“Youths” Kick Man to Death on Crowded Antwerp Bus

The Brussels Journal ^ | June 26, 2006 | Paul Belien

[Blueflag]

Joan --

you are in Mexifornia. Please don't generalize from your particulars. Here in GA we have our issues, but from my experience, the folks here deal with rowdy kids better. Part of the reason in ATL itself is that the administration of Atlanta, for all of its warts, won't put up with rowdy youths of any color or national origin messin' with the ATL. MARTA has its issues, BUT the MARTA cops fell and act empowered, and they do their job (when you have one on the bus/train.)

Sure you can run into problems. No argument. BUT ... we do tend to deal with our own.

[Blueflag]

ruda --

Remember, you live in NY.

[Vectorian]

'One, total numbers don't tell the whole story, as the rate per x number of population is a more telling figure. The US population is over 300 million, vs. quite a bit less for the UK. Plus, the "handgun murder rate" will differ from the overall murder rate (murders committed using any kind of weapon, including bare hands).'

Fair point - here's the figures for murders per capita with firearms. It doesn't help your argument either! :D

'Second, not all handgun deaths are innocent victims.'

The figures I quoted are for murders with firearms as defined by the police. I understand some of those people may have deserved to die, but probably not enough to explain the difference between 62 murders in a country of 60m versus 8259 in a country of 300m, unless 8197 of your murders were bad guys! :D

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Sure, give me a sec to find it.

[thoughtomator]

Todd Beamer would disagree with you.

[Vectorian]

'I've been to Antwerpen. It never struck me as being a violent city.'

Same with me. Perhaps the rarity of the event makes it news. Every single firearm murder here in the UK makes it onto national TV as it's very rare. If the 23 firearm murders per day in the US all made it to national TV, it would be a very boring show! :D

[Dionysius]

And the people are clamoring for protection, not justice. How low on the cowardice scale can Europeans go?

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Antonio Caeiro

[snip]

A man who admitted stabbing a suspected burglar with a bread knife to protect his wife and child is being investigated for assault. Antonio Caeiro, 33, who said he wounded a 19-year-old intruder at his home in Great Yarmouth, Norfolk, said yesterday that he would do the same again to defend his family.

The incident has similarities with the case of Tony Martin, the Norfolk farmer who was convicted of manslaughter and jailed for shooting dead a teenage burglar in 1999.

[cowtowney]

a real horrorshow, my little islama-droogies

I need to go watch Clockwork Orange again and think Muslim Youts. Stanley Kubrick was a bright guy.

[Vectorian]

'And the people are clamoring for protection, not justice. How low on the cowardice scale can Europeans go?'

It's no better in the US - even back in 1964 Kitty Genovese could be stabbed to death in Kew Gardens, Queens while 38 good Americans stood by and did nothing. They didn't even call the police. Cowardice is a matter for individuals, not countries.

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I don't know how that Caeiro story turned out. I haven't heard anything else about it.

[agere_contra]

You are right about the precedents.

However, Maximum Leader Blair made it clear about a year(?) or so ago that it was ok to defend yourself in Britain (gee thanks Tony!). He could see the way public opinion was going, I guess.

[Sisku Hanne]

In some very troubled inner cities you may occasionally have this sort of thing. But it's more likely gang on gang violence, not roaming thugs terrorizing citizens. An incident or two of that in most any neighborhood, and the citizens would do something about it...watch groups, defending themselves, raising absolute heck with the police department who would definitely step up patrols.

Look at the "terrorizing transvestites" story in New Orleans from this week. Probably the most broken, lawless city in America right now. The shop owners are banding together to protect each other and arming themselves since there are not enough police. Those trannies won't be around very long.

[Vectorian]

Antonio Caeiro

Thanks for the link. Antonio stabbed a man in self-defence and was arrested while the police made sure it was self-defence and not some other crime. He was then released without charge. Seems perfectly reasonable for police to investagte when someone is seriously wounded and ensure that it was self-defence. If the US police find a man standing over a body holding a knife dripping with blood and he tells them it was self-defence, they just take his word for it do they?

[AppyPappy]

Yeah but these happened in broad daylight.We have more gun crimes because tada, we are allowed to have guns. In England, the only citizens with guns are the criminals.

[agere_contra]

Cowardice is a matter for individuals, not countries.

Profound and true. Also: none of us really know just how much grit we really have. All we can do is to try to be prepared, physically and mentally, for when our manhood is tested.

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I found this old story from 2002. Scary article. A few examples about people trying to defend themselves against thugs.

http://www.mises.org/misesreview_detail.asp?control=215

[Sisku Hanne]

By all means, please post them. We'll cheer and say "at least there's some people who still get it...good on ya, mate". Brits are famous for their good manners. Represent.

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The intruder was arrested near by on suspicion of burglary. Police also arrested Mr Caeiro on suspicion of assault, and later released him on bail pending further inquiries.

The police will investigate the case and can decide not to charge Mr Caeiro. Alternatively they can send a file of the evidence to the Crown Prosecution Service which will decide whether there is a case to answer and whether it would be in the public interest to prosecute.

Do you have an article where the investigation was concluded and he wasn't charged? I'd like to read it, just to have an ending to the story.

[AppyPappy]

Bottom line Vect. Your government believes you can't be trusted with a firearm. What does that say?