Actress Brooke Shields kills 140 of her very own Children by undergoing 7 IVF Treatments

Various | 07.25.04

[workerbee]

There was an article on IVF. I got to a line that read closely to this: "After the best embryos are separated for use the rest are generally discarded..."

I was talking with my sister a few weeks ago regarding a mutual friend who has been considered IVF. She asked my opinion and I told her, I couldn't consider it because it essentially amounts to choosing which baby lives and which ones don't. My sister -- no kidding -- had no idea how the process worked. She had no idea that embryos were basically thrown in the trash. She's 40 yrs old, for pete's sake, and did not understand this!

Coleus, thanks for the post. Ignore the nasty comments. It's sad to see so many FReepers are content to tell themselves that farming human beings (for fun or profit) is the equivalent of "cancer treatment."

[NeoCaveman]

You post some troubling things. The truth is troubling sometimes. Good work Coleus.

[eastsider]

The attacks on your reasoning prove once again that the faults that people complain about in others are usually their own.

Keep up the good work!

[drstevej]

***Abortion is sick and wrong. But people who criticize people who are Trying to Have Children in terms of the extra embryos? You need to rechannel your energy into something less crazy.***

As one who has been through 4 miscarriages before and and 3 after the birth of our daughter I do criticize those who abort embryos in seeking pregnancy.

If life begins at conception (which is my theological conviction as a Protestant pastor and theologian) then destroying an embryo is the moral equivalent of terminating a pregnancy, "eliminating" a toddler, or euthanizing an elderly person.

As a Protestant I am not a practitioner of NFP as held by the Catholic Church, but I do reject birth control methods and fertility methods that destroy fertilized eggs.

For our family this is a very personal issue. In fertility counseling we rejected many medical recommendations because of our convictions even when we were intensely desirous of having children. We know how easy it is to rationalize treatment options.

As Christians, my wife and I wanted to honor God in whatever family He might provide us. Now that daughter is 22 years old and we have very clear consciences and no regrets.

Note: After out seventh miscarriage we adopted our son from a Christian agency. I am so thankful for a birth mother who chose life when a myriad of reasons and rationalizations could have persuaded her otherwise. My 18 year old son is thankful too!

The bottom line question for us was: which is the greater passion, to have a child or to honor God?

[Maeve]

This insanity is what tars all conservatives with the brush of fanaticism.

Hardly. What is revealed is your complicity with the destruction of human life in its most fragile and vulnerable form.

Don't lecture me punk.

Your lack of respect for the living is revealed as well.

[Maeve]

Thank you Coleus for this excellent thread. It is tragic the way it draws out those who are twisted within by guilt because they killed their own children in the womb or in these evil IVF procedures. It also draws out those whose minds are so woven together with the Culture of Death that they can no longer see the good, the true and the beautiful much less the right order of Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of Happiness.

[Dominick]

Some people shock me. That having been said, I have my own thoughts.

Even if you don't buy these are children she disposed of, lets look at some ramifications of IVF.

For one, she could have selected the embryo she wanted, and when we are able to better map the genome, perhaps the exact child she wants. Many of us agree the abortion on demand of girl babies in China is reprehensible, so what would make IVF selection of other traits any less offensive?

Another problem I have with the IVF method is the child is not guaranteed perfect. Things happen, and if the child is malformed, would the parents abandon the child? Perhaps they will not, but with so many children needing adoption, could they not find a child worthy of a great home and a loving Mother?

Like I said, not approaching this from a Catholic perspective, but from opposing eugenics, I think IVF is a big problem. We would all oppose the goober-ment deciding that no babies with certain genetic dispositions could be implanted, but could we oppose an insurance company from not paying for a IVF on a embryo? Even at that, would genetic selection be the province of a few elect? Worse still, would there be an intrusion on mothers to prove genetic worthiness of a baby before implanting?

This procedure has problems, and it should be obvious, anytime you treat human life like a commodity, you diminish all of our value as human beings.

[sonserae]

There are embryo adoption agencies where you can donate the additional eggs so that others can use them. That way you don't throw any out.

[Maximilian]

Don't lecture me punk.

Good advice. It would be a waste of time trying to "lecture" you. Comprehension is clearly not your strong suit. Perhaps you are a train engineer, but I'd feel sorry for the passengers.

[Askel5]

I pray to God that nobody is judged by this rigid a standard when the time comes. If so, no person on earth will be saved.

Shields, having professed to be a Catholic, certainly is accountable to the standards of her faith.

I fail to see how any Christian -- having excluded the Creator from procreation by birth control or sought to usurp his place with artificial reproduction -- can pretend anything like holy fear of the Lord.

Having rejected Him so soundly and at the cost and potential suffering of the unborn who are killed and artificial who are forced into existence despite His caveats on the welcoming and treatment of children, why should He welcome you?

---

The kingdom of heaven is likened to a king, who made a marriage for his son. And he sent his servants, to call them that were invited to the marriage; and they would not come. Again he sent other servants, saying: Tell them that were invited, Behold, I have prepared my dinner; my beeves and fatlings are killed, and all things are ready: come ye to the marriage. But they neglected, and went their own ways, one to his farm, and another to his merchandise. And the rest laid hands on his servants, and having treated them contumeliously, put them to death.

But when the king had heard of it, he was angry, and sending his armies, he destroyed those murderers, and burnt their city. Then he saith to his servants: The marriage indeed is ready; but they that were invited were not worthy. Go ye therefore into the highways; and as many as you shall find, call to the marriage.

And his servants going forth into the ways, gathered together all that they found, both bad and good: and the marriage was filled with guests.

And the king went in to see the guests: and he saw there a man who had not on a wedding garment. And he saith to him: Friend, how camest thou in hither not having a wedding garment? But he was silent. Then the king said to the waiters: Bind his hands and feet, and cast him into the exterior darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

For many are called, but few are chosen.

---

[TigersEye]

... farming human beings (for fun or profit)...

I think that sums up the IVF procedure quite well.

[Askel5]

Excellent post, Coleus.

Sorry about the spate of wholly predictable replies from the Brain Trust around here.

On the up side, they'd make a perfect Exhibit "A" to a "FREE REPUBLIC DEFENSE OF HOMOSEXUAL MARRIAGE AND REPRODUCTION"

I mean ... after all ... homosexuals are trying to HAVE babies, right?

Given California's desire to become the world's largest manufacturer of embryos for utilitarian research, I expect to see more of the Cali crowd on board with Nancy Reagan, et al. soon enough.

[Askel5]

Excellent post, Coleus.

Sorry about the spate of wholly predictable replies from the Brain Trust around here.

On the up side, they'd make a perfect Exhibit "A" to a "FREE REPUBLIC DEFENSE OF HOMOSEXUAL MARRIAGE AND REPRODUCTION"

I mean ... after all ... homosexuals are trying to HAVE babies, right?

Given California's desire to become the world's largest manufacturer of embryos for utilitarian research, I expect to see more of the Cali crowd on board with Nancy Reagan, et al. soon enough.

[rightwingreligiousfanatic]

God bless you Coleus! Thank you for an eye-opening, informative, and well documented post. I guess I shouldn't be shocked at the level of some of the initial responses, but in fact I am since this is a "conservative" forum. I guess it just goes to show how important the battle is and how far we've fallen as a culture.

Keep fighting the good fight, and thanks for encouraging us to do likewise!

[NYer]

This thread sure brought out the hysterics. The venom is WAY out of proportion to the issue.

“Though it is true that sometimes it is lawful to tolerate a lesser moral evil in order to avoid a greater evil or in order to promote a greater good," it is never lawful, even for the gravest reasons, to do evil that good may come of it (18)—in other words, to intend directly something which of its very nature contradicts the moral order, and which must therefore be judged unworthy of man, even though the intention is to protect or promote the welfare of an individual, of a family or of society in general.”
HUMANAE VITAE

Catholic Ping - let me know if you want on/off this list

[Hermann the Cherusker]

One can't reasonably debate the morality of creating life in test-tubes when dozens of tiny humans must die so that one may live?

What is the moral difference of IVF and abortion? Don't they both cause the end an unborn human life in pursuit of some allegedly more noble purpose?

How has such an important topic been swept from the public square in your mind?

[Hermann the Cherusker]

Is a day-old embryo a human baby or not?

[Coleus]

This insanity is what tars all conservatives with the brush of fanaticism. Don't lecture me punk.>>>

Platform of the REPUBLICAN PARTY

re: adoption NOT abortion

We believe rights inhere in individuals, not in groups.  We will attain our nation’s goal of equal opportunity without quotas or other forms of preferential treatment.  It is as simple as this: No one should be denied a job, promotion, contract, or chance at higher education because of their race or gender.  Equal access, energetically offered, should guarantee every person a fair shot based on their potential and merit.

The Supreme Court’s recent decision, prohibiting states from banning partial-birth abortions —  a procedure denounced by a committee of the American Medical Association and rightly branded as four-fifths infanticide — shocks the conscience of the nation.  As a country, we must keep our pledge to the first guarantee of the Declaration of Independence.  That is why we say the unborn child has a fundamental individual right to life which cannot be infringed.  We support a human life amendment to the Constitution and we endorse legislation to make clear that the Fourteenth Amendment’s protections apply to unborn children.  Our purpose is to have legislative and judicial protection of that right against those who perform abortions.  We oppose using public revenues for abortion and will not fund organizations which advocate it.  We support the appointment of judges who respect traditional family values and the sanctity of innocent human life.

Our goal is to ensure that women with problem pregnancies have the kind of support, material and otherwise, they need for themselves and for their babies, not to be punitive towards those for whose difficult situation we have only compassion.  We oppose abortion, but our pro-life agenda does not include punitive action against women who have an abortion.  We salute those who provide alternatives to abortion and offer adoption services, and we commend congressional Republicans for expanding assistance to adopting families and for removing racial barriers to adoption.  The impact of those measures and of our Adoption and Safe Families Act of 1997 has been spectacular.  Adoptions out of foster care have jumped forty percent and the incidence of child abuse and neglect has actually declined.   We second Governor Bush’s call to make permanent the adoption tax credit and expand it to $7,500.

An essential part of a culture that respects life is integration and inclusion of persons with disabilities.  That is the goal of Governor Bush’s New Freedom Initiative, a comprehensive agenda for the breakthrough research and practical assistance that can help individuals with disabilities live independently, hold jobs, and take part in the daily life of their communities.  We applaud his proposal, and we salute congressional Republicans for the way they have protected access to health care for individuals with disabilities against the administration’s attempts to ration it.  We pledge continued vigilance in that regard, especially in Medicare and Medicaid.

 

President Bush in a State of the Union Address

And because no human life should be started or ended as the object of an experiment, I ask you to set a high standard for humanity and pass a law against all human cloning.

Our Founders dedicated this country to the cause of human dignity – the rights of every person and the possibilities of every life.

 

 

 

 

[Petronski]

Your post is DEAD on. This is the sick little secret of IVF.

[Ohioan from Florida]

anytime you treat human life like a commodity, you diminish all of our value as human beings.

Precisely! Your statement is very well put!