

[metmom]

A Basenji! What great dogs.

But the poor puppy will never learn to bark from her.

[Tijeras_Slim]

I thought the same thing, having 2 basenjis.

But check out the reply in # 26.

[metmom]

Holy cow.

The only difference is a little bit concerning the fur. Basenji’s are sleeker, but that didn’t show up very well in Salamander’s pictures, like the link showed.

[Brad’s Gramma]

You don’t let your dog walk YOU then, I assume.....way out in front ?

Ba da ba da boom. :) :)

My oldest GSD came home at a tad over 6 weeks. OTHER THAN thunder, she is THE most stable animal I’ve had the joy of owning/training.

I have no clue if it’s a fluke or what ... so no flames please.

[Salamander]

It depends.

If we’re walking up a steep hill, he can pull me to his heart’s content.

[hey..he’s a -working- breed so I let him do all the work]

;D

Seriously though, if we’re going a’viking in the mountains, he gets a very loose lead so he can sniff things and enjoy himself.
[I actually have a long 15’ lead just for that]

In public, though, around people, he’s expected to stay at my side.

He has different leads and collars for different purposes and seems to understand what each one “means”.

His support dog harness turns him into an all-business, no nonsense guy.

His fancy “Sunday Go To Meetin’” collar means he’s going out to the pet stores for socializing and shopping.

[why would you be expecting somebody to flame you?]

[Salamander]

Actually there's a lot of difference.

The Basenji has short bodied, flat backed, straight angulation build, almost "square" with a wedge-shaped, broader, shorter head while Podengos have long, mildly arched backs, high croups, extremely flexible spine ["double flexion"] and more angulated shoulders/hips/legs with a longer "sight hound head".

Podengos also come in 3 distinct coat varieties [flat/wire/"broken"] while Basenjis are always flat coated.

When they're pups, you can really see their Ibizan ancestry.

[that's Gypsy at 6 months]

Their greatest commonality is their general African continent origins and being "primitive breeds".

They also bark perfectly well though their "hunting cry" is a terrifying "shriek"....:)

[metmom]

I see the differences now. Just from the pictures you posted, they weren’t so obvious.

[Salamander]

Sorry...it’s kind of hard to get good photos of my pooches since they’re always running like maniacs....:)

Also sorry if that was too much information...LOL

[metmom]

That’s OK. I didn’t know Basenjis had a look alike cousin, so to speak.

How’d you all make out in the storm?

[2 Kool 2 Be 4-Gotten]

My 90 lb. male dobe was brought home at around 10 weeks. He came from a small litter and into a loving home. But he comes from Schutzhund lines and as had generations of “drive” bred into him. He’s what they call a “handful”. Not too much for me to handle but I suspect he’d be too much for most. He can be sweet as pie but he can be hell on wheels too. You have to keep him on a short leash and watch him like a hawk.