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To: hinckley buzzard

So we should just accept Free and Slave states again?

I respectfully disagree with slavery and believe the unborn are due the full protections accorded under the 14th amendement.

Yes, the 10th is important, but a child in NY is no less valuable than one in TX.


9 posted on 07/28/2011 6:38:42 PM PDT by BenKenobi (Honkeys for Herman!)
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To: BenKenobi
Well, unfortunately for conservatives, your position is the current law of the land, and it has not worked out well for the unborn. The Supreme Court has found the right to an abortion to be a right retained by the people under the Ninth Amendment via a non-incorporating incorporation argument of the 14th Amendment. There is now no sensible way to argue against that except via the Tenth Amendment.

That was the status quo ante in 1972 and it is correct. Throughout all US History, the States determined when a person was alive or not alive; at the end of life, they still do. If you want no abortion in all fifty States, campaign against it in all fifty States.

12 posted on 07/28/2011 6:58:57 PM PDT by FredZarguna (Can we be series for a moment, please?)
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To: BenKenobi; hinckley buzzard
So we should just accept Free and Slave states again?

That is a moot point because the issue of slavery has been Federalized by constitutional amendment. Right now, the Federal Government has the final say about slavery in ALL 50 States.

Is that what you want?

"One Federal Law Fits All" regarding abortion?

Do you really want the issue of abortion to be Federalized?

Think about that very carefully before you give your Final Answer.

Do you really want to surrender that much power to the Federal Government because you naively believe that you will control the Federal Government in regards to this issue instead of the Federal Government controlling you in regards to this issue?

If abortion is Federalized, with the current moral climate in America, an "Abortion Amendment" will be one GUARANTEEING abortion, not outlawing it.

That is just the political reality of 21st Century America.

If you force the issue to put abortion under "One Law Fits All", you will be enshrining legal abortion in ALL 50 States, regardless of what the people of Texas want, just like the 14th Amendment enshrined the abolition of slavery in ALL States, regardless of what the people of Texas wanted in the 1860's.

I respectfully disagree with slavery and believe the unborn are due the full protections accorded under the 14th amendment. Yes, the 10th is important, but a child in NY is no less valuable than one in TX.

See Post 20.

You will never stop a single abortion by living in a Fantasy World where you actually believe that what you think or what I think or what our mothers-in-law think about the 14th Amendment amounts to anything more than a bucket of warm spit.

In the Real World, with real consequences, what you think or what I think about the 14th Amendment and $1.29 gets us nothing more than a cup of coffee at McDonalds.

The fact remains that, under the Constitution, the only entity that can actually legally stop an abortion is a State. The U.S. Government can refuse to pay for an abortion with taxpayer's money but only a State can actually outlaw an abortion.

You can argue about the 14th Amendment until you are blue in the face but the fact remains that a branch of the Federal Government took the 14th and perverted it out of all recognition to ALLOW abortion in all 50 States REGARDLESS of the mandates of the Tenth Amendment.

What you think or what I think cannot stop a single abortion.

Maintaining and expanding the State's Right authority of the Tenth Amendment CAN stop an abortion ...... at least in the States that want to stop abortions.

Once you take abortion decisions completely out of the hands of the States and hand it over to the Federal Government, you will achieve your ideal scenario of all States having exactly the same law on this issue.

However, I will guarantee you that you will NOT .... repeat, ..... NOT like the result.

"Abortion is hereby recognized as a constitutional right. Neither Congress nor any State shall make any law prohibiting or restricting the free exercise a woman's right to an abortion under any circumstances" ..... Twenty-eigth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution making abortion no longer a States' Rights issue under the Tenth Amendment.

30 posted on 07/29/2011 12:30:58 PM PDT by Polybius
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