Is the Jesus of Mormonism the Jesus of the Bible? (James White dialogs with Alma Allred.)

Is the Jesus of Mormonism the Jesus of the Bible?
________________________________________

No of course not...

Joey Smith, the inventor of Mormonism, rejected the LORD Jesus Christ of the Bible ...and everything that Jesus said...

and made up his own pagan religion..

161 posted on 09/14/2016 1:26:02 PM PDT by Tennessee Nana

Old Testament has some Aramaic

So you are maintaining that there are no books in the Bible that are written in Aramaic?

Is the God in the Old Testament the same God in the New Testament?

As I stated, your Bible knowledge is, um, fascinating.

162 posted on 09/14/2016 1:53:52 PM PDT by NoCmpromiz (John 14:6 is a non-pluralistic comment.)

Ah yes, I had forgotten this:

“Note he called even Jesus Jehovah:”

So much has been lost to “tradition”

Col 1
15The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16For in Him all things were created, things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities. All things were created through Him and for Him. 17He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together

Most certainly, most Christians attribute all of the above to the Father. However, the above text does not state that Jesus CREATED everything, only that creation was created through him and for him. Through what. Scripture indicates his voice.

163 posted on 09/14/2016 2:03:35 PM PDT by BornToBeAmerican (Dont forget Love)

I don’t follow? Where was I wrong? You appear to be mocking something in you imagination.

164 posted on 09/14/2016 2:17:47 PM PDT by WENDLE (hillary will never debate Trump. She Can't)

Not mocking. You are wrong. And it’s not in my imagination. Do some research. Or if you have, just maybe your sources are faulty..

Certainly a Bible scholar of your admitted expertise would know these things.

Are you 16 now? (since you claimed to be 15 a year ago..)

165 posted on 09/14/2016 2:43:41 PM PDT by NoCmpromiz (John 14:6 is a non-pluralistic comment.)

To: Gamecock; xzins

Pretty much nails the point, GC. At a fundamental level one cannot simply believe in Jesus as an abstract person with incorrect characteristics, be saved, and then have the blanks filled in and the errors corrected after the fact. Otherwise it would be perfectly acceptable to get people to confess faith in Jesus Corona so that God could then exercise His sovereignty over these "believers" and bring them to a right understanding of the real Jesus.

166 posted on 09/16/2016 10:36:58 AM PDT by Frumanchu (God's justice does not demand second chances)

To: Frumanchu; Gamecock

As always, we can hear the gospel from the writings of the Apostles or we can't. Jesus said when others believe in Him through their word they would be saved, too.

John 17: 20 “I do not pray for these alone, but also for those who will[e] believe in Me through their word; 21 that they all may be one, as You, Father, are in Me, and I in You; that they also may be one in Us, that the world may believe that You sent Me."

167 posted on 09/17/2016 6:51:05 AM PDT by xzins ( Free Republic Gives YOU a voice heard around the globe. Support the Freepathon!)

Most non-Mormon Christians believe that Jesus is a three in one, one in three, sometimes three but never one, sometimes one but never three personality disorder first identified in the Nicene Creed in 325 AD

While MORMON scripture states...

Trinity:

found in the Book of MORMON ----------- rejected in the Doctrines and Covenants

Book of Mormon:

Now Zeezrom said: Is there more than one God? And he answered, No. (Alma 11:28-29)

...and be arraigned before the bar of Christ the Son, and God the Father, and the Holy Spirit, which is one Eternal God, to be judged according to their works, whether they be good or whether they be evil. (Alma 11:44)

...doctrine of Christ, and the only and true doctrine of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost, which is one God, without end. Amen. (2 Nephi 31:21)

...praises with the choirs above, unto the Father, and unto the Son, and unto the Holy Ghost, which are one God, in a state of happiness which hath no end. (Mormon 7:7)

...power of God; and the Son, because of the flesh; thus becoming the Father and Son--And they are one God, yea, the very Eternal Father of heaven and of earth. And thus the flesh becoming subject to the Spirit, or the Son to the Father, being one God, (Mosiah 15:3-5)

...of Jared, that whoso should possess this land of promise, from that time henceforth and forever, should serve him, the true and only God, or they should be swept off when the fulness of his wrath should come upon them. (Ether 2:8)

"Behold, I am Jesus Christ the Son of God. I created the heavens and the earth, and all things that in them are. I was with the Father from the beginning. I am in the Father, and the Father in me; and in me hath the Father glorified his name." (3 Nephi 9:15)

"And again the Lord called others, and said unto them likewise; and he gave unto them power to baptize. And he said unto them: On this wise shall ye baptize; and there shall be no disputations among you. Verily I say unto you, that whoso repenteth of his sins through your words and desireth to be baptized in my name, on this wise shall ye baptize them--Behold, ye shall go down and stand in the water, and in my name shall ye baptize them. And now behold, these are the words which ye shall say, calling them by name, saying: Having authority given me of Jesus Christ, I baptize you in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. Amen. And then shall ye immerse them in the water, and come forth again out of the water. And after this manner shall ye baptize in my name; for behold, verily I say unto you, that the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Ghost are one; and I am in the Father, and the Father in me, and the Father and I are one...And thus will the Father bear record of me, and the Holy Ghost will bear record unto him of the Father and me; for the Father, and I, and the Holy Ghost are one." (3 Nephi 11:22-27, 36)

Doctrine and Covenants:

According to that which was ordained in the midst of the Council of the Eternal God of all other gods before this world was, that should be reserved unto the finishing and the end thereof, when every man shall enter into his eternal presence and into his immortal rest. (Section 121:32)

And again, verily I say unto you, if a man marry a wife, and make a covenant with her for time and for all eternity, if that covenant is not by me or by my word, which is my law, and is not sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise, through him whom I have anointed and appointed unto this power, then it is not valid neither of force when they are out of the world, because they are not joined by me, saith the Lord, neither by my word; when they are out of the world it cannot be received there, because the angels and the gods are appointed there, by whom they cannot pass; they cannot, therefore, inherit my glory; for my house is a house of order, saith the Lord God. And again, verily I say unto you, if a man marry a wife by my word, which is my law, and by the new and everlasting covenant, and it is sealed unto them by the Holy Spirit of promise, by him who is anointed, unto whom I have appointed this power and the keys of this priesthood; and it shall be said unto them--Ye shall come forth in the first resurrection; and if it be after the first resurrection, in the next resurrection; and shall inherit thrones, kingdoms, principalities, and powers, dominions, all heights and depths--then shall it be written in the Lamb's Book of Life, that he shall commit no murder whereby to shed innocent blood, and if ye abide in my covenant, and commit no murder whereby to shed innocent blood, it shall be done unto them in all things whatsoever my servant hath put upon them, in time, and through all eternity; and shall be of full force when they are out of the world; and they shall pass by the angels, and the gods, which are set there, to their exaltation and glory in all things, as hath been sealed upon their heads, which glory shall be a fulness and a continuation of the seeds forever and ever. Then shall they be gods, because they have no end; therefore shall they be from everlasting to everlasting, because they continue; then shall they be above all, because all things are subject unto them. Then shall they be gods, because they have all power, and the angels are subject unto them. (Section 132:18-20)

Abraham received concubines, and they bore him children; and it was accounted unto him for righteousness, because they were given unto him, and he abode in my law; as Isaac also and Jacob did none other things than that which they were commanded; and because they did none other things than that which they were commanded, they have entered into their exaltation, according to the promises, and sit upon thrones, and are not angels but are gods. (Section 132:37)

168 posted on 10/24/2016 5:51:43 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)

To: aMorePerfectUnion

Better late than never...

169 posted on 10/24/2016 5:52:52 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)

That is the sole requirement of Salvation.

Not according to OTHER LDS® statements.

170 posted on 10/24/2016 5:55:00 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)

Robert L. Millet, former dean of religious education at Brigham Young University

Professor Robert Millet teaching at the Mission Prep Club in 2004 http://newsnet.byu.edu/video/18773/ <-- Complete and uneditted

If the above link does NOT function; try THIS one. Click on the second image.

http://mormontruthnews.blogspot.com/2006/10/robert-millet-former-dean-of-religious_01.html

Timeline... Subject...

0:59 "Anti-Mormons..."

1:16 "ATTACK the faith you have..."

2:02 "We really aren't obligated to answer everyone's questions..."

3:57 "You already know MORE about God and Christ and the plan of salvation than any who would ATTACK you."

171 posted on 10/24/2016 5:56:12 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)

Robert L. Millet, former dean of religious education at Brigham Young University

Mr. Millet:

I don't think we can ever transcend Joseph Smith or consider him to be a valued personality, but now we'll move on.

I don't think you'll see that among believers in the faith, because there are too many other things that came from him

that are the reasons why we do what we do and we are what we are. That there are unanswered questions, to be sure.

That there are things that I'm as anxious as the next guy to learn more detail on, I really want to know. But in the interim,

it really doesn't, doesn't trouble me.

We're in the religion-making business, as you intimated earlier, only for a short time, I mean, compared to the

Christian church, which has been at this for a couple of millennia. We're about halfway to Nicaea.

And so, and so in that sense — I remember a very tender moment. I was speaking with — I've been invited

to the Salt Lake Theological Seminary, basically an Evangelical seminary, to discuss a book I had done on Jesus.

And they had read it, and they wanted me to come and just respond to questions.

And it was, it was a very enjoyable couple of hours.

The very last question that was asked by one of my friends there was this one.

He said, 'Bob, what can we do for you?'

And I, I wasn't ready for that question. I said, 'What do you mean?'

He said, 'What can we, as Evangelicals, do for our Mormon friends?'

And I, I guess my mind could have gone a hundred different ways, but what I came back with was this.

I said, 'Boy, I appreciate you asking that. I don't think I've ever been asked that.'

But, but I said, 'Try this. Cut us a little slack, will you? Give us a little time.

We're in the religion-making business, and this takes time. It takes centuries.

And, and trying to explain the faith and articulate the faith, that doesn't come over night.

We've really only been about that for 20 or 30 years.'

http://being.publicradio.org/programs/insidemormonfaith/transcript.shtml

172 posted on 10/24/2016 5:57:34 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)

That is all that is required.

Are you an 'expert' on MORMONism?

Temple Recommend Questions

1 Do you have faith in and a testimony of God the Eternal Father, His Son Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost?

2 Do you have a testimony of the Atonement of Christ and of His role as Savior and Redeemer?

3 Do you have a testimony of the restoration of the gospel in these the latter days?

4 Do you sustain the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as the Prophet, Seer, and Revelator and as the only person on the earth who possesses and is authorized to exercise all priesthood keys? Do you sustain members of the First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles as prophets, seers, and revelators? Do you sustain the other General Authorities and local authorities of the Church?

5 Do you live the law of chastity?

6 Is there anything in your conduct relating to members of your family that is not in harmony with the teachings of the Church?

7 Do you support, affiliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?

8 Do you strive to keep the covenants you have made, to attend your sacrament and other meetings, and to keep your life in harmony with the laws and commandments of the gospel?

9 Are you honest in your dealings with your fellowmen?

10 Are you a full-tithe payer?

11 Do you keep the Word of Wisdom?

12 Do you have financial or other obligations to a former spouse or children? If yes, are you current in meeting those obligations?

13 If you have previously received your temple endowment:

Do you keep the covenants that you made in the temple?
Do you wear the garment both night and day as instructed in the endowment and in accordance with the covenant you made in the temple?

14 Have there been any sins or misdeeds in your life that should have been resolved with priesthood authorities but have not been?

15 Do you consider yourself worthy to enter the Lord's house and participate in temple ordinances?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temple_(LDS_Church)

174 posted on 10/24/2016 6:13:41 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)

Let me give you the definition. "big·ot ˈbiɡət/ noun a person who is intolerant toward those holding different opinions."
The Mormons are the best representatives of Christianity I know.

Show us how tolerant YOU are by denouncing these statements from past Mormon leaders:

Orson Pratt proclaimed: "Both Catholics and Protestants are nothing less than the 'whore of Babylon' whom the Lord denounces by the mouth of John the Revelator as having corrupted all the earth by their fornications and wickedness. Any person who shall be so corrupt as to receive a holy ordinance of the Gospel from the ministers of any of these apostate churches will be sent down to hell with them, unless they repent" (The Seer, p. 255).

Questions put to Joseph Smith: "'Do you believe the Bible?' [Smith:]'If we do, we are the only people under heaven that does, for there are none of the religious sects of the day that do'. When asked 'Will everybody be damned, but Mormons'? [Smith replied] 'Yes, and a great portion of them, unless they repent, and work righteousness." (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 119).

Joseph Smith: "for the teachers of religion of the different sects understood the same passages of scripture so differently as to destroy all confidence in settling the question by an appeal to the Bible" (from Pearl of Great Price 1:12). "What is it that inspires professors of Christianity generally with a hope of salvation? It is that smooth, sophisticated influence of the devil, by which he deceives the whole world" (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p.270).

Brigham Young stated this repeatedly: "When the light came to me I saw that all the so-called Christian world was grovelling in darkness" (Journal of Discourses 5:73); "The Christian world, so-called, are heathens as to the knowledge of the salvation of God" (Journal of Discourses 8:171); "With a regard to true theology, a more ignorant people never lived than the present so-called Christian world" (Journal of Discourses 8:199); "And who is there that acknowledges [God's] hand? ...You may wander east, west, north, and south, and you cannot find it in any church or government on the earth, except the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints" (Journal of Discourses , vol. 6, p.24); "Should you ask why we differ from other Christians, as they are called, it is simply because they are not Christians as the New Testament defines Christianity" (Journal of Discourses 10:230).

Orson Pratt also said: "This great apostasy commenced about the close of the first century of the Christian era, and it has been waxing worse and worse from then until now" (Journal of Discourses , vol.18, p.44) and: "But as there has been no Christian Church on the earth for a great many centuries past, until the present century, the people have lost sight of the pattern that God has given according to which the Christian Church should be established, and they have denominated a great variety of people Christian Churches, because they profess to be ...But there has been a long apostasy, during which the nations have been cursed with apostate churches in great abundance" (Journal of Discourses , 18:172).

President John Taylor stated: "Christianity...is a perfect pack of nonsense...the devil could not invent a better engine to spread his work than the Christianity of the nineteenth century." (Journal of Discourses , vol. 6, p.167); "Where shall we look for the true order or authority of God? It cannot be found in any nation of Christendom." (Journal of Discourses , 10:127).

James Talmage said: "A self-suggesting interpretation of history indicates that there has been a great departure from the way of salvation as laid down by the Savior, a universal apostasy from the Church of Christ". (A Study of the Articles of Faith, p.182).

President Joseph Fielding Smith said: "Doctrines were corrupted, authority lost, and a false order of religion took the place of the gospel of Jesus Christ, just as it had been the case in former dispensations, and the people were left in spiritual darkness." (Doctrines of Salvation, p.266). "For hundreds of years the world was wrapped in a veil of spiritual darkness, until there was not one fundamental truth belonging to the place of salvation ...Joseph Smith declared that in the year 1820 the Lord revealed to him that all the 'Christian' churches were in error, teaching for commandments the doctrines of men" (Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 3, p.282).

More recent statements by apostle Bruce McConkie are also very clear: "Apostasy was universal...And this darkness still prevails except among those who have come to a knowledge of the restored gospel" (Doctrines of Salvation, vol 3, p.265); "Thus the signs of the times include the prevailing apostate darkness in the sects of Christendom and in the religious world in general" (The Millennial Messiah, p.403); "a perverted Christianity holds sway among the so-called Christians of apostate Christendom" (Mormon Doctrine, p.132); "virtually all the millions of apostate Christendom have abased themselves before the mythical throne of a mythical Christ whom they vainly suppose to be a spirit essence who is incorporeal uncreated, immaterial and three-in-one with the Father and Holy Spirit" (Mormon Doctrine, p.269); "Gnosticism is one of the great pagan philosophies which antedated Christ and the Christian Era and which was later commingled with pure Christianity to form the apostate religion that has prevailed in the world since the early days of that era." (Mormon Doctrine, p.316).

President George Q. Cannon said: "After the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was organized, there were only two churches upon the earth. They were known respectively as the Church of the Lamb of God and Babylon. The various organizations which are called churches throughout Christendom, though differing in their creeds and organizations, have one common origin. They all belong to Babylon" (Gospel Truth, p.324).

President Wilford Woodruff stated: "the Gospel of modern Christendom shuts up the Lord, and stops all communication with Him. I want nothing to do with such a Gospel, I would rather prefer the Gospel of the dark ages, so called" (Journal of Discourses , vol. 2, p.196).

175 posted on 10/24/2016 6:16:52 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)

The KJV changed God’s word from its actual meaning to somethings not even close.

Then Joseph Smith; under a direct command from GOD; changed it when he re-translated the KJV to get the errors out.

Can you show the disbelievers the TRUE John 3:16 from the Inspired Version?

176 posted on 10/24/2016 6:24:17 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)

Look at the original Greek, Hebrew and Aramaic. KJV changed it on purpose. It was an abominal change of God’s Word.

You are going to have to get new talking points.

177 posted on 10/24/2016 6:25:51 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)

Is the Jesus of Mormonism the Jesus of the Bible?

No.

One of them has a heavenly mother and two sets of heavenly grandparents and heavenly uncles and aunts etc ect, the real one does not.

178 posted on 10/24/2016 6:26:01 AM PDT by DungeonMaster (Rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft.)

They say that ( Now get this right) “Jesus in the Son of God” absolutely and with out equivocation.

One would hope!!

179 posted on 10/24/2016 6:27:04 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)

In the end you must use your own mind which is not what you are supposed to do in professional Christianity.

Improvement Era article from 1945:

When our leaders speak, the thinking has been done. When they propose a plan–it is God’s plan. When they point the way, there is no other which is safe. When they give direction, it should mark the end of controversy. God works in no other way. To think otherwise, without immediate repentance, may cost one his faith, may destroy his testimony, and leave him a stranger to the kingdom of God.

180 posted on 10/24/2016 6:35:11 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)

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