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1 posted on 05/30/2002 1:35:44 PM PDT by knighthawk
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To: MizSterious; rebdov; Nix 2; viadexter; green lantern; BeOSUser; itsahoot; Brad's Gramma; dreadme...
Ping
2 posted on 05/30/2002 1:36:36 PM PDT by knighthawk
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To: knighthawk
wait til Bush asks India to be an observer at NATO. Just kidding!
3 posted on 05/30/2002 1:42:23 PM PDT by swarthyguy
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To: knighthawk
If the United States concludes that this alliance is useless to it, it will replace it with bilateral arrangements with important powers such as Russia and China, with which countries America's relations are more cordial than they have been for many decades.

In that case, the fleeting gratitude of the Iraqis, Iranians and like-minded states will be a very poor substitute to Europe for the formal friendship of the United States.

Good analysis. But I'm afraid, with the possible exception of Great Britain, the writing is on the wall for this already. And Great Britain is soon going to be forced into a hard choice between the EU and alliance with the U.S. I don't see that this forcing will come at the prompting of the U.S., but rather from the EU side.

5 posted on 05/30/2002 1:48:22 PM PDT by Snuffington
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To: knighthawk
Bump! The only reason we're still allied with the Europeans is so many Americans like to visit the continent. The Europeans are wet and weak, jealous of our power and eager to bell the American cat, but too afraid to do anything!
7 posted on 05/30/2002 1:53:58 PM PDT by CatoRenasci
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To: knighthawk
Europe has never had any discernible Middle Eastern policy except to await the American position and then take a stance more favourable to the Arabs. This may sometimes be objectively correct policy, but it hasn't contributed much to the Middle Eastern peace process.

Exquisite.

I think, though, that Lord Black is underrepresenting the desire of EU proponents to construct precisely the sort of military and economic parity that he mentioned. And that should give its individual member countries a bit of pause, because

Given the provocation and America's immense military power, I know of no country that has ever acted with more conspicuous moderation and effectiveness.

...because if the EU proponents succeed unconstrained, this power will be in the hands of folks who seem to try to set the world on fire every couple of generations. Or, as Tom Lehrer once reminded us satirically,
"We've got the missiles, peace to determine,
And one of the fingers on the button will be German."

8 posted on 05/30/2002 1:55:59 PM PDT by Billthedrill
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To: knighthawk
Outstanding piece. I do think, however, that the European governments are much closer to the US postition than the Euro press, especially now that the socialists are out or on their way out in many countries.
10 posted on 05/30/2002 1:58:43 PM PDT by colorado tanker
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To: knighthawk
Very interesting that this piece by the publisher Conrad Black should appear just as the annual meeting of the Bilderbergers starts. I have a feeling Black is going to be making the same case at the meeting. I wonder how much agreement he will find.
11 posted on 05/30/2002 1:59:08 PM PDT by aristeides
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To: knighthawk
Britain is not what many of us consider "Europe" proper. And thank God for that. I have said it before and I'll say it again, the EU is the modern equivalent realization of Hitler and the Third Reich's dream of a "united Europe" under a "new" world order, not unlike that which typified the former Soviet Empire. Who will run this EU neo-empire? Probably the same national alliances that either cooperated or were a part of the National Socialist confederation of Germany and Austria, with Switzerland doing the banking, France and southern Europe doing the slacking, and third world immigrant trash doing the "labor" while eagerly supporting the bastardization of entire European civilizations they detest anyhow. I suppose National Socialism has finally found a politicaly correct niche from which it can proceed. Even Hitler's open declaration of warfare would be preferable to this slimy, attritional disintergration.
15 posted on 05/30/2002 2:11:09 PM PDT by rebelsoldier
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To: knighthawk
We need to get out of NATO while the getting is good.
19 posted on 05/30/2002 2:27:27 PM PDT by Maceman
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To: knighthawk
I like Great Britain and think they're still very good friends and allies. I still remember they played the US National Athem at the changing of the guards to sympathize with us for 9-11. On the other hand, I agree with the author about the European mainlanders. Their biggest reaction to 9-11 was various forms of "The US needs to change its foreign policy so this doesn't happen again".
22 posted on 05/30/2002 3:09:30 PM PDT by TennesseeProfessor
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To: knighthawk
To Americans, and I say this uncritically and without comment, Europe has never had any discernible Middle Eastern policy except to await the American position and then take a stance more favourable to the Arabs.

GREAT line!

23 posted on 05/30/2002 3:12:30 PM PDT by facedown
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To: knighthawk
We should define the civilization and values that we share, extend NATO to all who share those values, and support each other unreservedly when those values are attacked, as they were on Sept. 11, 2001.

Well put.

27 posted on 05/30/2002 3:36:17 PM PDT by skeeter
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To: knighthawk; Orual; aculeus
Bump for an excellent column (as one would expect) by Lord Black.
31 posted on 05/30/2002 4:12:14 PM PDT by dighton
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To: knighthawk
If Europe's concept of alliance with America is of a great American St. Bernard dog which will take the risks and do the work, while Europe holds the leash and gives the instructions, this alliance will no longer function

I love this image and it's so accurate...the Europeans seem to have an attitude that America is a country of big dumb guys who are useful in emergencies but who can never be respected...it's a conceit born of an almost aristocratic, preening self-image...I live in NYC and I see all the young Europeans (Germans, French, and Scandinavians mostly) with their beautiful, stylish clothes and carefully dyed hair...they waltz around Manhattan like virtual magazine covers--all glitz, no subtance...not one of them is worth the life of a single fireman or ambulance attendant who ran into the WTC to save peoples' lives...they are useless people who try to feel important by embracing cliched popular causes and worrying about the poor over designer coffees and Galoises...they will be extinct one day if they continue to lead such irrelevant lives.

35 posted on 05/30/2002 5:31:24 PM PDT by foreshadowed at waco
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