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To: exmarine
The bible is reliable for the following reasons:
3. Prophecy: Hundreds of prophecies written before the birth of Christ (e.g. Isaiah, Micah, Psalms) were 100% literally fulfilled in Christ (e.g. place of birth, virgin birth, manner of death, atonement, resurrection, etc)


At the risk of being argumentative, my simple rebuttal to this statement is, "False." "Hundreds were 100% literally fulfilled?" That's a strong statement, one that is rarely made regarding anything but math. And speaking of math, your statement twists it a bit, no? You're saying the prophecies that were fulfilled were indeed fulfilled. Yeah, so? what of the ones that weren't? What of the ones that were time and time again in different eras fulfilled that, in totality, mean(t) nothing at all? (how many people have been the great satan now? 15?) Bible prophecy has, thankfully, become a silly sideshow these days, to most people. Yes, even most christians.

The disciples were cowards one day ... and all died for their faith. Who would die for a lie knowing it is a lie? One might die for a lie believing it is the truth but no one would die for a lie knowing it is a lie.

Fair enough, but what does this prove? I can think of 19 a-holes who died for their lie a couple Septembers ago. And how many blow themselves up for their lie in Israel every week or so. Not sure what this proves, other than humans are capable of some pretty strong faith.
4,203 posted on 07/18/2003 10:42:49 AM PDT by whattajoke
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To: whattajoke
escaped the floods of evo hell and all I got is this tshirt placemaker !
4,204 posted on 07/18/2003 10:45:14 AM PDT by f.Christian (evolution vs intelligent design ... science3000 ... designeduniverse.com --- * architecture * !)
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To: whattajoke
troll slaves r us if evos have their way monoply placemaker !
4,206 posted on 07/18/2003 10:49:16 AM PDT by f.Christian (evolution vs intelligent design ... science3000 ... designeduniverse.com --- * architecture * !)
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To: whattajoke
At the risk of being argumentative, my simple rebuttal to this statement is, "False." "Hundreds were 100% literally fulfilled?" That's a strong statement, one that is rarely made regarding anything but math. And speaking of math, your statement twists it a bit, no? You're saying the prophecies that were fulfilled were indeed fulfilled. Yeah, so? what of the ones that weren't? What of the ones that were time and time again in different eras fulfilled that, in totality, mean(t) nothing at all? (how many people have been the great satan now? 15?) Bible prophecy has, thankfully, become a silly sideshow these days, to most people. Yes, even most christians.

First, you ignored 3 of the 5 evidences I gave. Second, you can't just dismiss prophecy so cavalierly and say my statement is false without proving it false, which you have not done. This is a very deep scholarly topic and in order to even argue the point you would have to have an in depth knowledge of hebrew language and hermeneutics. But, there are roughly over 300 prophecies that have been attributed to Christ. There is no other holy book that even contains prophecy (telling history in advance), let alone fulfilled prophecy. (What do you mean by "math" - you mean math of statistical probability?) By "great satan" do you mean the man of perdition? These prophecies do not pertain to Jesus Christ, but some say they were fulfilled in Antiochus Epiphanes, or Nero, or possibly a future anti-Christ. There could be a multiple fulfilment here. Fair enough, but what does this prove? I can think of 19 a-holes who died for their lie a couple Septembers ago. And how many blow themselves up for their lie in Israel every week or so. Not sure what this proves, other than humans are capable of some pretty strong faith. Name one single prophecy concerning the messiah that wasn't fulfilled in Jesus Christ. Good luck finding it. Some prophecies may have double fulfillments - why is that a disqualifier?

Read my post again. How many of these people in your example died KNOWING they were dying for a lie. Name just one.

4,212 posted on 07/18/2003 11:25:58 AM PDT by exmarine
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To: whattajoke
Fair enough, but what does this prove? I can think of 19 a-holes who died for their lie a couple Septembers ago. And how many blow themselves up for their lie in Israel every week or so. Not sure what this proves, other than humans are capable of some pretty strong faith.

Or that people will believe anything.

No different than the Heaven's Gate cult or the Jonestown mass murder and mass suicide in Guyana.

4,213 posted on 07/18/2003 11:29:02 AM PDT by balrog666 (Universe inexorably winding down - women and children hardest hit! Film at 11.)
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