Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

To: Jason_b
"No State shall...make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts..." This is one of my favorites. It basically says that if I owe the State money, I must pay in gold or silver coin, no substitutes, no gold/silver certificates, just coin. How does it compare to what the FRNs in your pocket read? This note is legal tender for all debts public and private. If that is not a contradiction, I don't know what is.

It's not a contradiction at all. Article I, section 10, says that a state may not make anything but gold or silver legal tender (meaning that a state may not pass a law saying that you must accept repayment of a debt in paper money if you're unwilling to accept it). Congress, on the other hand, is not placed under any such restriction; it is authorized in Art I, sec. 8,to "coin Money, [and] regulate the Value thereof," without any mention of gold or silver. Thus, the power to establish paper money was one of those powers (like the power to make treaties, raise armies, etc.) which was given to the federal government but withheld from the states.

70 posted on 04/03/2002 11:27:02 AM PST by Lurking Libertarian
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 38 | View Replies ]


To: Lurking Libertarian
Wandering a touch off topic, if California ever tells me that I have to accept "pollution credits" as compensation for any taking of my property...I will simply cite Article I, Section 10, and demand payment in gold or silvr coin.
72 posted on 04/03/2002 11:34:12 AM PST by Poohbah
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 70 | View Replies ]

To: Lurking Libertarian
Please follow this link, Lurking Libertarian.

link

231 posted on 04/03/2002 5:20:57 PM PST by Jason_b
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 70 | View Replies ]

To: Lurking Libertarian
The power to "coin Money" meant to form a standard weight planchet of valuable alloy of gold or silver and emboss it with certification of that standard.
233 posted on 04/03/2002 5:27:49 PM PST by GregoryFul
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 70 | View Replies ]

To: Lurking Libertarian
Thus, the power to establish paper money was one of those powers (like the power to make treaties, raise armies, etc.) which was given to the federal government but withheld from the states.

Where in the Constitution is such a power granted? By the tenth amendment, the Federal government only has such powers as explicitly granted, while the states only have such restrictions as explicitly laid out. IOW, for the feds, if it's not expressly permitted, it's forbidden, while for the states, if it's not expressly forbidden it is permitted. Within the limits of their own Constitutions of course.

The Constitution created a stronger federal government than existed under the Aricles of Confederation, but not an all powerfull one, rather one strictly limited in its powers and purpose.

287 posted on 04/03/2002 8:37:16 PM PST by El Gato
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 70 | View Replies ]

To: Lurking Libertarian
It's not a contradiction at all. Article I, section 10, says that a state may not make anything but gold or silver legal tender (meaning that a state may not pass a law saying that you must accept repayment of a debt in paper money if you're unwilling to accept it). Congress, on the other hand, is not placed under any such restriction; it is authorized in Art I, sec. 8,to "coin Money, [and] regulate the Value thereof," without any mention of gold or silver. Thus, the power to establish paper money was one of those powers (like the power to make treaties, raise armies, etc.) which was given to the federal government but withheld from the states.
OK, riddle me this.

First, you are correct that Article 1 Section 8 gives the Congress the power to "To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures." There's no restriction on what they can coin into money. They could pass a law that says all United States coins will be pressed from meadow muffins and road apples. That would be entirely constitutional as far as Article 1 Section 8 goes.

Now, tell me where in Article 1 Section 8 the Congress is granted the power to make anything at all legal tender? Where does the Congress have the power to pass a law saying that you must accept repayment of a debt in paper money if you're unwilling to accept it. In short, please explain the constitutional foundation for the text "This note is legal tender for all debts, public and private" that's printed on every Federal Reserve Note.

You can't say that the founder's didn't know about the power to make legal tender laws. They placed explicit restrictions on states as to what they can make "tender in payment of debts."

You can't say that the power to "coin money" is the same as the power to "make tender". Clearly, minting coins and setting their weights and value is different from using the force of law to compel people to accept any form of "money" as payment for debts.

Further, if it were the same power, then Article 1 Section10 forbids states from coining money. Why does that section also contain a further restriction forbidding them from making "any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts". If the power to make legal tender laws is part of the power to coin money, then the prohibition of states coining money would be sufficient. There would be no need to also prohibit states from making anything other than silver or gold coins "tender in payment of debts."

So, while the Congress can make paper money, no state has the power to accept it or to force people within their state to accept paper money for payment of debts. The states are explicitly prohibited from making anything other than gold or silver coins "legal tender." Further, the United States Congress was never granted the power to force either states or individuals to accept paper money (or meadow muffins or anything else) for payment of debts. The congress has no power to declare legal tender according to Article 1 Section 8. And, according to the 10th amendment, that means that the right is reserved to the states or the people.

Where am I wrong?

665 posted on 04/12/2002 3:47:52 PM PDT by cc2k
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 70 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson