[WayneS]

It also wants us to accept prima facie statements made concerning innocence which is what is otherwise objected to if the argument is prima facie acceptance of guilt.

Why shouldn't we accept the idea that people are innocent until proven guilty?

Why does doing so appear to bother you so much?

[ifinnegan]

“Why shouldn’t we accept the idea that people are innocent until proven guilty?”

Of course this is the case. The accused do not need to prove innocence, accuser must prove guilt in court.

But that is not relevant to the point I made concerning acceptance of claims.

I can no more accept the claim that all these arrested bikers are guilty than the claim that they are all innocent and being railroaded.

There is no way for me to know either is the case, nor for anyone else commenting on this issue here.