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Thus the 5th Circuit makes the ruling that the 3rd Circuit should have made in Tot v. US (131 F.2d 261).

You don't need to declare that there is no individual right to keep and bear arms in order to forbid convicted felons from possessing firearms.

It was Tot that invented the idea that Miller declared that there was no individual right, and from which all subsequent case law has derived.

And it's Tot - not Miller - that needs to be reversed.

1 posted on 04/07/2005 10:54:19 AM PDT by jdege
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To: jdege

I'm not so sure this is a win. If a felon can't be trusted with his rights, then shouldn't that person still be imprisoned? I don't see any Constitutional provision for citizens with partial rights.


2 posted on 04/07/2005 10:58:32 AM PDT by thoughtomator ("The Passion of the Opus" - 2 hours of a FReeper being crucified on his own self-pitying thread)
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To: jdege; All
Jdege,

You might be interested in the docs regarding the Miller decision. It has more information about the history of it than you'll find just about anywhere.

You also might be interested in U.S. v. Dalton, and U.S. v. Rock Island Armory.

6 posted on 04/07/2005 11:09:16 AM PDT by zeugma (Come to the Dark Side...... We have cookies! (Made from the finest girlscouts!))
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To: jdege

A felon can lose access to his Rights via due process. It's in the Constitution. We don't need yet another ruling that someone can use to obfuscate the issue. Our judiciary and legislators just need to start taking the Constitution at face value. Period.


7 posted on 04/07/2005 11:10:05 AM PDT by Dead Corpse (Sooner or later, you have to stand your ground. Whether anyone else does or not. - Michael Badnarik)
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To: jdege

"it is clear that felons, infants and those of unsound mind may be prohibited from possessing firearms"

Couldn't help but crack up at the infants part. I agree though.


9 posted on 04/07/2005 11:19:59 AM PDT by cotton1706
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To: jdege
limited narrowly tailored specific exceptions or restrictions

A loophole you could drive a truck through. If this court ever actually strikes down a particular restriction instead of just paying lip service to the 2nd Amendment, I'll shit a brick.

21 posted on 04/07/2005 5:06:37 PM PDT by Sandy
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To: Onyxx

bump for later discussion


27 posted on 04/08/2005 6:28:47 PM PDT by Unknown Freeper
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To: jdege
And it's Tot - not Miller - that needs to be reversed.

I'd say they both need to be reversed. Miller stands for the notion that some sort of legislative "infringement" of the RKBA is allowed, based merely on the character of particular arms. It dealt with the National Firearms Act, and specifically with short barreled shotguns. Why should the right to keep and bear a perfectly good home defense firearm be subject to such legislative fiat? It's also fodder for those judges and justices who want to read "right of the people" as "right of the militia" and then, often as not, define the militia as the National Guard.

31 posted on 04/09/2005 10:21:19 AM PDT by El Gato (Activist Judges can twist the Constitution into anything they want ... or so they think.)
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To: jdege
Thus the 5th Circuit makes the ruling that the 3rd Circuit should have made in Tot v. US (131 F.2d 261).

You don't need to declare that there is no individual right to keep and bear arms in order to forbid convicted felons from possessing firearms.

It was Tot that invented the idea that Miller declared that there was no individual right, and from which all subsequent case law has derived.

And it's Tot - not Miller - that needs to be reversed.

After reading this I went to read Tot. I guess I don't follow you here. First the Court seemed to draw a distinction between interstate and intrastate commerce, which would be a good thing it seems if they were saying that a gun is not forever "in or affecting" interstate commerce. Still, they upheld one part and overturned the other and didn't find a major difference in the two cases.

Also I found no Miller reference. Could you comment more about this case?

51 posted on 04/14/2005 5:51:24 AM PDT by MileHi
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