Compulsory Vaccinations Threaten Religious Freedom

Liberty Counsel ^ | September 2001 | Mathew D. Staver

[Sun]

I THINK that the Vatican said that if no other vaccines are available, that whatever is available can be used, until something ethical becomes available.

Does anyone know if this is true.

[Coleus]

And why is this in Personal and Bloggers? >>

It came from a webpage and not a news website.

[justche]

If there is a job that is open - and my skills fit that position - that is what matters.

[Senator Bedfellow]

To answer your first question: ...why do they use aborted fetal tissue anyway?

They don't. Fetal cells were used in developing the vaccines, forty-odd years ago. They are not used in manufacturing the vaccines today.

To answer the second:

http://www.cdc.gov/nip/vacsafe/concerns/gen/cathnews.htm

Different vaccine, same issue.

[justche]

Actually - they are still used in today's manufacturing -



Common vaccines and their production details
BIAVAX

Rubella and mumps virus vaccine live. Merck & Company, Inc.,
1-800-672-6372. Produced using neomycin, sorbitol, and hydrolyzed gelatin.
Medium: human diploid cells originating from human aborted fetal tissue.
DPT

Diphtheria and tetanus toxoids acellular pertussis vaccine adsorbed.
SmithKline Beecham Pharmaceuticals, 1-800-366-8900, extension 5231.
Produced using aluminum phosphate, formaldehyde, ammonium sulfate, washed
sheep red blood cells, glycerol, sodium chloride, and thimerosol.* Medium:
porcine (pig) pancreatic hydrolysate of casein.
FLUSHIELD

Influenza Virus Vaccine, Trivalent, Types A & B. Wyeth-Ayerst,
1-800-934-5556. Produced using gentamicin sulfate, formaldehyde,
po!ysorbate 80, tri(n) butylphosphate, and thimerosol.* Medium: chick
embryos.
FLU VIRIN

Influenza Virus Vaccine. Medeva Pharmaceuticals, 1 -888-MEDEVA (716-
274-5300). Produced using embroyonic fluid (chicken egg), neomycin,
polymyxin, thimerosol,* and betapropiolactone. Medium: embryonic fluid
(chicken egg).
HAVRIX

Hepatitis A. SmithKline Beecham Pharmaceuticals, 1-800-366-8900, extension
5231. Produced using formalin, aluminum hydroxide, phenoxyethanol
(antifreeze), polysorbate 20, and residual MRC5 proteins (from medium).
Medium: human diploid cells (originating from human aborted fetal tissue).
IM0 VAX

Rabies Vaccine Adsorbed. Connaught Laboratories, 1-800-822-2463. Produced
using human albumin, neomycin sulfate, and phenol red indicator. Medium:
human diploid cells (originating from human aborted fetal tissue).
IPOL

Inactivated Polio Vaccine. Connaught Laboratories, 1-800-822-2463.
Produced using three types of polio virus, formaldehyde, phenoxyethanol
(anti-freeze), neomycin, streptomycin, and polymyxin B. Medium: VERO
cells, a continuous line of monkey kidney cells.
MERUVAX II

Rubella Virus Vaccine Live. Merck & Company, 1-800-672-6372. Produced
using neomycin, sorbitol, and hydrolyzed gelatin. Medium: human diploid
cells (originating from human aborted fetal tissue).
M-R VAX

Measles and Rubella Virus Vaccine Live. Merck & Company, 1-800-672-6372.
Produced using neomycin, sorbitol, and hydrolyzed gelatin. Mediums: M & M
-- chick embryo. Rubella -- human diploid cells (originating from human
aborted fetal tissue).
MMR

Measles Mumps Rubella Live Virus Vaccination. Merck & Company,
1-800-672-6372. Produced using sorbitol, neomycin, and hydrolyzed gelatin.
Mediums: M & M -- chick embryo. Rubella -- human diploid cells
(originating from human aborted fetal tissue).
MUMPSVAX

Mumps Virus Vaccine Live. Merck & Company, 1-800-672-6372. Produced using
neomycin, sorbitol, and hydrolyzed gelatin. Medium: human diploid cells
(originating from human aborted fetal tissue).
ORIMUNE

Poliovirus Vaccine Live Oral Trivalent. Lederle Laboratories,
1-800-934-5556. Produced using three types of attenuated polioviruses,
streptomycin, neomycin, calf serum, and sorbitol. Medium: monkey kidney
cell culture.
Rabies Vaccine Adsorbed

SmithKline Beecham Pharmaceuticals, 1-800-366-8900, extension 5231.
Produced using betapropiolactone, aluminum phosphate, sodium
ethylmercurithiosalicyate (thimerosol),* and phenol red. Medium: fetal
rhesus monkey lung cells.
RECOMBIVAX

Hepatitis B Vaccine Recombinant. Merck & Company, 1-800-672-6372.
Produced using thimerosol* and aluminum hydroxide. Medium: yeast
(residual; less than 1 percent yeast protein).
VARIVAX

Varicella Virus Vaccine Live. Merck & Company, 1-800-672-6372. Produced
using sucrose, phosphate, glutamate, and processed gelatin. Medium: human
diploid cells (originating from human aborted fetal tissue).

[Senator Bedfellow]

This is going to devolve into a discussion of what we mean by "fetal cells", I'm sure. ;)

MRC-5 is a line of cells originally derived from fetal tissue. However, the cells in use today are propagated from those original fetal cells - they do not directly come from fetal tissue today, and no fetal tissue is required to produce the vaccine.

In short, MRC-5 originally comes from fetal tissue. The MRC-5 bits in vaccines are the offspring of those original fetal cells, generations removed, not the fetal cells themselves.

[justche]

Look, if you're opposed to abortion - at the end of the day, they are currently using aborted fetal cells - to create new vaccines, and in 'improving' vaccines.

Whether fetal cells are required or not isn't the point - the point is what the manufacturers themselves admit to using in their vaccines.

More to the point to me, is the fact that there is no proof that these vaccinations provide true immunity.

I cannot understand how a group of people so united against the government governing our personal lives - so anti - welfare - so anti big brother - just gets in line for vaccinations without proof of what they do, and SHIELDING a whole industry from the consequences of what they produce. I just don't get it.

(And by the way - although I think Autism is a HUGE issue - and can't even imagine how employers are supposed to handle the up and coming workforce that will use the ADA in trying to make the employers bend the same way schools bend to accomodate - my main issue with vaccinations is not the fear of autism, it's that they simply aren't safe or proven effective, and there doesn't seem to be any type of accountability for it. Just the creation of more drugs, and more vaccines to make more money for the drug companies. )

[Senator Bedfellow]

All I'm saying is that the cells in use today are more or less clones (not exactly, but you get the idea) of fetal cells, and not the fetal cells themselves. If that's close enough to the real thing to make you uncomfortable, I'm not here to persuade you otherwise and convince you that it's really okay.

More to the point to me, is the fact that there is no proof that these vaccinations provide true immunity

Well, we do seem to have a lot fewer cases of measles these days.

[the OlLine Rebel]

I'm not yelling, just easily putting emphasis where it was needed w/o extra typing. Otherwise, I need waste-of-time HTML code (or extra typing using * bookends) in this not-so-easy forum.


I'm not knocking OPINION about baby stem cells - I'm knocking the idea that you MUST do what some company says. Generally vaccines are required only at the START of a job - while you're interviewing or Day 1. The Company is not the Government. You are not beholden to them to stay. If they do something you don't like - QUIT. If you're interviewing, excuse yourself and say you are no longer interested.

This goes along hand-in-hand w/"jess'" asking if you had the RIGHT to that Company's job. You don't - and they don't have a right to you. It goes both ways. Find another job if you don't like it.

And giving the whiny "but it's the only thing...." is just giving into commie whining about "I am owed a job". You are not. And you don't owe them your services.

[hellinahandcart]

If that was the case, then BC pills would be "100% fool-proof" for getting pregnant, per se, not just 99%.

Nothing will ever be foolproof that can be rendered ineffective by forgetting a couple of pills, taking antibiotics, or drinking grapefruit juice.

It could be that the pills are 98% effective only BECAUSE they can also hinder implantation.

[justche]

We may be seeing less measles (although every year there are cases on college campuses that require quarantines) but we're seeing fully vaccinated 'kids' and adults come down with it when it does make it's way through.

In fact when I was pregnant a couple of years ago, I was told I did not have immunity to measles - this is after being immunized as a kid - and twice at college (two different ones on different coasts) because I didn't have the proof of immunization.

So we may see less measles (that in reality is not a deadly disease - even though some cases turn that way --just like sometimes the cold can turn into pnuemonia) but now we also see all sorts of other childhood diseases that need other vaccinations, and other drugs to to control. - It's a vicious ugly cycle -I just cannot see that there is a reason for an employer to get involved in trying to enforce.

[justche]

I'm not knocking OPINION about baby stem cells - I'm knocking the idea that you MUST do what some company says. Generally vaccines are required only at the START of a job - while you're interviewing or Day 1. The Company is not the Government. You are not beholden to them to stay. If they do something you don't like - QUIT. If you're interviewing, excuse yourself and say you are no longer interested.
________________________

without seeing faces, (and perhaps hand gestures :) ) it's hard to read what is really being said sometimes!
Got it

[Sun]

It seems that the Vatican said that if no other vaccines are available, then whatever is available can be used, until something ethical becomes available.

http://www.lifesite.net/ldn/2005/jul/05071801.html

I would think it would be each person's responsibility to look to see if there were an ethical vaccine, first.

As for me, I would be very squeemish about using this kind of vaccine for any reason.

[Sun]

Fetal Tissue and Vaccines. Some vaccines such as rubella and varicella are made from human cell-line cultures, and some of these cell lines originated from aborted fetal tissue, obtained from legal abortions in the 1960s. No new fetal tissue is needed to produce cell lines to make these vaccines, now or in the future.

snippet from: http://www.cdc.gov/nip/vacsafe/concerns/gen/contamination.htm#Fetal

[justche]

http://www.cdc.gov/nip/vacsafe/concerns/gen/humancell.htm

"CDC is aware that some, but not all, vaccines are made from human
cell-line cultures, and some of these cell lines originated from aborted
fetal tissue, obtained from legal abortions in the 1960's. No new fetal
tissue is needed to produce cell lines to make these vaccines, now or in
the future. Fetal tissue is not used to produce vaccines; cell lines
generated from a single fetal tissue source are used--vaccine manufacturers
obtain human cell lines from FDA-certified cell banks."

[the OlLine Rebel]

BC Pills are meant to supress ovulation - one keeps one's eggs rather than losing them. Theoretically, the chances of ovulation occurring are already very small. Thus, the chances of ovulation occurring on the pill (regularly - obviously it's not fool-proof if you have to be responsible for using) and the egg being flushed out (i.e., not implanted) are very tiny.