Posted on 12/10/2006 6:38:04 AM PST by surfer
For four days, as the snowbound Kim family's food supplies dwindled and they used up their gas running their stranded car's heater, no one even knew they were missing.
It was two more days before rescuers narrowed the search to roads leading across thousands of square miles of western Oregon, and another day before cell phone transmissions helped to pinpoint the search area.
While the speed of the investigation in some ways was remarkable -- given what little authorities started out with -- it was dogged by early missteps and obstacles that handicapped investigators.
A Portland hotel where the family had stayed refused to provide credit card records that might have indicated which way the Kims had gone. An early search by air and land of the treacherous mountain route that James and Kati Kim drove out of Grants Pass yielded nothing.
The owner of a lodge on the road where the Kims' car was stuck had told authorities three days before Kati Kim and her daughters were found that he had seen tire tracks in the snow, but he hadn't been able to follow them in his snowmobile once he hit bare ground. No one followed up.
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(Excerpt) Read more at sfgate.com ...
Please take the time and read the article in its entirety before posting a response. This article really opens your eyes.
What we all take away from this tragedy is very important. In the future what we have learned from this may save someone else.
I'll be pinging this today!
The most fundamental mistake the Kims made was not having taken seriously enough the dangers involved in driving through unfamiliar mountains in snowy weather after nightfall. They're lucky only James died.
It really shows that if your family member is the one at risk you can't just rely on the authorities to conduct the investigation. Without the involvement of private citizens it's likely the Kims still wouldn't be found.
The most fundamental mistake the Kim's made was relying on local LE to ensure their safety. The road they took was supposed to have been gated and locked. The lock was vandalized. If LE knew this - that is negligence period.
You cannot blame the Kim's for making mistakes based on bad information - it happens to all of us on a daily basis.
Thank God there are still good people in the world!
Of course they made an error but they weren't trying to take chances from other things I've read. They didn't plan on taking the road they ended up on. In fact that road was supposed to be blocked by a gate but vandals broke the lock and the gate was wide open so they probably didn't see the gate so it didn't look like a closed road. They thought they were on a well traveled road, or at least not on a closed road. It's easy to lay blame and pass judgement.
Very sad. Sounds like a close knit family who love one another. Thank God for the family and volunteers....without them they would have all died on that mountain.
Somebody help me out here: did Mr. Kim try to follow the road back out and lost his way, or did he try to hike cross-country?
It is a tragic story, and yet not uncommon. My brother died in a similar accident. Having lived in the eastern Sierras (at 8000') for a number of years, I have to say -- I never knew about WEATHER. Cold, snow, ice, wind -- they are all huge forces that city people are protected from and do not understand. I walked home one evening in a blizzard -- maybe 1/2 mile at the most -- and wondered if I would make it.
This is such a sad story and yet, within it, there are such great heroes. The man who was reminded of his own granddaughters/ the cell phone guy who insisted that someone listen / the searchers -- what great heroes.
That family should be very proud of their husband/ son, who made a superhuman effort to get help. My heart goes out to them.
He started back out the road, but eventually left it and followed a stream downhill.
And this is bad because....
Careful what you wish for. While the credit records may have helped here, there are plenty of good reasons why such documents should NOT be freely given to the government.
Makes me think that there should be a person who listens to every tip, every bit of input that comes in. The man from the lodge saw the prints and nobody listened. The misunderstanding that he had cleared the road.
Plus the cell phone records of piings would have been invaluable.
Plus when driving thru mountains, you ought to check in with somebody every day.
So sad,,he almost made it if he had stayed put.
I was struck by that too. I think those people out west have this kind of character,,an independent, taking action, doing the right thing and not waiting for someone to "help". It is admirable.
From what I have pieced together. James Kim and his wife made a plan. James was going to follow the road back out and look for Rogue River - he knew if he followed Rogue river he would run into a town. They had estimated it to be about 4.5 miles away.
So it might be assumed that James saw the creek area and thought either it was Rogue River or was going to lead to it. An old survival tatic used to be to follow rivers because they ultimately alway led to a town. There are many theories on this now.
I think you are splitting hairs.
The family was missing, LE was looking for them. A stand on principle was insane in this case.
Funny how the one thing you pick out is what you are most paranoid about.
You completely missed the real important facts in the article...
Read about the lodge owner - if that doesn't drive you through the roof nothing will.
I don't think the credit card records (except for credit card number) would have helped anyway.
I don't think anybody here is wishing for open access to our information - however I am sure the Kim family wishes they had provided it. It is all about the perspective that you have.
I wonder how this would help?
Yeah they used to call them cowboys! :) God Bless Them!
Quite true. But there are also some good reasons why such documents should be given to authorities, under certain conditions. One of those reasons would be to save the credit card owner's life.
If they had their credit card numbers they could trace any other transactions - like where they ate, where they bought gas, where they picked up that lousy map.
How many of us have told their relatives their credit card numbers?
Yesterday, while walking the dog, I noted a 4"-6" sheet of ice on that side of the street. So I called the Village to report. As for the people that actually live on that street, who the heck knows? As in this case, they probably assumed someone else called it in.
I understand the "follow the water" concept. I would not be very willing to head into a snowdrift to test it . . . of course, I wasn't there.
I saw the chopper pilot who found the car based on his hunch and actual knowledge of the area. It is simply incredible that those responsible early on were unaware of the dead-end logging road and it's history of confusing people.
Well after 6 days without food and you just walked close to 10 miles on the road and you haven't found anything and the prospect of heading back to your family just to watch them die...I think would push anyone to solve the problem.
Ironically even though James died his efforts did lead to the rescue of his family - his footprints in the snow on the road.
No doubt corporate policy requires legal approval before releasing any personal information to authorities. It's possible the manager even gave the credit card info to the police, but in order to protect his/her job asked them never to reveal that information publicly. That's what I would do once corporate refused to release the records.
And I certainly would like to know the hotel that refused to give info about a missing family.
You hit that one on the head.
That is also somewhat perplexing. I wonder if the authorities knew about it, but couldn't get to the location.
Agreed. The only mitigating factor is that she probably received hundreds of tips on the case, and it's tough to sift out the "good" ones. But when she met the guy face-to-face and was presented with his credentials, she should've taken some action.
If I were running the show, she would be reassigned to another less critical position given her lack of response.
Broken gate.
I hope the ones who broke the gate has a conscious and it torments them.
If I were guessing, I think the ones who broke the gate were more than likely snowmobile riders. We have this problem here in the mountains of Tn.. The National Forest gates the roads due to traffic misuse by users. The dirt and gravel roads will not hold up in the winter months due to freezing thawing of the earth. Traffic use destroys the roads and, this a great expense to the tax payers money that funds the National Forest Service.
I posted the following on the earlier thread not knowing about this one.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
It is amazing that when I have just about decided that this thread has run out of gas, you come up with something like that.
Before I get to the most important point, an observation about the credit card info.
There is really good reason for that under normal circumstances. People will get info on hotel guests and either knock over their home while they are gone or otherwise rip them off.
But I am sure that anyone above a desk clerk would have the authority and the judgment to break the rules in an emergency search and rescue situation. So I expect this was a low level employee afraid to do something he/she was told not to do.
So someone should have gone to the top person.
But that brings up another question. I have always understood that in a life threatening situation, a peace officer can commandeer a car, boat, whatever that is required to save a life or apprehend a dangerous person. That may not be correct and apprehending a computer that you can't figure out how to work (passwords, etc.) may not have been cost effective as relates to time.
And since we don't even know that the information would have helped, we can't say any more about that other than I would fire the person who refused the information under those circumstances.
But the part of this story that really hurts is the part about the guy that saw the car tracks and followed them until his snowmobile hit dry land.
He has to have some sleepless nights for the rest of his life.
Maybe he has a physical condition that does not allow it, but I would have gone back to the house and rounded up something that would go the rest of the way and I would have found out what was at the end of the tracks.
If not able to do that myself, I would have planted myself at the entrance to that road, that is, where it turned off of the main road, and raised a fuss until someone did go in.
Too many times people pick up the phone and make a call and then they are done. Most of the time that works but many times it does not because of the huge number of people, the various layers of command, shift changes and other things that cause information to be lost.
The "I thought you took care of that" causes a lot of mistakes, as well.
So my suggestion is that we should promise ourselves that should we ever be involved in anything like this and we see something that has such great significance that we do more than just make a phone call. If nothing happens after the first call, call again. If nothing happens, call another one of the agencies involved. If nothing happens after you call three times, call the TV station.
We all have "I should have's" on our conscience. I would hate to have this one.
That story is to me the saddest of them all.
RE the credit card info refusal.....did they lose a day or so until the Denny's in Roseburg first identified them by description?
I hope the ones who broke the gate has a conscious and it torments them.
If I were guessing, I think the ones who broke the gate were more than likely snowmobile riders.
It is more likely hunters. That area is popular with the local hunters and from what I've read the snowpack was not that great so it was probably not snowmobilers.
The owner of that lodge that said he cleared the road certainly should be in trouble. The guy was covering up for the fact that a road on his property that should have been clearly marked as dangerous was not.
I don't know if you saw that a lock on a gate on that road had been cut by vandals.
The gate was not in place.
You have a point about the gate, but I stand by the letter of my post. Having almost come to grief in similar circumstances, I would urge people facing such circumstances to evaluate the risks with the utmost seriousness. Even just delaying the trip through the mountains until the daylight hours probably would have saved James' life.
The owner of the lodge never said he cleared the road. In fact he was the one that was upset because they didn't clear the road effectively.
Also from what I understand they used to have signs directing people to the lodge but vandals did a lot of damage over the winters where they finally had to remove to the signs.
In addition the Kim's car was not 1 mile from the Bear Lake Lodge - LE incorrectly reported the position. They were close or over 7 miles away from the lodge.
Bottom line is the locals all knew this area was a problem and people have been lost in this same exact area. The shame here is no one is learning from past mistakes - they keep making them.
Also LE nor SAR didn't find any of the Kim's...the Kim's - all of them were found by private citizens. How is that possible?
It's easy to lay blame and pass judgement.
Not at all what I was doing. See my post #41. It's important to be clear about what the Kims could have done that might have saved James' life. Perhaps someone else might re-think their intention to do something similar, especially with two youngsters and a wife in the vehicle. This doesn't detract from his heroic effort to save his family.
True, however this guy should have inspected his property more carefully. He knew a family was missing. Also, he told authorities he had 'cleared the road'. He had not. Perhaps, this family would have been saved had the owner not made that false claim. What do you think.
That family should be very proud of their husband/ son, who made a superhuman effort to get help. My heart goes out to them.
I feel the same way.
When I lived out in Illinois. It was very very cold. We carried survival gear in the winter at all times and especially if we were travelling any distance. We had food, bottled water, blankets, flairs and extra clothes. Also, we had a first aid kit and some other stuff which I have forgotten. I know we had shovels (to keep the snow off the car).
Very good point. I don't think people who own property can be 100% vigilant...but you are right, when alerted, they should check it out.
I doubt if there is any private roads in that area. Those lodges could be on Forest Service land with a lease but even if they sit on deeded land the roads are Forest Service and BLM.
Could be but a real popular area for fishermen (Rainy Falls) is just up the river from there and is just a short hike from the Merlin-Galice Rd. I've taken that hike more than a few times to watch the salmon jump up the falls. A few miles down from Rainy falls is the lodge that is off Bear Creek.
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