Posted on 05/13/2002 9:04:58 AM PDT by Vidalia
Edited on 05/07/2004 6:18:29 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]
Certainly one doesn't challenge the diagnosis made by a medical professional. The Advancement Committee's job is to decide on the basis of that diagnosis and on the advice of the professionals, what requirements are impossible for a Scout to pass, and what to substitute for it. If you have specific knowledge of a kid getting a pass on swimming because he can't read properly, I'd like to hear it.
And I'd still like to know what you mean by the BSA "liberalizing" the requirements.
Yes, one hour left.
Page 18, BSHB, First Edition: "No deviation from above requirements will be permitted unless in extraordinary cases, such as physical disability ..." So from the beginning, there was the ability to get subsitutions for physical disability. It's true enough, though, that it isn't until the current edition (the 11th) that you see "physical or mental" specified. The editions up to 9 said "physical". The 10th said "medical", which conceivably could cover both.
In looking though my collection, I do see this on page 11 of the 4th edition, 1945: "Scouting is neither military nor anti-military". Doesn't sound like they're considering themselves a preparatory organization for the military, and I would think the military was in good repute in 1945.
If you had matched up the old and new requirements next to each other, how come you were telling us that the old requirement of tying 3 kinds of lashings was an example of how the BSA has "dumbed down" the requirements, when a side-by-side comparison shows that the requirement is still in Scouting?
Hmm, more later....
Then.1968. Page 231, Requirement 3. Lash poles together with SHEAR, SQUARE AND DIAGONAL lashings.
Big difference, Now you have a choice to make a useful camp gadget. THEN you HAD to exhibit your skills by tying THREE different lashings, with no choices. Big Difference. Scouting is dumbed down. Sorry Try again.
Here's a quote of the BSA's guidelines on alternate requirements for Tenderfoot, Second Class, and First Class. A good website overall for Scouting, by the way. While there certainly isn't a statement in it that "Dyslexia can't be used to get out of the swimming requirements", it's my opinion you would have to stretch the statements in here pretty far to get to that point. I personally don't believe that very many people in Scouting, all the way through the District Advancement Committee, are going to do so. You are obviously of a different opinion. I guess we're going to have to agree to disagree, since neither of our positions can be proved through explicit language here.
I already tried in post #130. To repeat myself (I've added in the main req # now):"7 b. Demonstrate tying the timber hitch and clove hitch and their use in square, shear, and diagonal lashings by joining two or more poles or staves together. 7 c. Use lashing to make a useful camp gadget." What's changed? Except to add having to make something useful, not just demonstrate the three specific lashings by joining two poles together.
I looked a bit in my old handbooks last night. Originally Civics MB was required for Eagle. That became Citizenship in the Community and Citizenship in the Nation down the line. I have to see where Citizenship in the World was added in. I know it was in the previous (10th edition) handbook from experience, but I didn't have time last night to see if it was in the 9th or 8th.
I don't have any cites to offer at the moment, but I'm pretty sure that B-P intended all Scouts, all over the world, to be brothers. While he certainly intended Scouts to serve their country, whether in that country's military or not, he also viewed Scouting as linking people together across national borders as well. I'll have to research that a bit. But viewing Scouting as a world fraternity, with obligations to all nations, is not something that was tacked on recently by liberal shenanigans. I think that I'll probably find something supporting this by searching for speeches by BP at various World Jamborees.
Here's a link to the requirements for Citizenship in the World MB. I'm curious as to whether or not you feel any of these requirements evince a liberal bent at National.
Both, you did see post 127?
What is your opinion on the Cit. in World MB?
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