Skip to comments.Is a Hummer cleaner than a Prius?
Posted on 05/04/2007 9:37:45 AM PDT by DogByte6RER
Is a Hummer cleaner than a Prius?
Monday, 30 April 2007
BY JOE TONER
Youve often heard it, be you an ordinary joe-soap king, queen or pope; we are all only dust and its to dust well go. A recent report, in the USA, came up with a hypothesis on the great hybrid versus petrol car debate on a dust to dust premise. Before you go any further I must remind you of how great they are at producing report after report. I sometimes wonder if anyone, least of all themselves, listens. Sure, arent they great ones for rubbishing what they dont agree with and promoting what they support on the sometimes flimsiest of evidence. Anyway, I digress.
A report produced by CNW Marketing Research in Bandon, Oregon looked at the dust to dust costs between the favoured Hollywood transport, the Toyota Prius and the vehicle of choice by the Terminator, aka Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger, the Hummer Jeep very familiar to military enthusiasts and fans of CSI Miami.
Much of the current debate centres on the fuel efficiency of the hybrid against the more mainstream petrol or diesel equivalents. The CNW report looks at the total costs from creation to destruction of a number of vehicles and proposes that the Hummer (H3) is cheaper, costing USD$1.31 cents per mile less to run than the Toyota Prius. While it is a headliner grabber it doesnt tell the full story. For instance, the costs are based on the H3 having a service life of over 200,000 miles and the Prius only 100,000 miles hardly a fair comparison.
While, as in any report, we can always find reason to reject its findings it does open up discussion on the whole total cost of the products we buy. We tend to focus on the energy implications of the product whilst in our tenure, mainly the fuel costs but also the service and maintenance expense.
When rating the energy consumption of an individual, group, community, or country, scientists talk about a carbon footprint. That is how much carbon will be emitted into the atmosphere, directly or indirectly, through the usage of products and services. How big is your footprint?
Do we give enough thought to the energy consumed in the production and transportation of our finished goods? How Green is the organic lettuce in your local shop? It may have been grown on the Continent and being flown/driven to the shop. Compare the energy usage to do that compared to the product grown locally, even if an amount of energy was used to heat the glasshouse.
Im not about to start on a crusade promoting hybrid vs petrol vs hydrogen vs electric cars as they all have their merits and this is certainly no ad for the Green party. We must, though, challenge manufacturers to produce products that we can continue to enjoy and yet minimise the environmental impact. None of us will easily surrender the freedom, independence, convenience, and the satisfied smile that the car brings.
I love these kinds of reports.
Proves the hybrids is nothing but hype.
All your doing when buying one is supporting an idea and R&D. Your not doing a damn thing to “save the planet” or much else.
Hyrbrids are going to be nothing but a transitional footnote in automotive history. Mark my words.
My understanding is the service life of 100K for Prius and other hybrids has been largely discredited. The battery packs last for 150k at least, then cost only a few thousand or so to replace.
‘Even if gas prices hit $5 per gallon, I’ll still love my
Same opinion here. I LOVE my H2. Its simply the best handling, best riding MACHINE I’ve ever owned.
I’ve driven it to upstate New York, and down to Lake Whitney in Texas. There is no vehicle I’ve found (and I’ve owned every American SUV type vehicle there is excluding Jeep products) thats better for long distance driving, comfort, or reliability - which is a direct contrast to Consumer Reports ‘ratings’ which after reading I’ve realized is politically based. (It has to be, I own one and none of the ‘negatives’ they cite have come up at all).
Its a lease, better tax wise for us, but even with the increased fuel costs since I got it (2005) I’m still leaning towards a new H2, as opposed to the H3.
‘Like Nothing Else’ is the single most accurate marketing slogan I’ve ever personally experienced, in short.
Actually, the Prius does have a 100k service life - before the batteries need to be replaced. Once you have to plunk down a cool 5k for a new battery pack, I think the dollars/mile comparison gets even worse for Toyota.
Yeah ... ONLY a few thousand or so....
Nice. Very very nice. And I understand why you are smiling. I smile every time I get in, and occasionally chuckle while driving mine.
People don’t realize the turn radius is amazingly tight, better than most soccer mom mini vans, for example. And the ride....wow.
I have most of the bells and whistles on my H2. Rolling map system, XM, all seats heated, etc etc etc. Its very hard to drive the wife’s car at this point (late model Avalon, fine care...but its like driving a go cart it seems so low to the ground in comparision).
Being able to see twenty sets of taillights ahead is also something I’ve come to rely on.
Try putting 5 guy’s - who are all 6’ plus - and their bicycles INSIDE your H2. No way. MY 1995 GMC Suburban has alot more comfort, leg room, useable cargo space, and power - a 400hp L7 motor.
And if you want a REAL vehicle try my 2006 F-250 4door with a turbo-charged deisel. Best damn truck I’ve ever owned.
The 2008 H2 will have a 6.2L 393hp V8.
“And if you want a REAL vehicle try my 2006 F-250 4door with a turbo-charged deisel. Best damn truck Ive ever owned.”
Quite a few of my neighbors own one, or a similiar sized pickup. Your getting about the same mpg I get in the H2 I suspect. They all swear by the F-250 and F-350
Well...that’s my friend smiling in the photo. He is our GOP club prez and I think he’s happy because he is riding shotgun in the parade. I’m on the starboard side of this “boat” wearing the patriotic shirt.
Anyways...mine is a ‘03.
No rolling map system or XM. It is the adventure/luxury package though with leather interior, air compressor and lots of other amenities. My wife insisted on having a DVD player installed too.
I also improved the HP and performance by adding a Corsa cat back exhaust system (the engine has the soft rumble of a tiger) and a cold air induction intake. It runs at about 350 HP now.
You are so right about the turn radius. The vehicle is such a pleasure to drive. I feel no guilt about it whatsoever. In fact, I have magnetic bumper stickers on the bumpers that read things like “Stop Global Whining” and “My SUV Loves Iraqi Oil” AND “My SUV Can Beat Up Your Prius”
You can find some of these snarky bumper stickers at:
Oh yeah...it was my wife who insisted that we purchase a H2 back in 2003. I’m glad I listened to her. My wife is so cool.
“Proves the hybrids is nothing but hype.”
I hate these kind of reports. The original report was debunked in about 50 posts here (this ‘research’ made the assumption that a Prius self-destructs at 100,001 miles, oops) but undeterred a second wave of articles arrives citing the first but failing to mention any shortcomings.
This is the sort of **** the libs usually pull on anti-gun issues. Some dweeb will publish a hacked-up ‘study’ which is easily torn apart, but then 40 newspapers will run stories calling for gun control, all citing the ‘study’ as if it were the proven law of science.
If you want to zing hybrids, a simple cost-benefit analysis suffices (as in: how long does it take to recoup the extra cost of the hybrid engine). It’s not necessary to resort to bad science and logic.
You’re right about hybrids being transitional though. I think they’re a means for car companies to work on electric tech. Eventually they’ll go with a single electric motor which may be powered by a large battery or by very efficient gasoline to electric conversion, IMO.
“Try putting 5 guys - who are all 6 plus - and their bicycles INSIDE your H2. No way. MY 1995 GMC Suburban has alot more comfort, leg room, useable cargo space, and power - a 400hp L7 motor.”
Five large men, and two large dogs fit easily. I don’t like the ‘sway’ you get from the Suburban, the last one I test drove (and it might have changed since I’ll note) handled like a pig compared to the H2. Thats not an overstatement, there is no ‘sway’ with the H2, even passing a large ‘big rig’ on a two lane highway at 60 mph, its as if nothing was there.
I don’t doubt the suburban has a large cargo capacity, but sorry, the seating for ‘large men’ in the H2 is more than adequate.
Unless you mean Mikey Moore type size, of course.
Why is that "unfair?" You'd need two Prii (?) to travel the same total distance. It is too fair.
Yes, the Hummers are cleaner...because 99% of them are parked!
The REAL problem with all these hybrids is the batteries. Its tough to find something more toxic and hard to properly dispose of than a battery. When all these “green” hybrids reach end-of-life, it’s going to be an environmental nightmare. Seriously. (And this is coming from someone who thinks most claims of impending environmental disaster are hogwash.)
Once again, feeling-based libs are doing FAR more harm than good. Ironic and typical. Sigh.
I’d love to see what that lard-ass looks like on a road bicycle!!! As for the sway that is something you seem to get used to. When I switch from my truck to the Burb’s(we actually own 2 of the beasts) it takes awhile to get comfy with that. The wife’s dream car is the Ford Excursion. Never drove it and am wondering how that handles.
Hence, my pinging of Laz. He always gets the job done.
Yep. Bottom line is you have four basic types of vehicle owners.
One is oblivious about the vehicle. Treats them with the same attiude I do with regards to tap water. Its always going to work, I don’t have to do anything but ‘turn it on’.
Second, the ‘beat the hell out of the vehicle’ types, that take any vehicle off road...and then complain when it breaks down, or gets stuck somewhere. They don’t even KNOW how to check the oil level....but can’t leave a stop sign without burning off 800 miles of rubber from the tires, races to the next stop sign and crushes the brakes to avoid sailing through...leaves the vehicle running no matter how long they might be in a store buying beer and cigs...you know the type. Oh, and they have their stereo on, setting the volume at the level so high the the windows two hundred yards away shake from the reverb, and naturally they have all the windows down....
Third, the driver that spends more ‘quality time’ with the vehicle then his or her family. Vehicle always looks show room great, always serviced to the mile or date, waxed weekly, kept under a tarp in a garage that looks cleaner than the average hospital O.R. (chuckle)
And the last group, those of us that understand its a machine, requires regular maintenance, and like any other machine it will break if you abuse it.
You’re wrong there. Come to Texas and you’ll see Hummer drivers very evident and quite mobile, many driven by soccer mom types! Amazing. As for me, I love driving my 9 yr. old FULL SIZE pickup truck that continues getting 19-20 mph loaded or empty, doesn’t matter.
But I smile and wave at Hummer drivers too, they represent good ol’ independent thinking Americans to me.
I GET IT! HAHAHHHAHHAHHA
Fair? What's unfair about it? Do you, dear author, claim that all vehicles have the same service life?
The fact that the Hummer will last twice as long, in miles, as the Prius is precisely the issue!
This looks like the Liberal definition of the word "fair". def: The comparison is fair when my views are vindicated.
“Oh yeah...it was my wife who insisted that we purchase a H2 back in 2003. Im glad I listened to her. My wife is so cool.”
I had a late model Avalanche before the H2, got the Hummer for the increased towing capacity.
Have you had problems with the ‘green drivers’? I drive ‘into town’ about thirty minutes a few times per month, and half the time I get some idiot with a enviromental bumper sticker flipping me the bird, or doing something equally as silly.
I once had a woman approach me at Krogers once while loading grocery’s, she asked me ‘how can you drive that monster with global warming happening?’
My reply was ‘Because I support the United Auto Workers, and American manufacturing. The cost of this Hummer paid several dozen Union members wages and healthcare and retirement costs...you do support working Americans don’t you?’
Try it, they always look completely stunned...and you can ‘tap the horn’ and wave with a big grin as you leave out....trust me, its Priceless, the look on their face.
I put a lot of miles on my Prius. I bought it in Nov. 2004. I now have 85K miles on it. Everything is working fine. The battery continues to charge with no evidence of fading. My average MPG is about 49 over the life of the car. True, I have to explain to people that I am not an enviro whacko, just a gadget guy who drives a lot of miles. My car has much more than broken even over my previous VW Passat, which averaged 24 MPG. But to each his own.
“Id love to see what that lard-ass looks like on a road bicycle!!! As for the sway that is something you seem to get used to. When I switch from my truck to the Burbs(we actually own 2 of the beasts) it takes awhile to get comfy with that. The wifes dream car is the Ford Excursion. Never drove it and am wondering how that handles.”
My wife is about to trade in her Avalon, her second one and a fine vehicle for the city and burbs, but a bit of a concern here in The Zone (Appalachia Zone in S Ohio).
She’s looked at the Explorer’s, we had a 1996 model til I bought the Avalanche, and it was a great SUV, completely satisfied with it. She didn’t care for the Excursion based on her ‘homework’ on it, but its a matter of ‘driver feel’ so whatever she wants, she’s going to get. We both own/drive what we like, modified by the basic requirements of where we live - the exception being her Avalon is paid for so we’ve kept it til now.
She’s leaning towards the Santa Fe, but the dealership is over an hour drive time from our house - we are ‘out there’ a bit to say the least.
“Youre wrong there. Come to Texas and youll see Hummer drivers “
Yep, and we wave at each other same as bikers do....(chuckle)
I just picked up a BMW as my getting around car. What a great machine....quick and pretty good on gas.
(whats the latest news on Civil War II?)
If not for the fact I don’t like putting stickers on my vehicles I’d buy the ‘My SUV ‘hearts’ Iraqi Oil’.
“I just picked up a BMW as my getting around car. What a great machine....quick and pretty good on gas.”
Where you live its the perfect vehicle, bro.
(whats the latest news on Civil War II?)
...so did you find out who knocked down the WTC? What about the pending shooting war, is that still being planned over there?
“...so did you find out who knocked down the WTC? What about the pending shooting war, is that still being planned over there?”
ROTFL! Lets not do this in the forum, old friend. Its not fair to the host.
You have mail.
“Its not fair to the host”
....yeah, guess so......I like FR, the software is easy and the articles are for the most part great.....
“....yeah, guess so......I like FR, the software is easy and the articles are for the most part great.....”
Big improvement over how it was just a few years back. I’m pleasantly surprised.
Even though I live in California, I live in a very “red state” pocket in Riverside County. The area is on the backside of the Marine Corps’ Camp Pendleton and just about an hour north of the San Diego Navy bases. Lots of military, veterans and otherwise patriotic and traditional Americans living here in my area. I think many have moved here to escape the failed liberal urban cities like L.A. and San Diego.
I mostly get lots of waves and thumbs up in my area.
I also drive around with Navy Veteran license plates.
Hell...I figure that I served my country and I was deployed to the Persian Gulf three times in the 1980s where we escorted Kuwaiti Oil tankers out of the gulf war zone, so I am entitled to drive whatever the hell I want to drive.
Anyways...I think that because of my veteran plates and bumper stickers, any of those ‘green drivers’ must think that I am too aggressive and unpredictable to confront. Perhaps the pro-gun bumper stickers also pacify them.
I have driven our H2 to places like L.A. and San Diego, but I really haven’t noticed any backlash from ‘green drivers.’ I have driven my H2 to anti-war “peace rallies” that we would crash through FReeper operations and Protest Warrior counter rallies and I haven’t had any problems either.
Maybe the libs just think that I am so politically incorrect and conservative that they think I have some kind a hair trigger temper. If that is what they think...I’m cool with it. Truth is I work in law enforcement and I come from a family of cops. I am really big into obeying the law and maintaining public order. I don’t seek to start trouble so I can thump on leftist moonbats. I do like exercising free speech though.
Whether they do “flip the bird” at me I honestly just haven’t noticed. I am usually just having too much fun driving and I am in a nirvana like state.
There was just one incident that I can remember just a few days after we bought our H2...I was driving north on I-15 around Lake Elsinore in the fast lane. Some middle aged lady in a sub-compact came speeding along and kept swerving around me and scowling at me. I did not see any political slogans on her car (liberal or otherwise) and at the time I had no political bumper stickers on the H2 and I had no license plates (the SUV was just days old.)
I don’t know if she was angry because she hates SUVs or if she was just going through menopause or a bad hair day or whatever. Truth is...I just didn’t even care anyway. If she has a problem with what I choose to drive, well...then that is her problem, not mine.
That is basically the attitude that I take, and I always feel just great when driving around in our SUV.
I like your response to the lady at the supermarket. Flip the argument around and put the onus on them.
Ask them if they support the right of a woman to “choose.” I guess that I would just reply to such ‘green drivers’ that I was just respecting my wife’s right to “choice” when it comes to driving. That ought to shut them up...
My wife wasn’t too thrilled about stickers and the residue mess either.
That’s why I put the stickers on soft magnetic backing that you can buy for about $10 a roll at any arts and crafts store.
It’s not about battery life, it’s about motor, transmission and drive train life. Lightweight cars start falling apart at about 100K because they are lightweight.
Who is going to spend $2500 on a new battery when the rest of it could fall apart at any time.
The problem is that the envirowacko’s only look at mileage and not at the total picture of a vehicle’s cost/benefit ratio.
“I also drive around with Navy Veteran license plates.”
I keep my CV62 - USS Independence’ ballcap on the dash of my H2. The two ‘humps’ directly above the stereo/map/enviromental controls keep it in place for all to see.
Out here where I live, the Hummer always draws a crowd, the old Farmers and the young kids all want to check it out and ask me questions. For the first year and a half I couldn’t fill up at the local stop and grab without a ‘tour’ it seemed. No problems from any of them, then again they drive huge machines - John Deere Green and three stories tall, so mph isn’t a big issue to them. Not to mention they all have F series diesel pick up trucks with the four wheel rear ends for towing the things farmers have to tow as part of the life they lead.
But if I drive west towards the ‘big city’ such as it is, I’ll inevitably see a Prius or Le Car type giving me a dirty look...most of the time while their kids are waving furiously with big smiles and a bit of excitement at seeing a Hummer next to em. Always makes me laugh, which just infuriates the greenie even more....(chuckle)
“Thats why I put the stickers on soft magnetic backing that you can buy for about $10 a roll at any arts and crafts store.”
There we have it, more confirmation H2 owners are in fact genius quality....(chuckle)
Can you put a plow blade on it, or will it fall apart?
“Can you put a plow blade on it, or will it fall apart?”
I’m sure you could, and its pretty obvious you’ve never actually owned one, or you wouldn’t even think it might ‘fall apart’.
Even Consumer Reports rated it Excellent for ‘off road capability’ so that should answer your question. If it ‘fell apart’ like say....a Jeep Cherokee, they wouldn’t say that.