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Will FR embrace socialism to make way for Rudy Giuliani as a Republican presidential candidate?
vanity | April 21, 2007 | Jim Robinson

Posted on 04/21/2007 6:42:25 PM PDT by Jim Robinson

We've got some real challenges facing us. FR was established to fight against government corruption, overstepping, and abuse and to fight for a return to the limited constitutional government as envisioned and set forth by our founding fathers in the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution and other founding documents.

One of the biggest cases of government corruption, overstepping and abuse that I know of is its disgraceful headlong slide into a socialist hell. Our founders never intended for abortion to be the law of the land. And they never intended the Supreme Court to be a legislative body. They never intended God or religion to be written out of public life. They never intended government to be used to deny God's existence or for government to be used to force sexual perversions onto our society or into our children's education curriculum. They never intend for government to disarm the people. They never intended for government to set up sanctuary cities for illegals. They never intended government to “rule” over the people and or to take their earnings or private property or to deprive them of their constitutional rights to free speech, free religion, private property, due process, etc. They never intended government to seize the private property of private citizens through draconian asset forfeiture laws or laws allowing government to take private property from lawful owners to give to developers. Or to seize wealth and redistribute it to others. Or to provide government forced health insurance or government forced retirement systems.

All of the above are examples of ever expanding socialism and tyranny brought to us by liberals/liberalism.

FR fights against the liberals/Democrats in all of these areas and always will. Now if liberalism infiltrates into the Republican party and Republicans start promoting all this socialist garbage, do you think that I or FR will suddenly stop fighting against it? Do you think I'm going to bow down and accept abortionism, feminism, homosexualism, global warming, illegal alien lawbreakers, gun control, asset forfeiture, socialism, tyranny, totalitarianism, etc, etc, etc, just so some fancy New York liberal lawyer can become president from the Republican party?

Do you really expect me to do that?


TOPICS: Extended News; Free Republic; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections; US: Alaska; US: Arizona; US: New York; Your Opinion/Questions
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To: ansel12

No, really?! “My” site?


16,601 posted on 04/30/2007 3:57:11 PM PDT by DGray
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To: MountainFlower
'Let him who is without sin cast the first stone.'

I tried using that 'reason' thousands of posts ago and I was called a liberal and a cretin - and NOT by a banned poster. Perhaps, now it may succeed. Thanks.
16,602 posted on 04/30/2007 3:58:59 PM PDT by presently no screen name
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To: Knitting A Conundrum

Give Me Liberty Or Give Me Death
Patrick Henry, March 23, 1775.

No man thinks more highly than I do of the patriotism, as well as abilities, of the very worthy gentlemen who have just addressed the House. But different men often see the same subject in different lights; and, therefore, I hope it will not be thought disrespectful to those gentlemen if, entertaining as I do opinions of a character very opposite to theirs, I shall speak forth my sentiments freely and without reserve.

This is no time for ceremony. The questing before the House is one of awful moment to this country. For my own part, I consider it as nothing less than a question of freedom or slavery; and in proportion to the magnitude of the subject ought to be the freedom of the debate. It is only in this way that we can hope to arrive at truth, and fulfill the great responsibility which we hold to God and our country.

Should I keep back my opinions at such a time, through fear of giving offense, I should consider myself as guilty of treason towards my country, and of an act of disloyalty toward the Majesty of Heaven, which I revere above all earthly kings.

Mr. President, it is natural to man to indulge in the illusions of hope. We are apt to shut our eyes against a painful truth, and listen to the song of that siren till she transforms us into beasts.

Is this the part of wise men, engaged in a great and arduous struggle for liberty? Are we disposed to be of the number of those who, having eyes, see not, and, having ears, hear not, the things which so nearly concern their temporal salvation? For my part, whatever anguish of spirit it may cost, I am willing to know the whole truth; to know the worst, and to provide for it.

I have but one lamp by which my feet are guided, and that is the lamp of experience. I know of no way of judging of the future but by the past. And judging by the past, I wish to know what there has been in the conduct of the British ministry for the last ten years to justify those hopes with which gentlemen have been pleased to solace themselves and the House.

Is it that insidious smile with which our petition has been lately received? Trust it not, sir; it will prove a snare to your feet. Suffer not yourselves to be betrayed with a kiss.

Ask yourselves how this gracious reception of our petition comports with those warlike preparations which cover our waters and darken our land. Are fleets and armies necessary to a work of love and reconciliation? Have we shown ourselves so unwilling to be reconciled that force must be called in to win back our love? Let us not deceive ourselves, sir. These are the implements of war and subjugation; the last arguments to which kings resort.

I ask gentlemen, sir, what means this martial array, if its purpose be not to force us to submission? Can gentlemen assign any other possible motive for it? Has Great Britain any enemy, in this quarter of the world, to call for all this accumulation of navies and armies? No, sir, she has none.

They are meant for us: they can be meant for no other. They are sent over to bind and rivet upon us those chains which the British ministry have been so long forging.

And what have we to oppose to them? Shall we try argument? Sir, we have been trying that for the last ten years. Have we anything new to offer upon the subject? Nothing. We have held the subject up in every light of which it is capable; but it has been all in vain. Shall we resort to entreaty and humble supplication? What terms shall we find which have not been already exhausted? Let us not, I beseech you, sir, deceive ourselves.

Sir, we have done everything that could be done to avert the storm which is now coming on. We have petitioned; we have remonstrated; we have supplicated; we have prostrated ourselves before the throne, and have implored its interposition to arrest the tyrannical hands of the ministry and Parliament.

Our petitions have been slighted; our remonstrances have produced additional violence and insult; our supplications have been disregarded; and we have been spurned, with contempt, from the foot of the throne! In vain, after these things, may we indulge the fond hope of peace and reconciliation. There is no longer any room for hope.

If we wish to be free— if we mean to preserve inviolate those inestimable privileges for which we have been so long contending—if we mean not basely to abandon the noble struggle in which we have been so long engaged, and which we have pledged ourselves never to abandon until the glorious object of our contest shall be obtained—we must fight!

I repeat it, sir, we must fight!

An appeal to arms and to the God of hosts is all that is left us!

They tell us, sir, that we are weak; unable to cope with so formidable an adversary. But when shall we be stronger? Will it be the next week, or the next year? Will it be when we are totally disarmed, and when a British guard shall be stationed in every house?

Shall we gather strength by irresolution and inaction?

Shall we acquire the means of effectual resistance by lying supinely on our backs and hugging the delusive phantom of hope, until our enemies shall have bound us hand and foot?

Sir, we are not weak if we make a proper use of those means which the God of nature hath placed in our power. The millions of people, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us.

Besides, sir, we shall not fight our battles alone. There is a just God who presides over the destinies of nations, and who will raise up friends to fight our battles for us. The battle, sir, is not to the strong alone; it is to the vigilant, the active, the brave.

Besides, sir, we have no election. If we were base enough to desire it, it is now too late to retire from the contest. There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! Our chains are forged! Their clanking may be heard on the plains of Boston! The war is inevitable—and let it come! I repeat it, sir, let it come.

It is in vain, sir, to extenuate the matter. Gentlemen may cry, Peace, Peace— but there is no peace. The war is actually begun! The next gale that sweeps from the north will bring to our ears the clash of resounding arms! Our brethren are already in the field!

Why stand we here idle?

What is it that gentlemen wish?

What would they have?

Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God!

I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!


16,603 posted on 04/30/2007 3:59:30 PM PDT by EternalVigilance ("A Republic, if you can keep it.")
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To: Miss Marple
"For example, I never knew about the Wideawakes movement, although I had pretty good American history teachers."

And I won't mention that you live in the home (state) of the Wideawakes movement.

16,604 posted on 04/30/2007 3:59:41 PM PDT by CWOJackson
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To: Chena
The high road is closer to God.

This comment reminded me of something I read once, and which I immediately took to heart: When there are people at odds who shouldn't be, the responsibility of healing the void lies with the one who has the greater vision.
16,605 posted on 04/30/2007 4:00:58 PM PDT by mutley
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To: Kevmo

“Are You Addicted to Free Republic?”

Yes...so I’m past step 1 (lol) :) No plans to take any more steps!


16,606 posted on 04/30/2007 4:01:08 PM PDT by jedward (Mission '08 - Take back the House & Senate. No Negotiations...No Prisoners.)
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To: rbmillerjr

“Some who don’t have FR’s interests at heart will try to reopen the wounds from this battle. Let’s not let them succeed.”

True, but as most of them settle into their new homes, they will leave us alone.

On the site I’m following, there is already pressure from some of the members asking the banned ones to let it go and try to commit to the new site.

It has been a very constructive week for everyone.


16,607 posted on 04/30/2007 4:01:33 PM PDT by ansel12 ((America, love it ,or at least give up your home citizenship before accepting ours too.))
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To: CWOJackson

LOL! That just goes to show you how what you think are good teachers are simply mediocre. Flashy talk and interesting presentation do not make a good teacher ()or President) despite what some would think.


16,608 posted on 04/30/2007 4:01:47 PM PDT by Miss Marple (Prayers for Jemian's son,: Lord, please keep him safe and bring him home .)
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To: RunningWolf
In the last few weeks I have come...

YES!! Good news, RW!
16,609 posted on 04/30/2007 4:02:21 PM PDT by presently no screen name
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To: rbmillerjr; Jim Robinson
Thanks Jim. I think it was time. There has been alot more in common on this thread lately than not in common. Most of the disagreement has not been about candidates but the celebration or mourning of the former Freepers. Some who don’t have FR’s interests at heart will try to reopen the wounds from this battle. Let’s not let them succeed.

Good points RB, I freely admit that I was one of the celebrators when the dearly departed left this site, I suppose my perceived lack of proper 'respect for the dead' is due to the fact that those individuals who are no longer with us on FR are in fact, alive and well, breathing oxygen, living their lives just as they did before, still online, still doing everything they did before with the exception of logging in to (and attempting to disrupt) Free Republic. I had one poster admonish me that we should 'mourn' the departure of these former Freepers, and to me that is the height of disrespect to the TRULY dead, to those who REALLY die every day, whose families will never see them again, whose children will grow up without them, whose spouses will sleep in an empty bed for the years to come. THAT is what we ought to be mourning, if there is mourning to be done.

As for what has happened in this thread, some are still here, some are gone. But ALL are still actually alive and living on this Earth, i.e. "life goes on".

Now you hit the nail on the head when you said that those who 'don't have FR's interest at heart will be trying to reopen wounds' and in the months ahead you can be sure that someone will go digging around in the debris tray of the FR Bug Zapper Thread looking for handy posts, comments, etc., and those who employ that gambit will be easily recognized for the post-Zapper trolls they are. Hopefully, that won't be tolerated for one second.

The battle is over. FR is the winner. The website is a better place because of it, and we all owe JimRob a gigantic 'thank you' for having the guts to do what had to be done.
16,610 posted on 04/30/2007 4:03:36 PM PDT by mkjessup (Jan 20, 2009 - "We Don't Know. Where Rudy Went. Just Glad He's Not. The President. Burma Shave.")
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To: Mom MD; WKB
It was/is more than that, and I never knew it could happen. Words cannot describe and it is so personal, so I use the least descriptive words possible. It is all true, and now I understand the importance of a Pastor, because for the two most pivotal events of my life he led me towards and guided me thru them

Salute

16,611 posted on 04/30/2007 4:08:20 PM PDT by RunningWolf (2-1 Cav 1975)
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To: Miss Marple
I never knew about the Wideawakes movement although I had pretty good American history teachers.

Me neither! Is Ivan giving history lessons - or the soon to be Dr. Ivan? All the best to him.
16,612 posted on 04/30/2007 4:09:01 PM PDT by presently no screen name
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To: L,TOWM

No, it wasn’t you who said the A$$wipe word, it was the owner. So the comment about pooping on the carpet takes an entirely different plane.

I meant those trying to force laws as they “should be” before they’re actually passed. Harrassment in particular of anyone who might be obeying all federal and state laws but not your own personal ethical laws.

If you can convince enough people that your way is better, then great - we do live in a representative democracy, and if the majority elect leaders who change things, then would you want me harrassing those obeying the new laws?

I don’t believe that you can convince the majority that a candidate that is unknown with the exception of a handful of the religious right can win a general election but heck go ahead and try. Don’t try to take down someone who may end up being the party favorite, however, by swatting down anyone who might like him. What’s so bad about your guy that you have to tear mine down to make any headway?


16,613 posted on 04/30/2007 4:10:12 PM PDT by Spyder
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To: Miss Marple

I never knew about the history of the Wideawakes movement either. Well, perhaps I should say, I don’t REMEMBER having learned it. LOL I also didn’t know that MadIvan was working on a doctorate in American politics. No wonder he’s such an intelligent person to talk to.


16,614 posted on 04/30/2007 4:10:18 PM PDT by Chena (Why settle for less when you could have the best! Fred Thompson for President!)
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To: Chena; All

“God bless our troops!!!”

Amen!!


16,615 posted on 04/30/2007 4:10:41 PM PDT by stephenjohnbanker ( Hunter/Thompson/Thompson/Hunter in 08! Or Rudy/Hillary if you want to murder conservatism)
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To: mutley
This comment reminded me of something I read once, and which I immediately took to heart: When there are people at odds who shouldn't be, the responsibility of healing the void lies with the one who has the greater vision.I've never heard that before. Thank you so much for sharing that. :)
16,616 posted on 04/30/2007 4:11:44 PM PDT by Chena (Why settle for less when you could have the best! Fred Thompson for President!)
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To: mutley
This comment reminded me of something I read once, and which I immediately took to heart: When there are people at odds who shouldn't be, the responsibility of healing the void lies with the one who has the greater vision.

I've never heard that before. Thank you so much for sharing that. :)

16,617 posted on 04/30/2007 4:12:02 PM PDT by Chena (Why settle for less when you could have the best! Fred Thompson for President!)
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To: Chena

Well, Chena, there is a lot to learn for all of us. Hopefully at some point posters will realize that they don’t have all of the answers.


16,618 posted on 04/30/2007 4:14:43 PM PDT by Miss Marple (Prayers for Jemian's son,: Lord, please keep him safe and bring him home .)
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To: Spyder

You have to take charge of what should be rather than what is handed to you. In this case, conservatives have time and opportunity to help select someone that has the values and principles that bring about a better America. Right now we are being handed two candidates: Rudy and McCain. Neither are a conservatives best choice because of the ifs. We have time. We can do better. Rolling over to the MSM, the band-wagoners, pundits, frightened, and the conciliators does nobody on the conservative side any justice. Why disregard any conservative values for a quick fix?


16,619 posted on 04/30/2007 4:17:39 PM PDT by commonguymd (Move it to the right)
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To: presently no screen name; Mom MD; WKB; little jeremiah
I said a prayer last Sunday 04-22-2007, and it happened. On Wensday 04-18-2007 was when I put my faith in him.

I had seen glimpses of him my whole life, but I could never commit because I was afraid of his tests. Now none of his tests scare me, now I am only afraid that I lose my sight of him (however dim my sight may be)

Many things went away from me in those days, however I now know that not not all things went away, and those rooms I will have to clean myself :-)

16,620 posted on 04/30/2007 4:17:43 PM PDT by RunningWolf (2-1 Cav 1975)
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