DEBKAfile Exclusive: US Marines are locked in battle with Syrian troops

Debka ^ | November 25, 2005

[Dog]

Both sides have suffered casualties. US soldiers crossed over after Damascus was given an ultimatum Thursday, Nov. 24, to hand over a group of senior commanders belonging to Abu Musab al Zarqawi’s al Qaeda force. According to US intelligence, the group had fled to Syria to escape an American attack in Mosul. Syrian border guards opened fire on the American force.

[RobbyS]

It may be that the original plan was to keep on going and secure the borders. We probably will never know who and why or if it was stopped.

[fightnback]

"It's important to remember that even though liberal children control the media, we have adults in the White House."

Just wanted everyone to read that phrase one more time.

[Marine_Uncle]

OK. As I peer at my maps and basically know where many of our military units...Army verse Marines AOR are in those northern regions, two things stick out.
If the goons really left Mosul then they would have escaped on a north west direction to the Syrian border, say some 80 miles plus (depending on what bearing one chooses, based on the road grids and where the publicized Iraqi Border Check points are located). Regardless, they would have escaped well north of any of our Marine units.
For them to want to head in the direction of the Euphrates river, e.g. Al Qaem, Hussabiya (those most northerly towns along the river that are close to the Syrian border) would be ridiculus at this point, since all those towns are now occupied by US/Iraqi forces. They have closed down that whole area leading up to the Syrian border. OK, for those that are still with me looking at their maps of Iraq with some geographic/road net details... if they headed into Syria some 100 miles north of the Al Qaem area (where you see the v notch on your maps)......then this article is baloney at best. Why? Because they would not be anywhere in the Marine 2DIVS, areas of operation. Plain and simple. They would have escaped and across the border area and drove or hiked into some of those far northeastern corner of Syria (toward the Turkish Border), then made their way to where ever.
So I have problems with this article.

[TomasUSMC]

Anyway you look at it, it is long past due for out military to implement hot pursuit. If the Iranian and Syrian borders are porous, they need to be made porous both ways. We need to take the Syrians and Iranians down ASAP.

Coalition dead are 80+ in 4 out of six months for the first time. Attacks are at all time highs month after month.

Everytime an Iranian made shaped charge kills an American we have Casus Belli.

[U S Army EOD]

Yes.

[johnnyjumpstart]

Let's be fair: Debka has scored some big scoops, but they get just as many big misses. Either way, they are always an interesting read.

[Cap Huff]

Syria was given a deadline which expired on 24 November, but it is related to the Hariri investigation. In contrast to DEBKA, there is some analysis/speculation about the possible consequences of that deadline here:

The Clock Ticks for Syria

Maybe DEBKA sees Syria coming into the news more this weekend and is trying to slip in early with their own speculation.

Watch, if the Hariri issue sets off more tough rhetoric followed by U.N. posturing this weekend DEBKA will try saying that the "border clash" is the real reason.

[Frank Sheed]

http://pundita.blogspot.com/2005/11/americas-news-of-day.html

Read this. The blurb on Debka in the bullet points at the end is very interesting.

[wireman]

"Yes...DEBKA has been right on occasion."

Like the proverbial stopped clock.

[Cap Huff]

Interesting point. I wonder whether we'll see anything more on this report.

[Marine_Uncle]

Yo Marine.
Perhaps we shall end up going into Syria. In all due fairness to all our dialogs, we have to remember the Iraqi have been saying for a few months that they strongly object to us using their borders to attack Syria. Obviously this is a bunch of malerky at best. I am sure 2MARDIV is getting more pissed as the days go by, despite their up to date successes.
It would be interesting to find some mil sites that addressed the true conditions of the Iraqi border check points and their current abilities to patrol their areas. But I can see where that could be viewed as breaking OPSEC.
When my nephew's 2ND LAR returned in October, things along their remote far northwestern Syrian border where not heating up. One thing for certain, if push comes to shove, our army heavy armor will take the road net from Korean Village area/H3 airfields.... on the road that leads directly to Damascus some some two hundred and twenty miles linear distance to the capital from the road intersect fifty miles south of the Syrian border (30miles west of Ar Rutbah).
And if this happens, as you well understand, it is going to require a bit of armor and air support to roll up that road. If Bashar Assad or his military folks decided to oppose us, then it is going to become a blood bath. We will have to take out his whole airforce, G/A defense networks, communication nets, and all apposing Syrian forces. After all it is their Capital, and it is hard to believe they would just sit quitely and do nothing.
If we go in, Bahar falls and chaos starts. All those apposing political and religious groups go nuts, hack and whack time just like in Iraq most probably, so we then have two Iraqs to fight, and this new one may be more like a NAM conflict IMHO. Of course, how does one remove all the waring factions that will come into play throughout the whole country. This is why I have spoken against invading Syria in the past.
Perhaps in the weeks to come Bashar will be told his final decision is required. Is he going demonstrate full cooperation or not. Of course what he says probably does not mean much. For he could be willing but power players in the Secret Police/Military may have other plans. Who knows.

[TexKat]

Syrian border

There are news of at least 12 American soldiers have been killed and wounded near the Al-Bo-Kamal area when they followed insurgents escaped to Syria. Fighting then broke down with the Syrians who had at least 3 casualties.

A buffer zone as deep as 30-50 km is needed inside the Syrian border along the Iraqi borders to allow the Iraqi-American forces to penetrate to kill or arrest the insurgent terrorists. Syria has no choice but either to end fully its support for terrorists, that is not going to happen at all or to allow such buffer otherwise it will face serious consequences.

A UN resolution regarding the support of terrorists by the Syrian may now become essential due to their failure to end that support, however for the multinational and Iraqi troops they need the zone to protect themselves and the civilians.

[righttackle44]

"Casualties on both sides?? Am i wrong in saying casualty means death?"

A casualty means someone who is injured or killed.

This is American Heritage Dictionary's definition [courtesy of Dictionary.com.]

3. One injured, killed, captured, or missing in action through engagement with an enemy. Often used in the plural: Battlefield casualties were high.

(I have not served. My tagline honors my son and my cousin.)

[b4its2late]

Is Debka not the most reliable of sources?

No, they are not, though they have been right at times.....And usually when they are, it is a couple of days before it is reported on CNX and the like.......

[b4its2late]

Most likely, the Syrians fired from across their border and Marines returned fire.

If the Syrians did that, they are dumber than democrats, which is really, really dumb.

[Cap Huff]

Dog,

Take note of link in #130.

[woofer]

If the Syrians did that, they are dumber than democrats, which is really, really dumb.

It's obvious that you don't know these people. I was told once that when I wear a ballcap, Allah couldn't see my eyes.

A Christian Pak told me that the moslem Paks will do their, um, sins in dark places. That way Allah wouldn't know.

I can see the Syrians shooting. If they actually did, I bet they're sorry now.

[b4its2late]

Holy Crap!

[TomasUSMC]

I'm not thinking going in with Ground. Air, air attacks, as you said, to take out their aircraft. Once that is done, it would just be about having enough bombs to drop on them.

But if we wait, they will - and I am sure at this very moment are - building up their air defenses and dispersing and hiding and doing everything to avoid hell from the sky.

Time is not on our side. Especially since we have allowed the Iraqis to choose Islam over Freedom. Now, every battle our heroes win is a win for Iran and Islam and every casualty we take is also.

Take out Iran and Syrian Air Power now, or pay a higher price later.

[TomasUSMC]

Oh, give a big hug to that Marine of yours from the "Old Corps"