Your conclusion, curiosity, “...That leaves only one possibility...Obama must have a standard BC and the index entry is for a standard BC.” -— omits an “other” possibility, which - considering what facts are known - carries the most certainty: his birth record/certificate(s) are sealed.
Background:
We know that Barry was adopted by Lolo Soetoro. Aside from his half-sister Maya stating so publically, we know from the Stanley Ann/Lolo 1980 divorce documents that “the parties” were the parents of one child under 18 [Maya] and one child over 18 but still dependent on the parties for his education [Barry]. The divorce was filed/granted in Hawaii. That Barry was adopted by Lolo Soetoro is not in the realm of speculation; it is fact.
None of we bloggers/commentors know with certainty that Barack Obama of Kenya sired Barack Obama II. There is considerable doubt, starting with the boy’s name being designated with the honorary “the Second” (II), rather than the sire-to-son “Junior” - specifically, the boy was named “for” Barack Obama of Kenya, rather then “after” him, indicating that Obama was the right race, at the needed time, and willing. Whether it was BO of Kenya, Frank Marshall Davis, the milkman, or “unknown”, IF our little Barry was truly born in a Honolulu hospital there was a long form, official with raised seal, signed by attending physician certificate of birth - and it was filed in the normal manner at the Department of Health. Where it remained - UNTIL BARRY WAS ADOPTED BY LOLO SOETORO.
I know the following from personal experience:
In an adoption procedure such as Lolo of Barry, a petition is filed, hearings are held, privately, before a family court judge and court recorder, adoption is approved, and Court Orders are written which spell out the remaining requisite procedures:
A brand new, pristine long form certificate of birth is filled out with all of the data from the original birth certificate. It is filled out exactly as the original with two exceptions: on the pristine document the name of the baby’s father is “Lolo Soetoro”, and his race is [whatever Lolo’s race was].
Enter now the LAW: the signing and filing of the Court Orders does three things in the Law: (1) Lolo Soetoro is the actual - not “step” - ACTUAL father of the boy Barry, who is now Barry Soetoro; (2) as proscribed by the government of Indonesia, the father Lolo’s Indonesian citizenship is conferred onto Barry; (3) whatever man was named on the original birth certificate as father, in the eyes of the law in relation to the child, does not exist - and never did exist. In the eyes of the law, Lolo Soetoro conceived Barry. Chiseled. In. Stone.
The next step - because above all, the child is to be protected from any person or occurrance which could cause him distress, or could in any way breach his and his parents’ privacy - all records relating to the adoption are sealed, under Court Order. “All” records means ANY and ALL papers, records, memos, files, filings, recordings, transcripts of proceedings, etc, and most importantly - the ORIGINAL BIRTH CERTIFICATE. In the eyes of the law, that certificate does not, and never did, exist. The Certificate of Birth - the “long form” - which identifies Lolo Soetoro as Barry’s father IS the ORIGINAL birth certificate. It is the ONLY one on file at the HDOH. Forever.
Unless someone ELSE petitions the court and adopts Barry - in which case yet another “original” birth certificate would be generated.
Regarding the various staff at the Hawaii Dept. of Health, who have made tortured, prevaricating attempts to do Barry’s bidding — any statements or remarks they have made about having personally seen, touched, patted, or swooned over a document as being Obie’s “original birth certificate” has to be in reference to the only one on file - naming Lolo as father. It appears they are dancing for the media and following instructions which could have come only from Barry. The birth records are not public information; FOIA does not apply. The DOH staff are not at liberty to peruse those files; they can only look, handle if required by the job - which means if the “owner” files a request for a certified copy. There was a report during the ‘08 campaign that Barry had petitioned the Hawaiian court for his on-file birth certificate and related records of copies requested over the years, etc, to be sealed. It would be out of the ordinary - but the Chicago way means such requests are likely to be approved.
As for the sealed adoption records - anyone poking around there, and that means ANYone - would be committing a criminal act. Last I knew, such files were still actually sealed with a huge blob of wax.
All things considered, best guess is that Barry refuses to produce his long form birth certificate - and is willing to spend $$million$ to keep it hidden because that one document shows the truth which would reveal layers upon layers of his lies about his life, activities, and travels. Instead of peeling an onion from the outside>in, Barry’s birth certificate Waterloo begins at the center of the onion - right there at the tear-making core - with the fact of his being adopted by Lolo and thus being a citizen of Indonesia.
Indonesia doesn’t permit dual citizenship, so the Indonesian citizen son of Indonesian Lolo had to have an Indonesian citizen passport. Why his mother had to file for an amendment to remove Barry from travelling on her passport. As a US citizen he could be on hers, but his US citizenship was forsaken for the marriage to Lolo. No problem for a woman who didn’t love her native country anyway - or for the son she dutifully trained to reflect her distaste for America. No problem for him, that is, until he decided to go into politics. Suddenly that Indonesian citizenship and it’s trickle-down useage in his life became a thorn. He wanted to fundamentally change our precious country, and to do so required masses and masses of lies and cover-ups. No problem - just haul out the Chicago way, and the tactics of Chicago’s favorite son, Alinsky. Not working, however - bloggers, Freepers! - and Barry’s thorn of deceit has turned into a festering boil that’s rapidly reaching the point where it will be lanced.
Pinging a few names that pop into my poor little brain.
I think GGMac is hitting closer to the bullseye than just about anything I’ve seen so far.
Dam breech is getting closer and closer IMO.
Oh, GGMac - if the original BC has a birthplace other than Honolulu, that would also be a knockout punch. And per our other exchange, the birth place would not be different on the new adoptive birth certificate. Do you think that is an issue from whatever you know/conjecture?
Bump.
GGMac’s analysis is very interesting. I recommend it to all Freepers.
excellent overview of adoption
except in my experience, perhaps in adopting from a foreign country, other data can be changed on the new “birth” certificate created by adoption, aside from parentage
child’s new name of course, and even birth date
“... his US citizenship was forsaken for the marriage to Lolo.”
Correct. Obama’s vulnerability is not in his vital records held in Hawaii, but his immigration records held at USCIS.
Obama came back to America as Barry Soetoro, Indonesian National. The Soetoro adoption was annulled in 1971. The annullment terminated the parental rights of Lolo Soetoro, but did not change Obama’s school records, immunization records or his Indonesian citizenship.
Obama was issued a Green Card and obtained a SSN as an Indonesian National legally residing in America. He evenutally naturalized as a U.S. Citizen and was issued a Certificate of Nationality to prove he is an U.S. Citizen.
It doesn’t sound so crazy anymore, but Obama is a U.S. native born immigrant who becamed a Naturalized U.S. Citizen.
Hawaii allows an adoption to be set aside.
Unless the HDOH is lying about the name their records are under, the adoption was probably set aside. Beckwith argues that this procedure is why BHO came back to HI in 1971, if I’m understanding correctly. Beckwith, correct me if I don’t have that right.
The problem we have is that if the HDOH can lie at will - as it does - then we just have no firm ground to stand on to even speculate. After all the research and analysis, all I can say is that we don’t know anything AT ALL until the transaction logs for all the records are disclosed and we can see which of the HDOH’s statements are truthful and which are sheer fabrication.
The way we’re going to get those transaction logs disclosed and get some closure on this issue is by getting our state legislatures to require the transaction logs to be disclosed together with the actual birth and citizenship documents before a candidate can be placed on the ballots.
A bill that could do that is posted at http://butterdezillion.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/final-short-form-eligibility-bill1.pdf . I’m asking everyone to e-mail that to their state legislator and ask them to introduce and pass it or something similar. Or if there is an eligibility bill already proposed in their state, ask the legislators to add a requirement for the transaction logs as well.
The Inspector General for HHS has released a report that makes it clear why a measure like that is important, at http://oig.hhs.gov/oei/reports/oei-07-99-00570.pdf . The IG concludes that states need to decide for themselves what documentation they will require as proof for claims, based on the reality that fraudulent documents can be used to get genuine documents and the truth is known only by looking at the whole picture.
The possibility of someone claiming an at-home birth is specifically mentioned as an easy way to get fraudulent BC’s. If what the HDOH told Lori Starfelt is correct and there was a requirement for a baby to be seen by a HI doctor within the first 30 days, that still allows for fraudulent BC’s claiming a HI birth that are perfectly legal, as noted by Aloha .... (can’t remember his name here on FR). The baby would have to arrive in HI within the first 30 days, unless a doctor was willing to fraudulently claim the child was born within the last 30 days (which would make for children whose birth might actually be weeks or months sooner than their BC says). Interesting that the dr that Abercrombie appointed as health secretary is being investigated for fraud. Medicare fraud, I believe, but it still speaks of the willingness to turn a blind eye to the rule of law.
That would explain why there are so few claimed unattended births in Hawaii for 1961. They considered it an attended birth if a doctor examined the mother or baby within the allotted time. Everything would seem legitimate, just looking at the statistics - and yet lots of people who immigrated to Hawaii with a newborn could have been fraudulently registered as Hawaii births.
Danae, do you remember the name of the Aloha person who talked about seeing people arriving in HI being told they could get a Hawaii BC easily? If you remember the name, could you ping him/her?
“IF our little Barry was truly born in a Honolulu hospital there was a long form, official with raised seal, signed by attending physician certificate of birth - and it was filed in the normal manner at the Department of Health. Where it remained - UNTIL BARRY WAS ADOPTED BY LOLO SOETORO.”
1.) What would his name be on the new long form Birth Certificate?
2.) Why was there no index data for Barry Soetoro at the HDOH?
3. Was there any index data for Lolo Soetoro/Soebarkah etc.?
4.) As Danae suggested, when Stanely-Ann divorced Lolo, wouldn’t his original ‘vital records’ be unsealed?
5.) If Barry had no records of his birth in Hawaii prior to the adoption, why would Lolo go through the legal mumbo jumbo of adoption in Hawaii?
Re: ...the boy was named “for” Barack Obama of Kenya.
“Senior” spelled his name “Barak.”
http://cambodiana.org/MainreasonsofmysupportofObama.aspx
Cursor down to photos — “Reminiscenses”
http://www.theobamafile.com/_images/img829.jpg
Problems Facing Our Socialism
http://www.politico.com/static/PPM41_eastafrica.html
Cursor down to “Authors”
Your scenario explains Barak Obama’s 1971 Christmas visit.
I believe that the Dunhams paid off Barak Obama to adopt/re-adopt Barry back. That it was necvessary to reorganize Barry’s “paperwork.”
There is absolutely no other explanation for Barak’s visit.
http://www.theobamafile.com/_family/Senior.htm#ChristmasVisit
