Posted on 05/03/2024 8:33:43 AM PDT by MinorityRepublican
Israel has never been satisfied with its version of the Patriot air defense system that Ukraine views as essential to its survival.
This creates a bizarre split screen where Ukraine was all but pleading for more Patriot missiles to defend its cities and forces on Monday even as Israel began to shut down its older Patriot batteries, a move that came less than a month after it battled an unprecedented missile barrage from Iran.
Israel and Ukraine's experience with the Patriots could not have been more different. Israel first used Patriots in combat in 1991 against approximately 40 Scud ballistic missiles that Iraq fired at its cities. While the bombardments did not kill large numbers of people, Israel was disappointed with the Patriot's pitiful performance, with officials estimating it shot down only one or possibly even zero Scuds.
Israel wouldn't use the Patriot in combat again until the 2010s when it shot down drones and a Su-24 bomber coming from Syria. By then, the Patriot had become a very different system. Its early failures, including against Iraqi Scuds, led to an extensive system upgrade and missiles with an active radar seeker that directly strike the target to destroy it with kinetic energy.
(Excerpt) Read more at businessinsider.com ...
“Israel is ‘retiring’ its Patriot missile batteries. They could help a struggling Ukraine.”
Just in time for a war with Iran. Can’t say I’m surprised that the Zeepers are ready to leave Israel DEFENSELESS against Iran, since they never liked Israel much to begin with.
Interesting that SCUD missiles were mentioned. I read a very unconfirmed report that Ukraine discovered twenty SCUD missiles in storage and they are cannibalizing twelve of them to make the remaining eight functional.
If true it would be interesting to see where they’d be used and if the Russians are capable of intercepting 1980’s Soviet tech with 1990’s Soviet tech.
Huh? It sounds as if Israel is choosing to retire its Patriots because it finds them inadequate.
How do you twist this into "Zeepers" wanting to leave Israel defenseless? "Zeepers" had nothing to do with Israel's decision.
Israel is retiring them because they have developed their own air defenses that have proven to be superior. I believe their Iron Dome has intercepted more missiles and other threats than all the Patriot missiles deployed around the world.
This is not the US telling them to retire them but their assessment that maintaining them is not worth it any more.
usnews.com
Top Countries Receiving US Foreign Aid-——In 2022, economic aid accounted for 86% of foreign aid obligations by the U.S., while military aid accounted for 14%.
Economic vs. Military Aid-—Grand Total
1 Ukraine $12,432,081,637
2 Israel $3,308,801,618
3 Ethiopia $2,190,256,514
4 Afghanistan $1,389,022,902
5 Yemen $1,375,803,516
6 Egypt $1,368,911,286
7 Jordan $1,188,991,957
8 Nigeria $1,154,875,460
9 Somalia $1,137,089,455
10 South Sudan $1,123,918,275
11 Kenya $1,028,281,844
12 Congo (Kinshasa) $907,530,821
13 Sudan $859,064,945
14 Syria $826,163,970
15 Uganda $790,252,008
Source: ForeignAssistance.gov: Julia Haines/U.S. News & World Report
The large majority of aid can be classified as economic or military. Humanitarian aid falls under economic objectives, as defined by the source. Military aid includes training, equipment and weapons but may not include some Department of Defense funding such as missiles or other classified spending. Negative values reflect instances when the State Dept’s USAID agency cancels or makes a downward adjustment of grants or contracts. Dollars are adjusted to match constant 2022 inflation.
“Huh? It sounds as if Israel is choosing to retire its Patriots because it finds them inadequate.”
If I recall the version Israel had exploded in the vicinity of the target creating a debris cone that was supposed to destroy the missile. But the scuds were breaking up and the debris cone was focused in on the larger target, a fuel tank. The warhead was still on trajectory and hit anyway. This problem was addressed in later versions.
Ignore him: he’s just frothing incoherently again. Apparently, the FSB pays him by the word.
Business Insider propaganda.
Patriots just don’t work very well. Turing this into a Ukrainian “victory” is stupid.
they’d have to be pretty damned poor performers for the IDF to retire them from deployment, especially given the magnitude of the Iranian/Fakestinian terrorist threats
“...they never liked Israel much to begin with.”
Problem here is two fold. It seems like everyone is supporting a dying horse. Ukraine can’t win a war with Russia and come out with a thriving country. Even if the actual combat ended it still would be in a situation of diplomacy requiring Russian overseeing. So giving the Ukraine a defense weapon will only kick the end of the war a little further down the road and will cost many lives, more in the Ukraine.
Everyone’s defense resourses are not infinitive. Sooner or later everyone will have to say I can’t afford it any more and cut them off. Then they will be as they are right now, probably worse, and will have to go for a compromise rather than flipping Russia off. And it will end up costing them more at that time than now.
They decided to stand on their own in 1991 when the soviets disolved and couldn’t argue with them. They decided to call Russia’s bluff and won that time. They won’t now and this is where they were heading in 1991 sooner or later. It’s later.
wy69
Even if it’s 10% effective, Ukraine should take it. Better than nothing.
understood.
(if anyone knows how to upgrade missile defense systems it is the Israelis. this is why I can’t fathom why they’d retire these ... )
Another possible take on the "messaging." Other air defense products are superior to the Patriot AD. Armament manufacturers are sensitive to "image," and there are quite a number of competing armaments manufacturers around the world.
They got new ones. They get all the best stuff from the U.S.
Many questions arise from such a decision
In a world of production shortages, massive debt, drone swarms, etc... why would anyone “retire” any system - unless it was totally useless?
Also the article mentions how Israel thinks its own home-grown systems are better. If tiny Israel can create a cheaper and more effective system than the giant empire USA - what does that say about the cost and quality of the USA’s defense procurement oligopoly?
It sounds as if Israel is choosing to retire its Patriots because it finds them inadequate.
—
They are very old Patriots designed to intercept SCUDS and planes - Iron Dome, David’s Sling etc are far better.
Lefty mag Business Insider trying to describe all of that as a one or two phrase descriptor like "Patriot missiles" can be ignorant at best, misleading at worst.
To get Uncle Joes and Mad Antony’s hand off their shoulder. Just their way of saying we don’t need your crap understanding of the Iran getting in our way.
What one is getting from this article, one's own self, is that they're retiring those original Patriot 1.0 systems and upgrading them with the new and improved Patriot 3.n systems, or something else to that same effect that actually does perform better.
Or maybe they've come up with something of their own that they like better? That's a question.
Anyway this would fit into what the Zeepers have been trying to tell us; "NO, we're giving all the OLD hsit to Ukraine to clear the way for us to have all NEW STUFF!!"...
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