Posted on 10/20/2010 3:37:02 PM PDT by GilGil
So every time that happened that would be a violation of the law.
Also in some cases when title is transferred there is a transfer fee that needs to be paid to a state or local entity. My understanding is that many of these transfers that occured electronically were done without fees being paid.
I also understand that a lot of the foreclosure paperwork was done by people who were not legally qualifed to do so, and was done without a notary public when in some cases a notary was needed.
Multiply those violations by the tens or hundreds of thousands of times that they occured and you have a tidal wave of illegality.
If the original mortgage-holder has sold the loan, but nobody has notified the “home owner”, how can he be held responsible for sending the payment to the wrong company?
“My mortgage hasn’t been sold to the secondary market. It’s been JPMorgan Chase since day one.”
Actually, look into Mortgage Backed Securites and you will find that not to be true.
If the servicing company is not doing this properly then the servicing company is the one that should ultimately be out of pocket.
However, the servicing company might argue otherwise and the homeowner would have to go to court to prove otherwise.
If the banks can keep these cases separated then they can prevail by strength of their legal resources. However, if an enterprising law firm could turn a bunch of similar cases into a class action then the tide could turn in favor of the homeowners.
Yes! they will collect the payment nut the point is that they most likely do not have the authority to foreclose because they cannot come up with the original loan docs.
The point here is that there are class action law suits popping up everywhere. A few weeks ago a class action in Kentucky was filed on behalf of 100,000 foreclosed on pruperty owners.
This lawsuit is pursuing RICO law which us used against organized crime looking for a pattern of fraudulent activity. The bank in this suit has committed fraud most likely with all 100,000 home owners by intentionally filing false documents to be able to froeclose.
There are some 20,000,000 foreclosed property and the odds are all will go into class actions.
The losses are in the trillions and the damages are in the trillions. As this goes forward many banks will be crushed with these lawsuits, but more importantly so will the home owners in good standing.
How? Property values will keep going down as it is revealed in court that the values of these homes are half of what the banks stated. Goreclosed properties are seeing their oners stay in there for years because the banks son’t have time to deal with them. How is that for property values. You make tens of thousands of dollars in mortgage payments every year while the guy next door pays nothing for years until the class action is settled.
It does not take a genius to understand that the overall real esate market will collapse until this is all worked out somehow. I’m guessing it will take another 7 years.
And once again, home owners in good standing have to wonder if the bank they are making payments to can prove ownerdhip of their mortgages. This is a very, very serious question. If the bank cannot prove ownership, then home owners are sending payments to a bank that does not own their mortgages. This is fact that this situation now exists.
Total BS! What’s BS? The comments in the article or what I said? Son, you got to narrow your focus a little more with me.
But I could have saved you 5k. You have documentation on your payments? Send a copy to which you made your payments to. Now I won’t tell you that there won’t be some time, teeth grinding frustration, and copy machine—plus postage expenditures. You would get a lot of back and forth, maybe a letter saying things that would scare a rooster out of his socks but you got your documentation so don’t let them see you sweat. And should you find yourself standing before the man like you did, represent yourself and show his or her honor your documentation; payments made and said bank received, a log of who you spoke to, the time you spent, postage—including that final certified letter showing your paid documentation and said letter received or not. If you just answer the honorable’s questions and not use their courtroom as a platform—be respectful in dress and a little humble in attitude, in the climate we are in right now in our country, I would pay good money to sit in the ‘gallery’ on this one.
I’m going to give you some two edged wisdom here: when you appear before a judge with an advocate, the judge sees the advocate. Don’t misunderstand me, a gifted advocate is worth their weight in gold and I’m not about taking anything off their table. But this is a very uncomplicated situation; you paid and the lender said you did not and the lender has entered their claim in suit (hopefully, the court is convenient to you).
Now a necessary or unnecessary irritation of our complex society is you will most likely have to produce all this to your local credit bureau (now is somewhere between taxes and death).
Think about this, you have gone through this and you now know more than a lot of other people; knowledge and experience always make you stronger.
Taxtruth, I hear the ‘mumblers’ out ‘there’ and I will tell ‘all’ that this is the United States of America and her charter, the Constitution, is standing strong (in relation to all things in our country—including the judicial). And the more stuff some folks stack on that bridge to the Constitution, making the path more complicated and perilous that we just about need an advocate to lead us through to get to it, the Constitution is still there. And precious as she is there are a lot of folks who go over every inch of her 24/7 looking for a crack somewhere. And now days there are some who put her on like a latest fashion and berate our blessed country, bang hard working people on the head, frighten the innocent, and keep folks walking around on their knees.
I don’t think our previous generations made the sacrifices they made so some whiney mumblers with agendas could walk in, lie and deceive folks into believing this is not the blessed and best place in our world in order to muddy the water, and then take what they don’t even want.
I guess that’s about all. I need to put some things together for GilGil.
All the best,
forest153
GilGil
I apologize for just now sending you a response. I had to jump off Free Republic to study some stuff happening in Russia.
Well GilGil, first I’m going to take you honestly, that all you wrote fell out of your brain—are your own thoughts. Now you have said a lot of things and some are pretty serious so I also must consider you are pretty concerned about all this. And you would not have posted this on Free Republic lest you be one of those who are getting some very perverted pleasure in seeing our country get a pounding then spreading worry to a lot of very sincere people.
Second, I’m going to have to find some papers (from Fall of 2008 and Spring of 2009) so don’t give up on me. I didn’t start with the Internet until the summer of 08 and didn’t know how to ‘save’ in folders until my daughter came home on holiday (Christmas 08). So I have enough stacks of paper around to give book larvae acid reflux. I think you will find these interesting.
If you do have a minute, jump back on your article and read what I posted to ‘Taxtruth’ on #48 for a warm-up.
Oh! My. You still don’t get it.
There are over 20 million foreclosures almost all of which are held by institutions that cannot prove ownership. This is a fact.
This is going to result in trillions of losses. The Fed has no other option but to print to infinity.
The effect on real esate is another 50% drop.
The fact is that homeowners in good standing are most likely making payments to institutions that cannot prove ownership. Wait another 6-12 months and all will reveal itself. In the meantime, people making payments have no idea whom they are going to.
Next year will be a bloodbath for the economy specifically because of this problem. As far as the Constitution goes we have the First and Second amendment left and not much more.
As I said, no need to argue about this. Facts will speak for themselves. Those owners in good standing are getting the screwing of a lifetime. That is fact.
You got it precisely.
Oh, man. I think I had that once. Some Pepto-bismol took care of it.
Either you are retarded or clueless.I don’t know which???
LOL
Well, if the bankers who securitized the mortgages had a priori, constructive knowledge that the mortgages they were putting into the pooling agreements were not as advertised (and we now have people stepping forward and telling of 80% non-conformance rates of sampled mortgages put into some securities), then the seller of those securities is up for SEC securities fraud, mail fraud, wire fraud just for starters at the federal level. There are likely other laws involved at the state level(s).
Ambac’s suit says over 97%. The quote by Richard Bowen is where I get the 80% from. I’ll go with his number, because “he was there,” and he’s not suing anyone - yet. Ambac is seeking a recovery, so of course they’re going to make a bold claim.
NB that the parties involved in these lawsuits are not crackpots, nor individuals. This is high-stakes stuff right here.
We have Blackrock suing BofA. Guess who is the third largest shareholder in Blackrock?
BofA.
We have the Federal Reserve Bank of NY suing BofA. But... wait a minute. Isn’t there a little bit of a conflict here? The Fed was the one stupid enough to buy the crap paper off Bear Stearns when they imploded... BofA didn’t sell it to them... so how does the FRBNY create a complaint?
It is enough to make one’s head spin. But I will tell you this for certain: The FRBNY does not engage in loony stuff. They’re playing for keeps and they’re playing for big bucks. The FRBNY sets the tone for the financial system on Wall Street. They’re the most powerful Federal Reserve Bank in the entire system.
Not to be outdone, BofA is suing a mortgage originator for peddling them crap:
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSN2021282320101020
Now, if the plaintiffs are able to prove that the securitizing banks KNEW that the mortgages they were putting into the pool were not in conformance wit the pooling agreement, or they previously sold them into a different MBS, then the SEC has the basis for securities fraud, as do several states under their own laws.
All 50 state AG’s have opened cases looking into the situation, and the FBI is reported to be in the early stage of an investigation in foreclosure paperwork filed in courts in Florida.
If lawyers are found to have filed lies in an affidavit to a court in a judicial foreclosure state (eg, Florida), that is called “Fraud Upon the Court” and can result in the lawyer making the fraudulent affidavit losing their license to practice, as well as felony charges and any decision based upon the fraudulent filings vacated. In every state in the nation, filing a fraudulent affidavit to a court of law is at least a gross misdemeanor, and in most states it is a felony with a light sentence. Notary fraud is not seen as severely by the law, but it is still breaking a law for someone who isn’t a notary to use a notary stamp. Right there, there are 10’s of thousands of documents submitted to courts of law in the US that meet those two criteria.
One more reply and I’ll leave you alone.
When Chris Whalen speaks on the banks, I listen. Because, unlike many other experts who appear on Bloomberg or CNBC, Whalen has no dog in the fight. He’s not advocating a long or short position on the bank stocks, bonds/debt, whatever. His company sells data & analysis on the bond market and financial sector. So he’s not only an expert on the financial sector, he has much less conflict of interest in what he says about the banks vs. other commentators who appear on business news shows.
Here’s their website so you get a feel for what his shop does:
http://us1.institutionalriskanalytics.com/www/index.asp
Thanks for all the info.
The guy with the video really knows his stuff.
I am reluctant to claim that I know much, because I realize how complex and far reaching a lot of this is, in the long run.
The GM Volt looks good, when compared to the pile of crap created by the US banking/financial industry.
All in all American business ain’t what it used to be.
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