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To: RinaseaofDs
Are you saying that not a single advocate for theism admitted, right up front, that at the core is nothing more than faith?

I can’t know this, of course, but in looking back are you sure that none, no one, admitted up front that everything about God, or a supreme being, is about faith?

Some theists do admit that. Others claim that quantum mechanics and general relativity are scientific evidence for God.

Some theists say that evolution is antithetical to God; others claim that evolution PROVES God.

Some theists claim that God doesn't cause bad things to happen; others claim that God punishes the unjust in the real world.

Theists are absolutely all over the place. You ask 10 different random theists to describe God and you'll get 10 different answers. It's a situation that is inevitable when the majority of theists believe in the whole "personal God" concept. God can literally mean anything at any time to anyone, and when prompted on the inherent contradictions, some think that claiming "faith" solves the contradictions.

It doesn't for me though.

403 posted on 05/06/2014 8:42:43 AM PDT by GunRunner
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To: GunRunner

Dying in front of a large number of atheists and polytheists and then coming back from the dead in front of large numbers of people is what did it for me. Good thing the Romans were such sticklers for records.

On the notion of many people having many different perspectives on God, this isn’t surprising.

I come from a family of two brothers. Our perspectives on my Dad are unique from each one of us.

Many have claimed they were God, or a god. Few had people predict it almost 700 years before it happen and then have it happen the way it did. You say you are going to die and come back, say you are going to do it so I can be with His Father, and then actually do it in front of large crowds of people, I’m probably going to believe you are who you say you are.

This, for me, is the evidence, and I believe it as it was written.

This man makes claims of an afterlife, and says that if I simply believe all of this is true, then I can keep my money and just die believing it and go to Heaven.

It is this claim that merited investigation. I am unconvinced of an internal locus of control, and of alien beings intervening, and of many other paths to ‘enlightenment’.

Christianity seemed the most ‘human’, in that the enlightenment comes to you. All that is asked if faith, not perfection, or alms, or even atonement.

Just faith.

As such, your relating how folks who believed in God tried to describe and justify it to you through KNOWLEDGE or FACT seemed, well, all too true, but way off the mark.

There are aspects of belief about God’s role in other things, such as the creation of all things, etc., that may touch on quantum mechanics, but its just speculation about other things that are, in the end, not that important.

Anyway, that there are folks out there like George Will explains the suicide rate being as high as it is. His attitude seems so Sartresque.

You are probably aware that CS Lewis and GK Chesterton were once great agnostics and went over to Christianity. It was Orwell that convinced Lewis before Orwell died at the tender age of 48.


412 posted on 05/06/2014 12:44:29 PM PDT by RinaseaofDs (.)
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