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To: Sherman Logan

Are you making the point that because you disagree about the roots of the modern Left that the rest of my observations/analysis are invalid?

It is true, Marx did not invent the Left, but he was the most influential in consolidating the previous thought into an integrated system, which carried forward from there to the present. There are few Leftists who bypassed Marx from the earlier roots.

There are some aspects of Modern Leftism that are even rooted in Calvinism — particularly the elitist aspects.

An over-simplification, perhaps, of Calvinism is that one is born Saved or damned. Aristocrats-by-birth in agrarian medievalist Europe justified their relative wealth in those terms. So those who are rich are so because they have been Chosen while the rest are rehearsing their fates in eternal damnation in their earthly poverty.

Calvinists saw the Enlightenment and the subsequent limited representative governments and the consequent Industrial Revolution as bordering on heretical; people who otherwise would be poor would be able to rise up through their own effort and ingenuity. In their eyes, this was thwarting Divine Will.

This developed in the Leftist elites in secularized form by continuing this distrust of ordinary people rising from poverty by hard work and invention. To a modern Leftist, anyone can invent something, it takes special talent to cultivate connections. And of course, anyone born into a prominent Leftist family is the equivalent of royalty [e.g. the Kennedys].

Those who attain economic success, w/o being vetted by the existing ruling class are derisively referred to as Noveau Riche. This is particularly so if the person created a business, invented something or otherwise bypassed the accepted means of rising up through the ranks. The process had to have been dishonest or criminal in some way in their eyes. Their means of success often entails climbing over bodies in political blood-sport, so an industrialist obviously climbed over the bodies of his workers.

The elites within the Left believe that the only legitimate means of attaining economic success is via the media, politics [and law] or the entertainment industry. In all of those cases, people are vetted by the creme of the elite. Being accepted only coincidentally is the result of hard work. What is more important is that they LIKE you.

The epitome of this are the various talent shows and reality programs wherein Our Betters are empaneled to judge if an aspiring member is good enough to be one of them — using entirely subjective and fleeting standards.

Somebody who builds a factory makes them uncomfortable. That is why they admire the celebrity tooling around in her pink Bentley, but begrudge the corporate CEO his Mercedes.


11 posted on 09/01/2014 1:10:31 PM PDT by walford (https://www.facebook.com/wralford [feel free to friend me] @wralford on Twitter)
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To: walford
The foundational epistemological position of all ‪‎Leftist‬ thought is Marxist dialectical materialism.

I am not disagreeing with a lot of what you say. Merely trying to point out that your lede sentence is simply not true.

Marx is the dominant root of modern Leftist thought. But he is most certainly not its only source. Which is what you said.

For instance, in the late 19th and early 20th centuries various anarchist ideologies competed strongly with Marxism. And many of them hated Marx, and Marxists returned the favor. But the anarchists were indisputably Leftist.

See the infighting in the Spanish Republic.

14 posted on 09/01/2014 1:26:23 PM PDT by Sherman Logan (Perception wins most of the battles. Reality wins ALL the wars.)
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To: walford
Calvinists saw the Enlightenment and the subsequent limited representative governments and the consequent Industrial Revolution as bordering on heretical; people who otherwise would be poor would be able to rise up through their own effort and ingenuity. In their eyes, this was thwarting Divine Will.

As a Calvinist, I have some familiarity with Calvinist thought, including not only soteriological but social and political dimensions as well. What you are describing here is unrecognizable to me. What I know of the subject suggests rather the opposite, that Calvinist ideas played a significant role in using constitutional and representative government as a tool to neutralize to some degree the corrupting effects of original sin, essentially by putting cages around anyone who would seek power over others. Can you cite to sources on your remarkable assertions?

30 posted on 09/01/2014 7:12:40 PM PDT by Springfield Reformer (Winston Churchill: No Peace Till Victory!)
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To: walford; Springfield Reformer
Calvinists saw the Enlightenment and the subsequent limited representative governments and the consequent Industrial Revolution as bordering on heretical; people who otherwise would be poor would be able to rise up through their own effort and ingenuity. In their eyes, this was thwarting Divine Will.

‘He who will not honor the memory and respect the influence of Calvin knows but little of the origin of American liberty.’
George Bancroft

‘If the average American citizen were asked, who was the founder of America, the true author of our great Republic, he might be puzzled to answer. We can imagine his amazement at hearing the answer given to this question by the famous German historian, Ranke, one of the profoundest scholars of modern times. Says Ranke, ‘John Calvin was the virtual founder of America.'
The Creed of Presbyterians, p. 119 by E. W. Smith,

Calvinism in America by Loraine Boettner

Cordially,

46 posted on 09/03/2014 4:22:47 PM PDT by Diamond (He has erected a multitude of new offices, and sent hither swarms of officers to harass our people,)
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