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BUSH'S STAND ON ILLEGALS MAKES NO SENSE
boblonsberry.com ^ | 04/25/06 | Bob Lonsberry

Posted on 04/26/2006 5:41:15 AM PDT by shortstop

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To: BurbankKarl
had submitted 4,100 duplicate Social Security numbers for workers.

WHAT THE HECK??????

301 posted on 04/26/2006 1:05:17 PM PDT by Brad’s Gramma (aitch tee tee pee 2 dots 2 slashys 3 dubyas 1 dot proud patriots dot oarg)
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To: A.Hun
Us WOP's...or (our more correctly my grandparent WOP's )were detained at Ellis Island. They left their native land illegally because their governments did not like the exodus.

They were welcome here as labor. They arrived here and were individually checked out for health problems and the possibility of other undesirable traits and put into quarantine as needed and some were sent back because of a cough or a sneeze or some other physical or perceived mental ailment which could be mild or could be not so mild. They were then issued papers and then and only then were they allowed to mingle with the rest of the nation.
302 posted on 04/26/2006 1:07:09 PM PDT by Vaquero ("An armed society is a polite society" Robert A. Heinlein)
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To: Vaquero

Yes, but they were accepted with no proof of ID, etc.

That was not a perfect comparison by any means (they were quarantined, etc.)

I was making the point that there was little oversight of immigration for many years, and many were passed through that could not qualify today.


303 posted on 04/26/2006 1:13:21 PM PDT by A.Hun (Common sense is no longer common.)
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To: Brad's Gramma

That is how rampant the fraud is....pretty pathetic.


304 posted on 04/26/2006 1:17:48 PM PDT by BurbankKarl
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To: A.Hun

>>Doom them to lives of poverty and see then how their sentiments change<<

So in your world, we OWE them?

Interesting to see how peoples' minds work.


305 posted on 04/26/2006 1:20:03 PM PDT by SerpentDove (We will not stand by and allow politicians to destroy our country through open borders.)
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To: BurbankKarl

Even more of an argument for a guest worker program that identifies illegals and issues them a number.

I will say, there is no excuse for a firm to encourage the hiring of illegals and then try to cover it up. If you submit the same SS# 4000 times, your ass should end up in jail.


306 posted on 04/26/2006 1:20:36 PM PDT by A.Hun (Common sense is no longer common.)
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To: SerpentDove

I didn't say we owed them anything...but the fact is that many look to the US to escape poverty..

We were talking about driving Mexico towards Marxism. Hatred of the US sure would help another Chavez..


307 posted on 04/26/2006 1:25:59 PM PDT by A.Hun (Common sense is no longer common.)
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To: A.Hun

I don't blame him for the problem, only his toleration and willingness to incorporate these people into our society and economy. As for my taste, I don't give a cat's patootie about what the ROW thinks about the 'face' we are presenting. As far as I'm concerned we should be showing our ass to ROW.


308 posted on 04/26/2006 1:54:25 PM PDT by Gaffer
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To: A.Hun

"Driving Mexico to marxism"?........when you get time check out the ten planks of the Communist Manifesto vs. the Constitution and then decide for yourself which one our fedgov seems to be following.


309 posted on 04/26/2006 1:54:47 PM PDT by american spirit
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To: A.Hun

No you are wrong. An HTML page about the governor of texas does not mean it was made clear to the voters for president what bush had in mine re immigration. No way, no how.

The very idea that you and the others are trying to pass this off as "everybody knew" is plain ridiculous. You are only fooling yourselves, and you will see come election.

Enjoy your HTML confidence.


310 posted on 04/26/2006 2:31:47 PM PDT by Praxeus
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To: carton253
Hyperbole isn't measured by length...

So? Still waiting for an example of my use of hyperbole in this thread...

Truth is not hyperbole.

311 posted on 04/26/2006 3:21:51 PM PDT by Paul Ross (We cannot be for lawful ordinances and for an alien conspiracy at one and the same moment.-Cicero)
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To: Paul Ross
When I read this thread and your posts are included, I get the overwhelming sense that you expect the President to go down to the border with his shotgun and prowl the borders.

The President is upholding his oath. The institutions are in place to protect the border. They are being overrun... I understand that.

The President believes the best thing we can do is make them guest workers and give them the ability to come out of the dark so they can be documented and sent home after time.

So, when you post that the President is not upholding his oath...it's hyperbole. It is overstated, overwrought, over dramatic, and wrong. He isn't going to solve the problem in the way this thread thinks he should. But that difference in opinion doesn't mean he is shirking his oath or duty.

312 posted on 04/26/2006 3:31:11 PM PDT by carton253 (Al-Qa'eda are not the Viet Cong. If you exit, they'll follow. And Americans will die...)
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Comment #313 Removed by Moderator

To: Vaquero
and leaving open borders is not a conservative principle. I guess thats where the the 'compassionate' prefex to conservative came from

Open borders is a capitalist free market principle. But at times, the mercantilist enemies of capitalism find it convenient to profit form it. There are many types of pro-immigration Republicans that form a coalition of strange bedfellows... not to mention the Dems and other strange bedfellows.

1. Libertarian Republicans like me and Eric Dondero are free market capitalist pro-immigration Republicans.
2. Compassionate conservaties include Bush and here in IL St Rep Froehlich, St Sen Rauschenberger and others.
3. Mercantilists who believe that the government should "help"... help business, help poor people, help whomever.
4. Businessmen who like the willing workers.
5. PTA (soccer) moms who are afraid of being called "racist"... and who like to call others that.
6. Karl Rove types who see a large bloc of people who are very conservative in their value system.

The other side(s) also are coalitions of strange bedfellows, including many Dems and others. The Dem base is very divided on the issue. Leaders like Hilary are doing focus groups and polling to find out what their position on the issue is.

314 posted on 04/26/2006 3:40:52 PM PDT by spintreebob (what's important is not the facts of the case, but the seriousness of the allegations)
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To: shortstop

"and how the Mexican government handles immigrants to their country. "

I don't dispute that these laws may be on the books. But where is your proof that they are enforced. I've gone to Mexico 'illegally' several times with full knowledge of at least some officials. It didn't seem their custom to enforce much of anything.... except for a couple looking for leverage to get a bribe from a naive tourist. I've had offers of jobs in Mexico (which my ex-Mexican wife rejected for me). There was no expectation that any kind of enforcement of anything would block my employment there.


315 posted on 04/26/2006 3:48:52 PM PDT by spintreebob (what's important is not the facts of the case, but the seriousness of the allegations)
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To: sinkspur
You sound exactly like the Know-Nothings, who thought all those unwashed Irish Catholics coming ashore in the 1840s would doom the nation.

And you sound oblvious to the problem. ; )

316 posted on 04/26/2006 3:51:22 PM PDT by Fruitbat
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To: doc30
The problem is that to come here legally, it's a nightmare. A legal immigrant seeking to bring in his wife and kids has to wait over 10 years. Illegals just hop the fence and bypass the immigration hassles. And now Bush will reward them while the legals still struggle with a terrible immigration system. The current bill will allow illegals to have legal status and to be able to bring in their out of country relatives - 30 million in total! That's almost a third of Mexico! Meanwhile, legal immigrants get screwed with long, difficult and expensive processing times.

Right, that's my point. Crime pays in this way.

We'll be large part Spanish speaking in this country soon. It can only fragment us, not bring us together.

317 posted on 04/26/2006 3:52:38 PM PDT by Fruitbat
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To: Fruitbat
And you sound oblvious to the problem. ; )

My previous post went right over your head. Know-Nothing nativism reigns!

318 posted on 04/26/2006 3:57:50 PM PDT by sinkspur (Things are about to happen that will answer all your questions and solve all your problems.)
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To: tobton

re: "No immgration laws during ... Early immigration laws came in in the late 1800's"

There have always been immigration laws. There have not always been immigration papers and bureaucracies. Each immigrant was presumed (more or less) innocent of the "immigration laws" until proven guilty.

There have always been laws against people of low moral character from immigrating to the USA, including murderers, robbers, rapists, prostitutes, drug addicts, homosexuals and other undesireables. Up for debate in the early years was whether Catholics and other non-Christians were people of low moral character. My ancestors insisted that anyone who served alcohol in church and approved of the use of alcohol in the home was inherently immoral.

1800-1840 my ancestors came up the bay between PA and MD and walked off the boat into PA. They were called weird but nobody asked them for "papers". Many of them still don't vote because that is "too worldly". (Rove is pandering for their votes in PA also.)


319 posted on 04/26/2006 4:00:28 PM PDT by spintreebob (what's important is not the facts of the case, but the seriousness of the allegations)
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To: sinkspur
Well, am I correct in my belief or not? I can only conclude...yes.

Please don't tell me you think the R's are going to get more than a handful of those voters for decades to come!

This country will be swamped with liberals. Or is that the true motive of the open borders crowd after all?

320 posted on 04/26/2006 4:02:55 PM PDT by texasbluebell
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