Posted on 05/29/2002 2:38:14 AM PDT by oceanperch
How come no one hs started a condolance(sp) thread for The Levys?
I'd like to know who was the idiot who recommended the Levys hire Monica's Mom's lawyer. What a disservice this did to finding the killer. If the Levys (and I don't blame them -- it surely was a horrible time for them) had hired a PI instead, he (and even amateurs) would have realized that parts of the park were not searched. Instead, many thought that the reason the parents hired a lawyer was because they knew Chandra had taken off and would need one.
Well said! Chandra was the cursed child of cursed children. Society up-ended a long time ago and this is just the fruit of it. The parents failed their daughter. God killed Eli for the same...and his sons.
And you would say that to the Levy's face? It's a little like saying the people who build tall buildings are the reason 3000+ innocent people died in NY and elswhere.
The parents failed their daughter.
Sanctimonious BS.
Well, then I guess that settles that. A young 24-year old girl with her entire life ahead of her is apparently murdered and her body is left in the woods to rot, and NO ONE here even bothers to put out a few words of condolence or reflection to their family.
I think oceanperch's observation is right on the mark. Many here have been so obsessed with trying to play amateur detective on the Levy murder that they overlook our humanity in the process.
2sheep: You should be ashamed of yourself for using the death of someone's child to offhandedly throw down some scripture. Your self-righteousness and lack of human decency gives Christians a bad name.
Sure, Chandra made some stupid mistakes, as all of us have done in our youth. But this doesn't mean that God has lost sight of her, and does not give you license to dance on her grave, as you have just done.
What you people need here is less scripture-quoting and more human understanding.
P.S.: Oh, and if you think I'm some kind of DU distruptor you can check my profile to see that I have been an FR member longer than most of you probably have.
Well said. This is a terrible, terrible tragedy and our unequivocal prayers and sympathy should flow abundantly to this family.
Ro 1:32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.
The scripture says that they who do these things -- the things Chandra did -- are worthy only of death, that the wages of sin is death and that they are headed for the lake of fire. In 1 Sam 1-4 the Word clearly shows (and these things are written to us as examples) that God judged Eli's house, killed Eli and his sons who practiced evil.
1Sa 3:13 For I have told him that I will judge his house for ever for the iniquity which he knoweth; because his sons made themselves vile, and he restrained them not.
It was Baal-worshipping Jezebel who taught and seduced the Lord's servant to commit fornication. God destroyed her, the dogs licked up her bones and her body became as dung on the earth. The Lord is making enormous pictures for all to see...if they will. Click here for the bigger pic in regard to the fall of America: 657
Re 2:20 Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols.
21 And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not.
22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds.
23 And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.
No doubt the Lord has his eye on Chandra, but she is not where you think, and she is not receiving blessings from Him for servicing Condit but rather eternal rewards of disobedience, adultery, indolatry, lies. She should have been taught better by her parents. Her father joked with her and was PROUD of her affair with a married congressmen. Her mother named her a name from some East Indian culture or religion. Check your Bible for "proud" and "pride" and "strange gods" and see how it will bless you.
The God-fearing who follow Him in holiness and obedience reap the rewards of His goodness. The God-despising who do anything they want with no regard to consequences are sowing to the wind shall reap the whirlwind of destruction. They are dead men/women walking. To believe otherwise is contrary to scripture. For a person to profess to be a Christian and believe God rewards lasciviousnes, mean that person does not believe the Bible and is therefore an unbeliever, a hypocrite and shall receive a hypocrite's reward.
Ro 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Jude 1:4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.
Ro 11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.
Re 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
There is more to foregiveness than just saying, "I'm sorry." Forgiveness requires Repentance, Restitution and a heartfelt intention of holy living manifested by evidence of Repentance. Like so many things in the apostate Church, forgiveness has been glossed over until it has become next to meaningless because so many treat it as an EXCUSE. Others say that we all sin and should all "forgive one another" because no one can live a holy life. My mother didn't let me get away with "everybody does it," and God will not excuse others either who despise His Word/instruction/commandments, thus denying Him.
Churches used to sing, "Trust and Obey," and now they have made themselves gods in their own eyes and sing, "Believe and Receive." Instead of daughters of Job, we see daughters of Jezebel. Repent means to STOP, turn around, go the other way.
John the Baptist said, Mt 3:10 And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: therefore every tree which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
Time is running out for many who don't understand this principle, we are to lay the axe to the root of sin in our own lives and live holy lives. Chandra didn't. Love is NOT having to say you're sorry. It is keeping His commandments and the evidence is what we do. Those who don't, prove that they don't love and know Him or His Word. Today America has despised and rejected the commandments by taking them out of schools, from gov't and public buildings and judgment is nigh.
John 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.
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Heb 12:25 See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:
This thread is as good a place as any.
Prayers for Chandra Levy; prayers and condolences for her family.
"Don't judge" is false doctrine or at least twisted from its original meaning. It has been poured onto the apostate masses to deceive them into tolerating sin in their own lives and others' lives as they go happily down the broad way to destruction. The Bible says Ye shall know them by their fruit and make righteous judgment and there is no way to do either without judging which may be just a matter of observing fruit/works/deeds.
The Bible also says that if a man will examine (judge) himself, he would need no man to judge him. It is precisely because people don't judge that a lot of problems result. Wise followers of the Lord depart from inquity, purify themselves and walk in holiness, being perfected and conformed to the image of Jesus ChristYeshua, not the image of the world. They are in effect getting the bean out of their own eye so they can see clearly. When they are perfected, they can more readily judge what is imperfect, by the Word and the Holy Spirit. If a person is a true believer, he or she will be in this process of being conformed and will stop sinning. If he does not, he opens himself to attack by the devil:
1Jo 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.
Nevertheless, we don't condemn others, but rather point them to the Lord and say "Hear Him!" and if they do "Hear Him!" the Lord will point to their sin and convict them of the sins from which they should repent. True believers are regularly met by people who say, "Don't judge," because the accusers do not judge themselves and know that if others did judge them righteously, that their sin of hypocrisy would be apparent.
2Ti 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine, 3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
"Judge Rightly" Is Not Some Guy’s Name
by Bob EnyartAn absurd question has stymied the Church. Should Christians judge?
Of course believers should judge. To not judge is to be indecent, not to mention inhuman. The only kingdom in which there is no judging is the plant kingdom. For of living things, vegetables do not judge. In the animal kingdom, though, judgment is a must, and members of the Kingdom of God must do the most judging.
Jesus repeatedly taught men to judge rightly, insisting they "judge with righteous judgment" (John 7:24) and He praised a man who "rightly judged" (Luke 7:43). Paul shamed the Corinthian Christians because there was no one among them willing to "judge the smallest matters" (1 Cor. 6:2). As the Apostle wrote, "He who is spiritual judges all things" for "we have the mind of Christ" (1Cor. 2:15-16).
The notion that judgment is wrong is a ludicrous one. Should child-molesters escape condemnation? Should rapists be free from criticism? Should society refrain from judging those arrested for murder? Should we call evil good? Or would that be a judgment too?
"Judge not" is the prayer of those who want to hide light under a basket. The cliché describes salt which has lost its flavor, which no longer seasons or preserves. Those seduced by this terrible lie are taken out of the game. As spectators on the sidelines, they only watch the spiritual battle. But they are in a comfort zone. Apathy is the craving. "Judge not" is the mantra for shirking responsibility.
Borrowing characters from C. S. Lewis, imagine this dialogue between a junior demon named Wormwood and his wicked uncle Screwtape. This fiendish exchange could have occurred a century ago.
Wormwood: Believers have so many weapons at their disposal. It is difficult to neutralize them. It takes a huge effort just to slow the work of a single Christian.
Screwtape: Your one-on-one approach is inefficient. This is the age of Madison Avenue and mass marketing. If you can undermine their whole group at once, then you’ve accomplished something.
Wormwood: Unfortunately, I’m not highly productive. In the time it takes me to frustrate one believer, I could be tempting a dozen heathens.
Screwtape: Don’t lose heart, Wormwood. We are implementing a plan to impair the whole Church with a single ploy.
Wormwood: I don’t see how that will be possible. The Christians that I’ve seen are dedicated to warning others about hell. It’s all I can do just to get one of them distracted for a short time.
Screwtape: We are going to use their Leader’s own words.
Wormwood: No! Please don’t. Don’t even joke about using His words. I can’t take it.
Screwtape: If you’re ever going to grow up to be an effective demon, you’re going to have to learn to use the Enemy’s words against Him.
Wormwood: It just seems so dangerous. Which words are you going to use?
Screwtape: "Judge not!"
Wormwood: I don’t understand why He would tell them not to judge. That’s confusing. He commanded His followers to rebuke, admonish and judge hundreds of times in His Book. And that’s what they’re out there doing. And I might add, it’s causing me no end of grief.
Screwtape: When their Leader said those words, He was speaking to hypocrites. "Judge not… you hypocrite," as He said later in the same paragraph.
Wormwood: Yeah, but how are we going to use "Judge not" to neutralize the whole Church?
Screwtape: We are going to get them to ignore the fact that He was talking to hypocrites. He said that hypocrites should not judge, at least not until they stop doing the wrong deed themselves. But we are going to make them think that none of them should judge.
Wormwood: That’s brilliant… if you can pull it off, that is. I mean, if we can get them to stop judging, then they won’t rebuke the wicked. And they won’t be able to admonish those who are sexually immoral.
Screwtape: It is even more brilliant than you realize. If we can seduce Christians into following the instructions for hypocrites, we will turn them into hypocrites. It’s like government workers who follow foolish rules so precisely they are transformed from human beings into bureaucrats; drones who mindlessly dispense red tape regardless of the misfortune they cause. The slave who willingly obeys his master, begins to conform to the master. If believers willingly submit to an instruction for hypocrites, they will conform to hypocrisy. Eventually, with a little evil luck, we might stop them from confronting unbelievers altogether because, as you know Wormwood, to confront requires judging. And if they don’t judge unbelievers, they are hypocrites, professing the Gospel but denying its power.
Wormwood: Ha, ha. I’m excited. When do we start?
Screwtape: Everything is underway already. Just do your part.
Wormwood: And that is…?
Screwtape: Make sure your targets read as little of the Book as possible. Don’t get too worried if they stick to their favorite twenty cliché verses. But make sure they remain ignorant of most of the Word.
Wormwood: Master, you are brilliant.
Screwtape: You can call me Master if you want, but don’t let the boss hear you.
A lie paralyzed the Church. To abhor evil, someone must first judge evil. God instructs men against "hypocrisy" commanding them to "abhor what is evil" (Rom. 12:9). Thus, unable to judge, and unaccustomed to abhorrence, Christians en masse become hypocrites when they obey the Hypocrites Golden Rule. For "judge not" (Mat. 7:1-5) is simply a hypocrites application of do unto others as you would have them do unto you (Mat. 7:12). "For with what judgment you judge, you will be judged" (Mat. 7:2). Judge others as you would have them do unto you inverted is Judge not if you do not want to be judged. Therefore the hypocrite does not judge. As Jesus said, "Judge not… you hypocrite" (Mat. 7:1, 5 KJV; Ezek. 16:52).
Christ kept this theme throughout His ministry. "Hypocrites," Jesus said, "why, even of yourselves, do you not judge what is right?" (Luke 12:56-57). Still, His own followers have mostly ignored the Lord’s harsh rebuke: "Hypocrite! First remove the plank from your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck out of your brother’s eye" (Mat. 7:5). "Judge Not" is the Hypocritical Oath.
"Judge Not" is hypocrite haven. He who lives in a glass house should not throw stones. Such Christians, though, should relocate. Move into "the temple of the great God, which is being built with heavy stones" (Ezra 5:8).
Christians live in the "building" for which Christ is "the chief corner stone" (Eph. 2:20). And if that Stone falls on someone it "will grind him to powder" (Mat. 21:44; Luke 20:18; cf. Ex. 32:20). It is better to be judged by a Christian than crushed by Christ.
Scripture deals with topics which range from simple to advanced truth. There is the milk which is for babes in Christ, but the meat is for men of God. The question of whether or not Christians should judge is milk. It is preschool. The newest believer discipled with any of a hundred passages would immediately understand that he must judge. Judging others is fundamental. It is not a difficult concept and should in no way be controversial.
"Everyone who partakes only in milk is unskilled in the Word of righteousness, for he is a babe" (Heb. 5:13). The Church today, however, has trouble even with milk.
Extreme ignorance of the Bible has crippled the Church. And that crippling is obvious in virtually every denomination, and in almost all local fellowships. What is the percentage of Christians who have succumbed to the "Judge not" deception? Is there even one percent of believers who have not fallen for that diversion? Surely it seems that at least 99 out of 100 are guilty of either not rebuking someone for misquoting Jesus, or of repeating the mindless "Judge not" themselves. Believers need to turn from this sin and ask God for wisdom to keep from being so easily deceived again.
Curse God and die!
Is that good advice? Word for word, it is in the Bible. Job’s wife counsels her husband to "Curse God and die" (Job 2:7). Many verses, if ripped out of context, can ruin lives. Judas "went and hanged himself" (Mat. 27:5) and as Jesus said "Go and do likewise" (Luke 10:37). The believer who lacks a hunger for God’s word is susceptible to the most absurd dangers.
A letter to the Rocky Mountain News in October 1996 about a murderer who killed two priests expressed a typical judge-not sentiment. The writer advocated incarceration and opposed execution because even the murderer is made "in the image of God" and it would be "wrong to put the image of God to death." The ‘hypocrite’ (used technically) who wrote the letter should have admitted a similar incongruity in putting the image of God in jail. But alas, muddled thinking never gets that far.
Are members of the Body of Christ today less capable than Israel whom God commanded to "judge righteously" (Deut. 1:16-17; Lev. 19:15)? Moses appointed the head of one out of every ten households as a judge (Ex. 18:25; Deut. 1:15). Should Christians look down upon the entire book of Judges? Should America eliminate all judges, or should just the Christian judges resign? Should believers ignore Paul’s admonition? For he wrote:
"Do you not know that the saints will judge the world? And if the world will be judged by you, are you unworthy to judge the smallest matters? Do you not know that we shall judge angels? How much more, things that pertain to this life? I say this to your shame. Is it so, that there is not a wise man among you, not even one, who will be able to judge between his brethren?" (1Cor. 6:2-5).
Notice that Christians "will judge the world!" (1 Cor. 6:2). For Paul said, "if the world will be judged by you…" God is the Judge of all the world who will delegate that judgment to His people. Even spirit beings will submit to believers: "Do you not know that we shall judge angels?" Then and now, believers should "judge... according to My judgments" (Ezek. 44:24) as God said. The Almighty commits judgment into the hands of His obedient servants (Rev. 20:4, 1 Tim. 5:24). This teaching is ancient for as Enoch, the seventh from Adam, said, "the Lord comes with ten thousands of His saints to execute judgment on all" (Jude 14-15).
Jesus too said, "The men of Nineveh will rise in the judgment with this generation and condemn it..." (Mat. 12:41). And as Solomon wrote, "jealously is a husband's fury; therefore, he will not spare [the adulterer] in the day of vengeance. He will accept no recompense nor will he be appeased..." (Prov. 6:34-35). God gives the responsibility for vengeance, condemnation and judgment to His servants for "every tongue which rises against you in judgment you shall condemn. This is the heritage of the servants of the Lord…" (Isa. 54:17).
Today, many believers are effectively saying, "Lord, thanks but no thanks. I’ll pass on that judgment stuff." But Paul responds, "Start judging now, because you will need the practice" (1Cor. 6:2-5). Remember, "he who is spiritual judges all things. For... we have the mind of Christ" (1 Cor. 2:15-16). And God will reward those who judge, and do the hard work: "Those who rebuke the wicked will have delight, and a good blessing will come upon them." (Prov. 24:25).
Jesus said, "Do not judge according to appearance, but judge with righteous judgment" (John 7:24). Like Don Quixote tilting at windmills, though, Christians battle an enemy that means them no harm, their inclination to judge.
Hopefully the Church will see Judge Not headed for retirement replaced with Judge Rightly.
It is not very Christian to point a finger at these poor parents and their daughter at this time of grief. It surely won't win anyone over to your way of thinking. It sounds more like the hateful God of Islam than the Judeo-Christian God of forgiveness and love.
And to the parents may they also pray for God's forgiveness and salvation in these trying times.
Her last name was Levy.
Her first name was Chaaaaaandraaa.
If your surname is Levy and you name your kid Chandra, to paraphrase Jeff Foxworthy, you might be a 60's amoralist.
You know the parents were 60's hippy freaks who were just too damn WEAK! to tell her that her relationship with Condidit was WRONG! BECAUSE THEN THEY WOULD HAVE HAD TO FACE THAT THERE IS A WRONG AND A RIGHT! And then they would have had to admit to themselves that everything they ever believed was a lie. People will do the most irresponsible things for the sake of maintaining the facades they need........
PS: I'm lapsed, so I ain't no expert on what makes a soul rest in peace. I just hope Chandra's is right now.
The Judeo-Christian God is not all forgiveness and love. Check this out: 17
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