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To: MonroeDNA
Ever read the Declaration of Independance? You know, the document our country was founded on?

Yes. But unfortunately for you, Thomas Jefferson didn't create the universe.

"When in the Course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation. We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — "

The latter part is of course pure mythology. Government did not begin as a free contract among sovereign individuals who voluntarily entered into a "social contract" to secure the "rights" that were theirs from "the state of nature." Locke and the others simply had to pretend this was the case in order to change the current systems. But however useful it may be, it's still a myth. Funny how the people who depend on it are the same ones who insist that Ezra wrote the Torah and then "retrojected" it into the days of Moses!

The purpose of government, here in the US anyway, is to secure the inalieanable rights of the people. Funny, I can't seem to find anything about enforcing God's laws and restraining people's evil inclanation.

The Declaration of Independence isn't the "DNA" of the Universe. The Torah is.

But perhaps you need your evil inclinations restrained.

Funny, but I kind of had the idea that the most rational rationalist defended locking people up or even executing them under certain conditions. How does the mere absence of a Creator and Ultimate Meaning make such measures magically more "humane?" Do the convicts being raped / people being fried in the electric chair derive comfort from reflecting in their final moment of agony that "the universe is a closed system of causes and effects?"

"Reason" can excuse anything that religion can, including torture (as Alan Dershowitz has demonstrated). But it cannot (contrary to "rationalist" dogma) create or sustain objective meaning where none exists.

Any more admirers of Locke/Jefferson/Hume/Smith/Voltaire/Rousseau want to try to shame or horrify me by calling me "un-American?" I'll simply smile and say "d@mn right!"

I'm a Theocrat! You can't insult me by calling me what I am!

402 posted on 11/09/2006 3:31:14 PM PST by Zionist Conspirator (Vayo'mer HaShem, za`aqat Sedom va`Amorah ki rabbah; vechatta'tam, ki khavedah me'od.)
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To: Zionist Conspirator

No, you are a loon.

Everytime you open your mouth, the world's IQ drops a point. You are loon squared. You are loon to the tenth power.

Your looniness has caused bridges to collapse, ant infestations, and crop circles.

When you open your mouth, people in mental institutions rattle the bars with joy.

They all hum the same song: "the latter part is pure mythology."

You have to be a professor of something, to be that dumb.


403 posted on 11/09/2006 3:39:51 PM PST by MonroeDNA (Love God, question religeon. Don't blame the customer for not buying your product.)
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To: Zionist Conspirator
"But unfortunately for you, Thomas Jefferson didn't create the universe."

Yes, but he did found our country, along with others. The universe is large; perhaps you should find another space?

"The latter part is of course pure mythology."

The Declaration of independance is mythology???

Either you are a public teacher, or a moron.

404 posted on 11/09/2006 3:45:14 PM PST by MonroeDNA (Love God, question religeon. Don't blame the customer for not buying your product.)
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To: Zionist Conspirator
"The Declaration of Independence isn't the "DNA" of the Universe. The Torah is."

The only person talking about the DNA of the universe is you.

Nutjob.

406 posted on 11/09/2006 3:51:37 PM PST by MonroeDNA (Love God, question religeon. Don't blame the customer for not buying your product.)
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To: Zionist Conspirator
I'm a Theocrat! You can't insult me by calling me what I am!

Historically, we've had our experiences with theocrats, and found it necessary to make explicit provisions against them.

410 posted on 11/09/2006 4:02:57 PM PST by tacticalogic ("Oh bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: Zionist Conspirator
>>Any more admirers of Locke/Jefferson/Hume/Smith/Voltaire/Rousseau want to try to shame or horrify me by calling me "un-American?" I'll simply smile and say "d@mn right!"<<

I've got interest in calling you names - I took 7 years of French in high school and college and am not that fond of Voltaire or Rousseau. Had I lived in the day I would have preferred Hamilton and Washington to Jefferson.

But I dig John Locke and his second treatise seems to be the rational basis for establishing a government of men.

God has given us commandments but except when God has anointed a King it does not automatically follow that men are entitled to put themselves in charge and decide how others should act. To be legitimate that power of government must come directly or indirectly from the people.

But the $64 questions is "did you just say that that you are in fact un-American and proud of it?" Surely you didn't mean that. And if you did mean that - why do you hang out here - this is a pretty darn pro-American board.
434 posted on 11/10/2006 2:42:29 PM PST by gondramB (It wasn't raining when Noah built the ark.)
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To: Zionist Conspirator
Sorry - that was a typo - should have said "I've got NO interest in calling you names.
435 posted on 11/10/2006 2:44:07 PM PST by gondramB (It wasn't raining when Noah built the ark.)
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