Posted on 03/23/2005 5:49:34 AM PST by xzins
>How ironic it is that this is happening during the week of Christ's crucifixion.<
The other side of this is "With God there are no coincidences!"
It's not about money. At least to her family. They have publicly stated they will release Michael from all legal and financial responsiblity, and I believe them.
These are people of faith. Devout Catholics. As Terri is, despite her husband's claims to the contrary.
Since you work for lawyers, I'm sure you know the contempt for religion that is infiltrating the practice of law. It is precisely this contempt for higher authority that is ruining the concept of justice in this society.
When justice is no longer recognized as a moral concept, it becomes mistaken for process. When process is called justice, we won't have any.
Eve Jesus was offered VINEGAR on the cross.
Yes, isn't it a strange fact that the violent kidnapping at gunpoint of Elian Gonzalez was also during Holy Week? It's as though Satan is showing us that he has his own powerful disciples in the highest places in our society, who can harrass and even kill the followers of Jesus according to the laws of our country. We can expect nothing but hatred from Satan's minions in this evil world, because as Jesus warned His children in John 15:18, 19: "If the world hates you, keep in mind that it hated Me first. If you belonged to the world, it would love you as its own. As it is, you do not belong to the world, but I have chosen you out of the world. That is why the world hates you." If you are following Jesus, you will be vilified by the evil people of this world.
The comfort is that He will be with you in these trials and at the last, will deliver His faithful ones safely to heaven.
I guarantee you there are people working right now to do what can be done, both in the state of Florida, and in the White House.
To use this situation as an excuse to bash the President is disgusting........
Yep, in your face actions by the devil's minions.
Remember the bombing of Yugoslavia during the Orthodox Holy Week?
God gave Judge Greer free will, as he gives us all. Greer, who is a Baptist, freely chose March 18 as the date upon which the tube would be removed.
The man is malicious, and one day he's going to have a lot of explaining to do, to a far Higher Court than exists on this earth.
Gives new meaning to the old phrase "I wouldn't pi** in his mouth if he was dying of thirst."
Why was a woman arrested yesterday for attempting to bring her a bottle of water? Why can't the parents attempt to feed her by mouth? If someone considers the feeding tube to be "life support", they can't also consider natural feeding by mouth to be "life support". So, let the attempt be made. If not, then this is plainly the deprivation of food and water of a woman deemed to be too mentally impaired without a strong enough possibility of significant improvement. You know what - there are many people who would meet that definition. Should they too be starved to death because they are too inconvenient to care for?
Also, even a convicted murderer is allowed a stay of execution to preserve the status quo (his life) until his case can be reviewed fully and the appeal process can be fully met. These judges didn't even give Terri Schiavo the same protection that they give a serial killer.
Since you and I have crossed (verbal) swords on other threads, I know you understand that I support enforcement of Terri's wishes regarding not being kept alive by artificial means. But I agree with you that no one has ever found that she desired to be deprived of the natural consumption of water and food.
Now, having said that, I have not seen her medical chart and don't know what her capabilities are to swallow naturally. [I assume they must be quite limited or there wouldn't have been a feeding tube.] Moreover, there is clearly a risk of her choking on any food given to her naturally. However, since she is dying without it, I agree with you that she should have the chance to eat normally.
Your position on this seems quite sensible to me.
Setting aside the pejoratives, I agree. My aggressive defense of Judge Greer's orders is based upon the clear and convincing evidence of her wishes not to be kept alive by artificial means. That determination does not extend (nor has it ever been so held) to delivery of food and water by natural means.
BTW, just a final defense of the judicial orders here. All Judge Greer ever ordered, so far as I can determine, was to authorize the guardian to withdraw the feeding tube. Period.
Dear friend, if we were to remove a person from a respirator in deference to a living will, we would resign ourselves to accept the natural results that followed. If they are able to breathe on their own, then so be it. They go on living.
But what would happen if, when the respirator tube is removed, the judge also decreed that all oxygen had to be sucked from the room?
Would that not then be murder?
This is the case with Terri Schiavo. They have removed the foot tube, and we will assume for a moment that it is artifical life support (which it isn't), but they have also decreed that all food and water be sucked from the room so that Terri does not have even the NATURAL opportunity to eat and drink by mouth.
This is actively pursuing her death...it is murder.
This is murder.
I have been told that Judge Greer has prevented the natural feeding of Terri Schiavo.
What if a person on a respirator had the breathing tube removed, and then there was a decree that all oxygen had to be sucked from the room.
That is an active act of murder.
The dissenting judge on the circuit appeals court should draw your attention. He said there has not been a review.
This woman is being mercilessly killed without due process.
I do not believe that the standard of the death penalty...within a reasonable doubt...can be established regarding Terri Schiavo's wishes. She IS catholic; there is NO written document; there was NO formal discussion mentioned, but only an informal one if it is not hearsay.
She is not being given the due process review and the "within a reasonable doubt" standard that a death row criminal receives.
I'm glad we can agree on something. We couldn't legally do that to a dog. Surely a poor defenceless woman is worth at least the treatment we would give a dog. It makes me wonder what has happened to this country. I'm in favor of assisted suicide (with appropriate safeguards against abuse), but this decision by Greer is outrageous.
No, the wording I have seen doesn't even mention "feeding tube", but denies all food and water.
I agree. Judge Greer's order is not only to remove any alleged artificial means of support, but also to remove any natural means of support. He has actively prohibited anyone from attempting to give her food or water by mouth. That is murder and IMO Judge Greer (who claims to be a "born Again" Christian) is a murderer along with Michael Schiavo and the judges who have refused to overturn this order are complicit.
At this time I am ashamed to be a member of the legal profession. And if Judge Greer can legitimately claim to be a Christian and order this woman's death in this manner, then I am ashamed to be a Christian.
Amen
You are spot on.
The ramifications of this personal tragedy will be limitless.
I think your take on it has great merit. The howls of the death advocates for her demise are the "crucify him" of the crowd before Pontius Pilate.
and actually to everyone who responded...thank you for your responses.
I probably should have explained that I am a registered Libertarian, with some Republican/conservative tendencies. I voted for President Bush and have supported him in just about every issue, but this one.
At one time the law was tied into religion -- decisions were made based on legal and moral principles. Morality and legality were intertwined. The push to separate church and state over the last 30 or 40 years has resulted in a separation of morality from law. Judges by and large can no longer make moral decisions; they have to adhere to the law, and the law unfortunately has little if any tie-in to what is morally right.
The conservative side of me wants Mrs. Schiavo to stay alive If it were up to me, the parties would have worked out a solution without even judicial intervention. But it's not going to happen that way.
But the libertarian side of me worries more about the intervention of Congress, the President and even the State of Florida in this matter. It was mentioned here that euthanasia is legal in the Netherlands with or without the patient's consent. If we continue to allow government to intervene in life and death situations like this, soon we will have government deciding for all of us whether we live or die. Bad enough that we have abdicated many of our rights and responsibilities to government -- I sure don't want government making this decision for me as well. In my opinion, we need to be vigilant to make sure our remaining rights stay with us and are not given over to government. Or those rights will soon be lost as well.
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