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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
I know I am going to be hatefully flamed by some men, but I have had a problem with men who disown children who are born withing the marriage who are not their bio kin. The children born within a marriage belong to the marriage and the parents legally have been through the ages, their marital mother and father. As the fact that father hood is more than a sperm donation, father hood is instead a legal entity. if your wife has a child while you are married to her, you should be responsible for it. That child needs a father, and you, sir, are it. that is the hallmark of being a grown up.
2 posted on 04/11/2002 6:02:51 AM PDT by mlmr
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To: mlmr
...The children born within a marriage belong to the marriage and the parents legally have been through the ages, their marital mother and father. As the fact that father hood is more than a sperm donation, father hood is instead a legal entity. if your wife has a child while you are married to her, you should be responsible for it. That child needs a father, and you, sir, are it. that is the hallmark of being a grown up.

I would argue that if infidelity is the cause then the legalities of the marraige are in question. After all, is not infidelity illegal if in no other sense that the moral one? And is not the continued deceit a detracting factor from the marriage? While I think I understand your argument, I disagree with the implicit premise that the woman has no responsibility to the relationship and that the father caught in such has the burden of raising another man's child.

3 posted on 04/11/2002 6:13:10 AM PDT by Poseidon
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To: mlmr
I know I am going to be hatefully flamed by some men, but I have had a problem with men who disown children who are born withing the marriage who are not their bio kin. The children born within a marriage belong to the marriage and the parents legally have been through the ages, their marital mother and father. As the fact that father hood is more than a sperm donation, father hood is instead a legal entity. if your wife has a child while you are married to her, you should be responsible for it. That child needs a father, and you, sir, are it. that is the hallmark of being a grown up.

Wouldn't that encourage infidelity from both partners? If I can go have an affair with a married woman I don't have to fear the consequences, her husband will be responsible for my actions. Wrong! The hallmark of being a grown up is taking responsibility for your OWN actions.

6 posted on 04/11/2002 6:31:32 AM PDT by AUgrad
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To: mlmr
The children born within a marriage belong to the marriage

Is it really a marriage if one or both of the partner's is sleeping around?
7 posted on 04/11/2002 7:07:54 AM PDT by babyface00
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To: mlmr
That child needs a father, and you, sir, are it. that is the hallmark of being a grown up.

A man should pay the costs for a child not biologically his own only if (a) it's legally adopted by him or (b) he has custody.

Why force a man to pay for his unfaithful wife's sin? Why rub salt continually in his wounds just because he's the man. Why keep reminding him of his ex-wife's treachery every single month? She is the one who sinned, she should be the one who pays.

[of course I do not accept the concept of no-fault divorce either. Someone caused the marriage to fail, they should be the ones to suffer from it]

God Save America (Please)

9 posted on 04/11/2002 7:26:18 AM PDT by John O
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To: mlmr
What you're saying makes so little sense that I'm just going to assume you're joking and leave it at that.
17 posted on 04/11/2002 9:13:26 AM PDT by Psycho_Bunny
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To: mlmr
It's A$$H@!&$ like you, who have created this biased legal system against men.
21 posted on 04/11/2002 9:32:04 AM PDT by Osprey
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To: mlmr
"I know I am going to be hatefully flamed by some men, but I have had a problem with men who disown children who are born withing the marriage who are not their bio kin. The children born within a marriage belong to the marriage and the parents legally have been through the ages, their marital mother and father."

What this proves conclusively is that you are an idiot. A married woman BETRAYS HER MARRIAGE VOWS (and contract), screws another man, gets pregnant, LIES to the man she is married to about the parentage of the child, and you think it is just fine?? GIVE ME A BREAK.

IF the HUSBAND of said woman, KNOWLINGLY ADOPTS the illegitimate child, THEN you have a point--in any other case, a rank injustice is being done to the innocent male involved.

To hell with the previous legal precedent--back then the tools to prove parentage with certainty didn't exist---now they do--and it is time to change the legal system to match todays knowledge. The legitimate course is to use the DNA evidence to FIND THE BIOLOGICAL FATHER and force HIM to pay child support.

22 posted on 04/11/2002 9:33:36 AM PDT by Wonder Warthog
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To: mlmr
That child needs a father, and you, sir, are it.

***BBBZZZTTTTT!!!!*** Thank you for playing.

The correct answer, of course, is "the man who made half of the child is it".

24 posted on 04/11/2002 9:39:32 AM PDT by steve-b
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To: mlmr
As the fact that father hood is more than a sperm donation,

This was true until even Dr. Laura started calling men merely 'sperm donors'.

55 posted on 04/11/2002 10:13:27 AM PDT by beowolf
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To: mlmr
if your wife has a (another mans) child while you are married to her, you should be responsible for it.

I think you are wrong in the extreme.

Are you willing to put the shoe on the other foot? Should a wife be responsible financially, and personally, taking care of the child etc, for the children a man sires outside of his marriage with another women?

76 posted on 04/11/2002 10:30:49 AM PDT by RJL
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To: mlmr
that is the hallmark of being a grown up.

No, that is the hallmark of being a patsie.

79 posted on 04/11/2002 10:35:00 AM PDT by StriperSniper
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To: mlmr
If the woman gets another father for the baby other than her husband, the other father should pay for support, and if the woman lies about who is the father she should go to jail. The married husband should then have the option of keeping the child while the mother is in jail, and receiving child support from the bio father. (This IS about the well being of the children, right?)
85 posted on 04/11/2002 10:41:22 AM PDT by Mr. K
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To: mlmr
That child needs a father, and you, sir, are it. that is the hallmark of being a grown up.

I have some experence on this issue. Let me just say that the hallmark of being grown up is LIVING UP TO THE TRUTH AND BEING RESPONSABLE FOR YOUR OWN ACTIONS.

What if your husband choose to have a child outside your marriage and his Mistress died during child birth? If your husband divorces you at a later date, should you be forced to pay child support? I somehow think your answer would be no.

Those who would hold others responsable for their own actions create a situation for the child that is a lie. Let us live and die with the truth.
103 posted on 04/11/2002 11:14:40 AM PDT by Honcho
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To: mlmr
I know I am going to be hatefully flamed by some men

Could that be your consience calling?

but I have had a problem with men who disown children who are born withing the marriage who are not their bio kin.

I have a huge problem with adultery and fraud. I have a huge problem with conscienceless, treacherous women. I have a huge problem with working, suffering, and struggling all my life to get to a financial position to afford a stay-at-home wife and mother, so I can achieve my lifelong goal of having kids of my own -- only to have her betray and nullify an entire lifetime of work by bearing other men's children and passing them off as mine. Why on earth should I have ever gotten a job, gotten an education, saved, invested, and just plain SUFFERED all those years, only to have my investment STOLEN by cuckoldry?

That child needs a father, and you, sir, are it.

No. The adulterous lover is the father.

that is the hallmark of being a grown up.

No, being FAIR is the hallmark of being a grown up.

Your profile says, you're a homeschooling family and a mother of four. I'm shocked that such a person would take such a wicked position. Tell ya what, have your HUSBAND read this thread and see what he says.

117 posted on 04/11/2002 12:25:53 PM PDT by Rytwyng
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To: mlmr
That child needs a father, and you, sir, are it. that is the hallmark of being a grown up.

That is a crock of excrement. Under your value system, then, I should be allowed to randomly assign kids for your husband to take care of. "You, sir, are it!"

126 posted on 04/11/2002 6:13:36 PM PDT by krb
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To: mlmr
AH, YES---"A Grownup!!"

I guess I'm "old-Fashioned;" I was ALWAYS TAUGHT that a Man & Woman made a SACRED Contract--Legally, Spiritually, Morally Binding--when they agreed to "Marry!"

BOTH Parties agree to acccept their new "partner,"--"As IS!!"(including pre-existing children.)

"Codicils" to a Marriage Contract that allow either Partner to produce children OUTSIDE OF the "Marriage Family" are rare-to-nonexistant!

If a Woman in a "Marriage Contract" elects to VIOLATE the contract to have a child by an unsuspecting "Sperm Donor," the "Husband" has NO OBLIGATION to work to support the "Bastard!" (The term, "Bastard" was INVENTED for this very situation!)

If a Woman in a Marriage Contract produces a "Bastard Child," SHE (AND the Irresponsible "Father") is SOLELY REPONSIBLE for the welfare of the "Bastard!"

DUE to the Nature of Human Reproductive Biology, the "Mother" is nearly COMPLETELY (except for Rape) responsible for the identity of the father of her children!

NO "Marriage Vows," or "Marriage Contract" require a "Husband" to support a "Bastard!!"

I CAN'T BELIEVE ANYONE who understands the precepts of Western Civilization is IGNORANT of the BASIC RULES of western Marriage!!

In OUR culture, "DAD's" are EXPECTED to support "their" children; they support the children of "others" BY CHOICE ALONE!

If an "Errant Wife" elects to create children with a "Lover;" the "wife" & the "Lover" are the "Responsible Parties," NOT the "Cuckolded Husband!"

DNA DOES COUNT!

Doc

131 posted on 04/11/2002 6:31:29 PM PDT by Doc On The Bay
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To: mlmr
"I know I am going to be hatefully flamed by some men, but I have had a problem with men who disown children who are born withing the marriage who are not their bio kin. The children born within a marriage belong to the marriage and the parents legally have been through the ages, their marital mother and father. As the fact that father hood is more than a sperm donation, father hood is instead a legal entity. if your wife has a child while you are married to her, you should be responsible for it. That child needs a father, and you, sir, are it. that is the hallmark of being a grown up."

Gee. That sounds swell.

Allow me tell you about "the law", then.

A young woman gets pregnant in, say, Bangor, Maine. She manages to get a phone book for, say, Des Moines, Iowa. She picks out a man's name. She tells the local "child support" authorities that "yes, THIS is the baby's father". A hearing is scheduled; the "father" may or may not be notified. If he fails to appear in court, by default............he's slapped with child support. How much? Based on the court's "best guess" of what he makes.

Think that's unlikely or far-fetched? Think it's impossible? Think again.........and welcome to the real world.

141 posted on 04/12/2002 5:10:46 AM PDT by RightOnline
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To: mlmr
Many people would state that the marriage is over the moment it is desecrated by the act of infidelity. Story over. Now if one feels compelled to help the woman and child, that's a different story, and stranger things have happened, but the biological father of the child should be the one held responsible, not the victim of the infidelity unless they choose to be so.

Those who feel compelled to break the bonds of honor are just as liable and must bear the responsibility for their actions.

As for those who would feel compelled to continue such a relationship, there are plenty of other people out there waiting to abuse you, why not try some variety?

I'd be just as compassionatte about the poor child as anyone, but that's simply not the issue here. It's just as inhumane to condemn a person to endure the burdon of such a relationship once it has been destroyed by such an event.

At any rate the whole scenario makes a wonderful arguement for people to deeply consider and take the commitment necessary to make a marraige work very seriously.

143 posted on 04/12/2002 5:16:15 AM PDT by Caipirabob
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To: mlmr
The biological father should have both joint residential custody and 50% of financial obligations.
151 posted on 04/13/2002 2:22:32 PM PDT by The Giant Apricots
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