Posted on 12/14/2001 7:39:41 AM PST by newsperson999
huge explosions!!
Rev. 22: 18 & 19.
And now I'll not offer any more of God's Word for you to spit on and defile. Rather, I say "Get thee behind me!"
Reason.
If God created me... he created me with this precious faculty.
And I would think, that he would expect me to use it.
And in applying reason to the question at hand, I ask myself whether a God who was loving, benevolent, and who valued his creation, could POSSIBLY pass a judgement of eternal torment over an object of his own creation, whom he dearly loved and cherished, simply because the earthly experience of that person, did not include the opportunity to hear and evaluate the acceptance of Jesus Christ as lord and savior.
And reason dictates that the answer to such a question, is no.
A God who passed a judgement of eternal torment over an object of his own creation, simply because that person never heard of Jesus, would not be a loving and benevolent God at all.
He would be a cruel and indifferent God.
Hence either God does not exist... or those who claim to be his most profound devotees.... profoundly misunderstand him.
Unanswerable, and therefore insignificant.
If not, why engage?
The vast majority of the conversation has nothing whatsoever to do with the subject.
But I'd have to ask... is that me?
Or is it them?
I have read this thread with great enjoyment, I see a historical version of myself in each person who posted. At some point in my life, I have had just about all of these opinions, as I was raised by agnostics, was an unbeliever, yet converted to Catholicism at age 30 after events in my life proved without a doubt, to me, to be evidence of God.
I don't disclose this evidence, as whether you believe it or not is not relevant to my belief or yours, it was only meant for my own conversion and not meant to be evidence for others to believe. No one pointed out this evidence to me, the experiences were overwhelming to me and sent me seeking for answers to a local church, I believe there are others here who have had similar experiences.
Which leads me to wonder what evidence God will be sending your way. It is up to you to see it, a big hint of evidence of God in your life...your posts here. I believe God is behind whatever it is that is inspiring you to write to us here...it is a simple look at CAUSE AND EFFECT:
Cause: Question belief in God
Effect: Believers post witness and Word of God.
If God couldn't get you to physically attend church, what other method could God use to get His Word to you? I see it happening right here. You are the one sheep that he leaves the other 99 to go find. Pretty cool.
Aha! You didn't provide this bit of information before. Aqua-Velva (also Hai Karate and Old Spice) contain deostat, a theological blocking agent. And I always thought it was just an old wives tale. I, on the other hand, often smell of Hoppe's No.9, which removes lead but clearly reveals the divine origin of the universe.
Well, my question would be, "Did they really turn and commit their whole lives to Jesus?" There is a cost in following Christ. That cost...your life. Jesus asked who would be willing to lose their lives take up their cross and follow Him. The parable of the "sower" would be another example of why there are those who do not continue to follow Christ.
As for the similar testimonies from those from other faiths who have escaped the same bondage, I cannot truly respond because I have not heard of any such testimonies.
Aber mein Deutsch ist nicht sehr gut.
. ...As I stated earier, I would honestly be open to the notion of God, should I find sufficient rational grounds to accept his existence. (Those of us who do accept the "notion of God" are irrational?)
The whole notion of religious faith, is predicated on the willful suspension of disbelief.
We are asked to accept through testimony and mutual reinforcement, that otherwise unbelievable things... magical things... are real.
And this faith is called virtuous.
You absolutely have the right to talk till your keyboard falls apart. But don't try to impress those of us you have faith that your thinly disquised contempt is civility.
That's pretty brutal from someone I considered a friend.
But as you wish.
For what it's worth though, I do not hold people of faith in contempt. I simply don't share their faith. I'm not calling people idiots. I'm not telling them they're inferior. I'm not spitting in their eye (which is frankly far better treatment than I generally recieve).
I am discussing my beliefs. It is impossible to discuss my beliefs, without stating my beliefs, and why I hold them. I can manange to do this with a good number of people, and they in turn, share their beliefs with me. And they do so in good faith and civility.
But some people are clearly incapable of this. If I specify my beliefs to them, they immediately precieve it as a personal attack, and proceed to behave most irrationally, and most rudely.
I have come to expect it from some. They show up in nearly every thread. I did not however, expect from you.
More's the pity.
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