Posted on 09/02/2013 9:58:26 AM PDT by xzins
“And there you have it: no proof Obama was born in Hawaii and no citation of ANY legal precedent that would make Obama a natural-born citizen.”
A Republican Governor of Hawaii confirmed Obama’s birth in her state:
You know, during the campaign of 2008, I was actually in the mainland campaigning for Sen. McCain. This issue kept coming up so much in the campaign, and again I think it’s one of those issues that is simply a distraction from the more critical issues that are facing the country. And so I had my health director, who is a physician by background, go personally view the birth certificate in the birth records of the Department of Health, and we issued a news release at that time saying that the president was, in fact, born at Kapi’olani Hospital in Honolulu, Hawaii. And that’s just a fact. And yet people continue to call up and e-mail and want to make it an issue. And I think it’s, again, a horrible distraction for the country by those people who continue this. ... It’s been established. He was born here.”
A Hawaii Director of Health inspected the original, vault copy Certificate of Live Birth and confirmed that it is authentic and valid:
“There have been numerous requests for Sen. Barack Hussein Obama’s official birth certificate. State law (Hawai‘i Revised Statutes §338-18) prohibits the release of a certified birth certificate to persons who do not have a tangible interest in the vital record.
“Therefore, I as Director of Health for the State of Hawai‘i, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawai‘i State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures.
“No state official, including Governor Linda Lingle, has ever instructed that this vital record be handled in a manner different from any other vital record in the possession of the State of Hawai‘i.”
and:
‘“I, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, Director of the Hawaii State Department of Health, have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawai‘i State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was born in Hawai‘i and is a natural-born American citizen. I have nothing further to add to this statement or my original statement issued in October 2008 over eight months ago.”
And the Hawaii Registrar of Vital Statistics has the original Hawaii Certificate of Live Birth for Obama in his office safe and he has issued official, certified Letters of Verification for it:
http://www.azcentral.com/12news/Obama-Verification.pdf
Since 2008 there have been 200 adjudicated original jurisdiction lawsuits or state ballot challenges to Obama’s eligibility. No court has ruled him ineligible. 91 of those lawsuits were appealed to state and federal appellate courts. No opinion has been overturned on appeal.18 appellate rulings were appealed up to the U.S. Supreme Court, and again no appellate ruling has been reversed.
There are still a few appeals pending, so hope can spring eternal.
If your hobby is parsing the words of court rulings, please continue to have at it, but it has no effect on settled law.
You just supported my argument with your citation. The news story says “Alleging widespread “irregularities” on Election Day, a group of Democrats in Congress objected earlier Thursday TO THE COUNTING of Ohio’s 20 electoral votes.” Obama’s lack of eligibility would have nothing do with the counting of electoral votes. Voter fraud, however, could have a direct impact. Thanks.
The Supreme Court unanimously affirmed that Minor's decision was also about citizenship and specifically about presidential eligibility. What is conspicuous is ANY mention of Wong Kim Ark, despite being more recent:
Under our Constitution, a naturalized citizen stands on an equal footing with the native citizen in all respects save that of eligibility to the Presidency. Minor v. Happersett, 21 Wall. 162, 88 U. S. 165; Elk v. Wilkins, 112 U. S. 94, 112 U. S. 101; Osborn v. Bank of United States, 9 Wheat. 738, 22 U. S. 827.
§ 1401 is naturalization law. You clue is that Title 8 is called "Aliens and Nationality." And NOTHING, not ONE mention in what you quoted says ANYTHING about natural-born citizen. The only times Wong Kim Ark used the term was from the Constitution and finally in affirming the unanimous and exclusvie Minor definition of NBC that Wong Kim Ark did not meet.
Your list of 200 cases would have been much shorter if Obama had ever presented any kind of legal documentation to prove he was born in the United States. Instead we have 200 cases with almost as many different excuses and justifications to cover for the lack of physical evidence and lack of actual settled law.
f your hobby is parsing the words of court rulings, please continue to have at it, but it has no effect on settled law.
What you call "settled law" isn't settled law because it's not consistent in how it has been cited. I've shown exactly how the cases you've cited don't provide any legal precedent to support the "settled law." And nothing is parsed. The Supreme Court was unanimous, which I HAVE shown consistently.settled law.
No, she didn't. She told an outright lie. She claimed that her director of health put out a news release that listed Obama's birth in Kapiolani Hospital. This is simply not true. And it would be against the law unless they were citing the UIPA or an exemption to the 338-18.
A Hawaii Director of Health inspected the original, vault copy Certificate of Live Birth and confirmed that it is authentic and valid:
Except that the 2008 news release doesn't say that Obama was born in Hawaii ... and the 2009 news release doesn't say that the birth in Hawaii claim is based on a legal birth certificate. Fukino changed her terminology. In the second release, she cites vital records (plural) which means the COLB that Obama presented in 2008 cannot be a legally valid. There should not be more than one vital record on file. The only reasons for additional records would be modifications made to the file. And again, news releases are NOT proof of Hawaiian birth. In court, this is called hearsay. Later she said Obama's original birth certificate was half-handwritten, yet the PDF released in April 2011 is not. Sorry, but there are too many problems with these claims.
And the Hawaii Registrar of Vital Statistics has the original Hawaii Certificate of Live Birth for Obama in his office safe and he has issued official, certified Letters of Verification for it:
Those letters of verification only provide a PARTIAL verification of facts as stated by the applicant. The registrar refused to verify ALL the information, even ignoring the DOH's own standard request form, and whether the birth certificate was a true or identical copy. This means it is NOT authentic.
“...the president was, in fact, born at Kapi’olani Hospital in Honolulu, Hawaii. And that’s just a fact.... It’s been established. He was born here.”—Governor Linda Lingle
“The state of Hawaii has said that he was born there. That’s good enough for me.”—Representative John Boehner, Speaker of the House
“We hope that issuing certified copies of the original Certificate of Live Birth to President Obama will end the numerous inquiries related to his birth in Hawai’i,”
“I have seen the original records filed at the Department of Health and attest to the authenticity of the certified copies the department provided to the President that further prove the fact that he was born in Hawai’i.”—Hawai’i Department of Health Director Loretta Fuddy
“Therefore, I as Director of Health for the state of Hawai‘i, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawai‘i State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures.”—Chiyome Fukino, M.D., former Director of Health
“I, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, Director of the Hawaii Department of Health, have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawai‘i State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was born in Hawai‘i and is a natural-born American citizen.”
Arizona Secretary of State Ken Bennett and Kansas Secretary of State Kris Kobach (two Republican Secretaries of State) requested Letters of Verification for Obama’s birth certificate from the Hawaii Registrar of Vital Statistics Alvin T. Onaka, Ph.D. With their requests the Arizona and Kansas Secretaries of State attached copies of the Obama long form and, in accordance with Federal Rule of Evidence 1005, Bennett and Kobach asked Dr. Onaka to verify that the data on the attached copies was the same as the data on the original.
Dr. Onaka complied, he compared Bennett’s and Kobach’s copies with the original and he certified that they matched.
Federal Rule of Evidence 1005: Copies of Public Records to Prove Content
The proponent may use a copy to prove the content of an official record — or of a document that was recorded or filed in a public office as authorized by law — if these conditions are met: the record or document is otherwise admissible; and the copy is certified as correct in accordance with Rule 902(4) or IS TESTIFIED TO BE CORRECT BY A WITNESS WHO HAS COMPARED IT WITH THE ORIGINAL. If no such copy can be obtained by reasonable diligence, then the proponent may use other evidence to prove the content.
“In addition, I verify that the information in the copy of the Certificate of Live Birth for Mr. Obama that you attached with your request matches the original record in our file.”
“I certify that the information contained in the vital record on file with the Department of Health was used to verify the facts of the vital event.”—Alvin T. Onaka, Ph.D. State Registrar
Obama’s attorneys submitted a copy of the whitehouse.gov long form birth certificate and a Hawaii Registrar Letter of Verification to U.S. District Court Judge Henry T. Wingate in Taitz, et. al. v. Obama, Pelosi, et. al. In U.S. District Court in Jackson, Mississippi.
http://www.scribd.com/mobile/doc/96289285 (see pages 11& 12)
It is not MY determination that issue is settled law, it’s the determination of judges who have issued opinions on the issue.
For example: Tisdale v Obama, US District Court Judge John A. Gibney, Jr.: “It is well settled that those born within the United States are natural born citizens.”— U.S. District Court of the Eastern District of Virginia, January 23, 2012.
or:
Purpura & Moran v Obama: New Jersey Administrative Law Judge Jeff S. Masin: “No court, federal, state or administrative, has accepted the challengers’ position that Mr. Obama is not a “natural born Citizen” due to the acknowledged fact that his father was born in Kenya and was a British citizen by virtue of the then applicable British Nationality Act. Nor has the fact that Obama had, or may have had, dual citizenship at the time of his birth and thereafter been held to deny him the status of natural born. It is unnecessary to reinvent the wheel here. … The petitioners’ legal position on this issue, however well intentioned, has no merit in law. Thus, accepting for the point of this issue that Mr. Obama was born in Hawaii, he is a ‘natural born citizen’ regardless of the status of his father.” April 10, 2012
“Citizens is plural. ..”
fatherS is also plural. Does that mean the children need to have two fathers?
“fathers have never been resident in the United States”
It looks like when it says citizenS, they mean citizens of many children which is why they made it plural.
2 fathers don’t procreate.
So children require a male and female parent, or at least a sperm donor.
Argument does not hold water.
“..And current law is rock solid so far as his eligibility. ..”
Do you happen to have a link handy to the current law?
You missed my point. I was trying to bring out the fact that pluralized words can also mean a GROUP of people.
I was trying to bring out the fact that pluralized words can also mean a GROUP of people.
************
As you say I think the plural is used in the context of ‘a body of people’. JMO
Agreed.
The law on divided nationality parents & citizenship depend on the statues at the time of birth.
—
As per Obozo:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/bloggers/2675183/replies?c=15
Here is the U.S. Immigration Law that covers the issue of children born abroad to 1 citizen and 1 alien.
http://library.uwb.edu/guides/USimmigration/66%20stat%20163.pdf
the McCarran-Walter Act, the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1952
Public law 82-414 Chapter 1 Section 301 (7)
This applies to Obozo, assuming he is the son of Barrack H. Obama, Sr. and that he was born abroad.
If born abroad with the stated father, he is not even a U.S. Citizen.....
—
Ted Cruz is another matter, in that he was born at a different time.
The issue for Ted is not citizenship, but that of natural born citizenship.
There is no question that in Ted Cruz’s case, there is NO DIVIDED LOYALTY. But in the case of Obozo, it is clear that he is not one of US.
You dishonestly left off the part about how this "fact" was supposedly published in a new release, yet it was not. Why did she lie??
“The state of Hawaii has said that he was born there. That’s good enough for me.”—Representative John Boehner, Speaker of the House
And I've already addressed why this means nothing from a legal standpoint.
“We hope that issuing certified copies of the original Certificate of Live Birth to President Obama will end the numerous inquiries related to his birth in Hawai’i,” “I have seen the original records filed at the Department of Health and attest to the authenticity of the certified copies the department provided to the President that further prove the fact that he was born in Hawai’i.”—Hawai’i Department of Health Director Loretta Fuddy
You can't "further" prove a fact that has never been proven in the first place. This is too easy, Nero.
“Therefore, I as Director of Health for the state of Hawai‘i, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawai‘i State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures.”—Chiyome Fukino, M.D., former Director of Health
This only says a birth certificate is on record. It doesn't say Obama was born in Hawaii. And this is the news release in which Gov. Lingle said, and you omitted, that Obama was born Kapiolani Hospital. Thanks for proving she lied.
“I, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, Director of the Hawaii Department of Health, have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawai‘i State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was born in Hawai‘i and is a natural-born American citizen.”
"Original birth certificate" was changed to say "original vital records," a change of verbiage that disproves the authenticity of the first.
Arizona Secretary of State Ken Bennett and Kansas Secretary of State Kris Kobach (two Republican Secretaries of State) requested Letters of Verification for Obama’s birth certificate from the Hawaii Registrar of Vital Statistics Alvin T. Onaka, Ph.D. With their requests the Arizona and Kansas Secretaries of State attached copies of the Obama long form and, in accordance with Federal Rule of Evidence 1005, Bennett and Kobach asked Dr. Onaka to verify that the data on the attached copies was the same as the data on the original. Dr. Onaka complied, he compared Bennett’s and Kobach’s copies with the original and he certified that they matched.
To meet the Federal Rules of Evidence and Hawaii's verification law, Alvin T. Onaka Ph.D. needed to specifically verify that Obama's PDF was a true, identical and/or CORRECT copy of the original. He refused. This means his verification is at best only a partial verification. It does NOT legally prove Obama was born in Hawaii. It's part of the reason Kobach asked for his own letter because he knew the Arizona letter was insufficient.
Federal Rule of Evidence 1005: Copies of Public Records to Prove Content The proponent may use a copy to prove the content of an official record — or of a document that was recorded or filed in a public office as authorized by law — if these conditions are met: the record or document is otherwise admissible; and the copy is certified as correct in accordance with Rule 902(4) or IS TESTIFIED TO BE CORRECT BY A WITNESS WHO HAS COMPARED IT WITH THE ORIGINAL. If no such copy can be obtained by reasonable diligence, then the proponent may use other evidence to prove the content.
And Onaka did NOT testify that the PDF is a CORRECT image. Let that sink in. You're proving my point for me, Nero.
“In addition, I verify that the information in the copy of the Certificate of Live Birth for Mr. Obama that you attached with your request matches the original record in our file.” “I certify that the information contained in the vital record on file with the Department of Health was used to verify the facts of the vital event.”—Alvin T. Onaka, Ph.D. State Registrar
By failed to specify which information "matches," this means nothing. Under Hawaii law, he is supposed to verify facts "as stated by the applicant." He did NOT verify that the record was a true copy, identical nor a correct copy. Verification fails.
This was filed by the attorneys for the MDEC, not Obama. Obama could have filed one of the two hard copies he allegedly obtained. He did not do so because he can't. He's not stupid enough to submit a forgery.
It is not MY determination that issue is settled law, it’s the determination of judges who have issued opinions on the issue.
Yes, I've already addressed how these judges did not support their opinions AND I've shown what the actual settled law says directly from the Supreme Court.
Obama’s attorneys in the lawsuit are the same as the Mississippi Democratic Party Executive Committee’s attorneys.
If a document is forged, it would be helpful to have a court ruling declaring it to be forged, particularly since the state of Hawaii says that it is authentic and provides a link to a scanned image of it in PDF format from the Hawaii state web site. If U.S. District Court Judge Wingate in Mississippi would like to see the original Certificate of Live Birth or Obama’s hard copies, he can issue a court order for them.
Each judge issues an OPINION. If any particular opinion is not supported by sound legal precedent, a different court can issue a contrary opinion. However that has never happened in more than 300 lawsuits which now include close to 100 appeals of civil actions concerning Barack Obama’s eligibility.
The legal term “String Citation” defined:
“A series of references to cases that establish legal precedents and to other authorities that appear one after another and are printed following a legal assertion or conclusion as supportive authority.
For example, in preparing a brief, an attorney might set forth a particular assertion based upon the facts of the case and applicable law and immediately thereafter make a list of all the cases that lend support to it.”— Legal Dictionary, The Free Dictionary
The anti-birthers have developed a twelve page long string citation for defense attorneys to submit with their briefs for judges who rule on natural born citizen/ballot eligibility cases. The string citation references the key rulings favorable to the defense, on Article II eligibility that have been issued since 2008.
http://tesibria.typepad.com/whats_your_evidence/BIRTHER%20STRING%20CITE.pdf
Your parsing of words hobby must be fun for you but its irrelevant.
No Trier of Fact at any level has paid attention to the word nitpickers. And that includes hundreds of judges, 50 state Secretaries of State, 50 Governors, hundreds of state legislators, 50 state Attorneys General, hundreds of citizens who sit on state elections boards and ballot commissions plus the vast majority of the 535 members of Congress, all of whom cleared Obama for the presidency without a single written objection.
While you examine the individual leaves on trees, you have missed the forest completely.
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