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Vanity: If a true single payer healthcare system would save money would you be for it?
Self

Posted on 03/14/2013 8:11:08 AM PDT by ksen

http://www.pnhp.org/facts/single-payer-system-cost

http://truecostblog.com/2009/05/13/how-much-would-universal-healthcare-cost/


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Chit/Chat; Health/Medicine
KEYWORDS: marxism; singlepayer
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To: Little Ray
I am not going to accept paying extra for lame, lazy, weak, stupid and perverted on the grounds that it might cost less overall. If anything, I’d cut expense by cutting them off.

Oh, then you are all for death panels as long as you get to pick who dies?

61 posted on 03/14/2013 8:45:58 AM PDT by ksen (". . . organized greed always defeats disorganized democracy" - Matt Taibbi)
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To: ksen
That's not true either

Also an interesting article, but completely irrelevant. People in Sweden, overall, are healthier than people in the US, overall...THAT is all this article shows. But, that is NOT proof that their health care system is better. There are MANY other important, highly correlated variables.

For starters, their population is extremely homogenous. They eat healthier, excercise far more, live in a heathier environment, don't eat the same crappy food we do, and don't have nearly as much economic stratification in their society.

I think THIS is a far better measure of who has the best health system:

http://www.webmd.com/cancer/news/20080716/cancer-survival-rates-vary-by-country

(sorry.... my HTML skills are limited)

I also judge by: Where do the world's super-weathy go to get health care treatment.

They come here, not Iceland.

62 posted on 03/14/2013 8:46:25 AM PDT by SomeCallMeTim ( The best minds are not in government. If any were, business would hire them)
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To: waynesa98

bttt


63 posted on 03/14/2013 8:48:27 AM PDT by First_Salute (May God save our democratic-republican government, from a government by judiciary.)
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To: ksen

I’m all for it. Just look at what a good job the government does running welfare, social security, the US postal service - Oh wait, those are all broke. Never mind.


64 posted on 03/14/2013 8:50:41 AM PDT by Arrowhead1952 (A pen in the hand of 0 bummer more dangerous than a gun in the hands of 200 million citizens.)
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To: ksen
That's a different conversation about the role of lobbyists and the power they can wield over congressmen.


The Leftist SEIU doesn't want their members to have it.
Why would you want it?
65 posted on 03/14/2013 8:51:15 AM PDT by RedMDer (Support Free Republic)
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To: ksen
Dear Mr / Mrs Ksen,

We at the Super Cheap Single Payer Health Care System (SCSPHC) have reviewed your need for life saving surgery and have determined you are too old, too unimportant, too risky, or on our political kill list. Your surgery has been denied. But the wonderful news is you have been placed on the Comfort Care Plan, which consists of 2 aspirin a day and a I LOVE Obama Hypoallergenic pillow with 100% egyptian cotton pillowcase (your choice of color- blue or light blue). Thank you for paying your Super Cheap Single Payer Health Care System (SCSPHC) bill in a timely manner all these years.

Sincerely,
The SCSPHC board of appointed anonymous people

66 posted on 03/14/2013 8:52:09 AM PDT by Casie (democrats destroy)
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To: ksen

Neither is a sustainable system. The current merely hasn’t collapsed yet from it’s monopoly price system/government malfeasance. “single payer” (i.e. socialized) medicine falls apart eventually too, the only reason the European ones held for so long was because we carried their defense spending for decades...


67 posted on 03/14/2013 8:52:15 AM PDT by Axenolith (Government blows, and that which governs least, blows least...)
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To: SomeCallMeTim

How much of this innovation is because of government spending on basic research?


68 posted on 03/14/2013 8:52:19 AM PDT by ksen (". . . organized greed always defeats disorganized democracy" - Matt Taibbi)
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To: ksen
No. I do not want to be, nor for my fellow Americans, to be, dependent on the government for health care. I do not want health care decisions made for me or my loved ones, based solely on my political persuasion, nor on whether I can continue to “contribute” to society as a taxpayer. There will be no usefulness to the government for anyone who cannot pay in any longer and will not vote Democratic.

IMHO, all those who “trust” the government with these issues are extremely naive.

69 posted on 03/14/2013 8:52:39 AM PDT by NEMDF
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To: Casie

Sounds like a normal letter people get every day now from the wonderful private insurance carriers.


70 posted on 03/14/2013 8:54:03 AM PDT by ksen (". . . organized greed always defeats disorganized democracy" - Matt Taibbi)
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To: ksen

No.


71 posted on 03/14/2013 8:54:30 AM PDT by pgkdan ( "Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not." ~Thomas Jefferson)
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To: NEMDF

And yet you have no problem being dependent upon the federal government to keep us free from invasion. So obviously they are capable of doing some things right.


72 posted on 03/14/2013 8:55:09 AM PDT by ksen (". . . organized greed always defeats disorganized democracy" - Matt Taibbi)
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To: ksen

In no way would I be for “single payer” aka government monopoly on doctors and medicine. America was not chartered as a communist country. I will and would pay more on the black market just to avoid single-payer. It is evil. It places life and death decisions in the hands of unelected people that you cannot get rid of.


73 posted on 03/14/2013 8:55:38 AM PDT by backwoods-engineer (Blog: www.BackwoodsEngineer.com)
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To: ksen
if a single payer system ended up being cheaper than our current system would you be for it.

It is a mistake to accept the abstract conceptual framework of libtards. A single payer system would not be cheaper than the current system unless there was a drastic deterioration of quality and quantity of service.

Egalitarianism and making something free to the individual and chargeable to the group as a whole is to make consumption of the individual virtually costless, which leads to the abolition of cost in the spending of income, which leads individuals to demand everything.

The increase in demand leads to:

1) an overall increase in cost of medical care as a whole to the taxpayers.
2) a decrease in quality and quality of medical care supplied by doctors to individuals.

The bureaucratizing of medicine and the control of doctor's fees and treatments turns doctors into slaves, and ultimately makes medicine unattractive as a profession, which will lead to a decrease in the supply of doctors and a doctor shortage.

To control costs, the government will have to resort to death panels, a prohibition of many procedures, and opposition to medical advances, in order to save money.

74 posted on 03/14/2013 8:56:51 AM PDT by mjp ((pro-{God, reality, reason, egoism, individualism, natural rights, limited government, capitalism}))
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To: ksen

No. Not for sale at any price.

SnakeDoc


75 posted on 03/14/2013 8:58:31 AM PDT by SnakeDoctor ("I've shot people I like more for less." -- Raylan Givens)
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To: ksen
Sounds like a normal letter people get every day now from the wonderful private insurance carriers.

And if they do, they are free to find another carrier, or, pay attention now, pay for their health care themselves.

Single payer systems outlaw private transactions.

76 posted on 03/14/2013 8:59:14 AM PDT by SoothingDave
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To: ksen
How much of this innovation is because of government spending on basic research?

I don't know... My belief is: Very Little.

Most government research money I see gifted to universities is politically driven and wasteful.

People with a profit motive spend their money more wisely.

77 posted on 03/14/2013 8:59:45 AM PDT by SomeCallMeTim ( The best minds are not in government. If any were, business would hire them)
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To: ksen

The government “keeping us free from invasion” is nothing comparable to the government making every trivial decision about the health care of every resident of the United States. And, as several posters have mentioned, the government does NOT have a good track record with the administration of detailed systems and programs. I could not have any expectation that they would suddenly improve in these skills. I don’t see a lot of competition in the “keeping us free from invasion” realm. I believe that is one of the premises of the Constitution. I don’t recall health care being in there at all.


78 posted on 03/14/2013 9:03:35 AM PDT by NEMDF
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To: ksen
And yet routinely the US ranks behind many other countries that do have a universal heath care system.

{sigh} You again. I'm not wasting the time today.

79 posted on 03/14/2013 9:04:06 AM PDT by Cyber Liberty (I am a dissident. Will you join me? My name is John....)
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To: ksen
Ronald Reagan on Socialism- Don't say we weren't warned!
80 posted on 03/14/2013 9:05:13 AM PDT by RedMDer (Support Free Republic)
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