Posted on 09/27/2009 5:04:44 AM PDT by J. Neil Schulman
Thank you! :-)
I didn't say you did. I'm just pointing out that it is not the breathing that makes the baby a living baby.
Welcome :-)
Tribune7 wrote:
“What would be the difference between that and killing it in the womb i.e. an abortion 61-minutes earlier?”
What’s the difference between shooting someone before they take out their gun and point it at you, shooting someone an instant before they pull the trigger, or shooting them after they dropped their gun and are running away?
Timing is sometimes everything.
JNS
Concentrating, then, on the definition of murder - are there instances where this is not simply the taking of a human life, but the unjustified taking of a human life? In this case you must find a justification. The life of the mother has been used as such a justification. The "quality of life" of the child once born has been used as a justification, however presumptuous that bit of prophecy might be considered. Inconvenience has been used as a justification. But in any of these cases, a deliberate decision has been made to end a human life.
So redefine "murder" if you like to make it fit the occasion, but please do not presume to redefine what is human.
I write precisely. The statement “Abortion is murder” is the assertion that all abortions are murders. I did not argue that no abortion can constitute a homicide.
The first and last examples would both be murder but If the baby had his finger on the trigger and was ready to kill you, you would be in your rights to take him out.
rlmorel wrote:
“Please describe to me a genocidal event in history where people were systematically rounded up throughout an entire continent using modern communication and mechanization, shipped like commercial product to multiple centralized hubs to be processed as cattle in meat packing and slaughtered by the millions in a matter of a few short years.”
Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn calculated the death count of Soviet victims who were shipped to gulags and labor camps at 60 million — ten times the number of Jewish victims of Hitler. The events overlap so similar “modern communication and mechanization” were used in both cases.
JNS
Codeflier wrote:
“The reactions to your list demonstrate all that is wrong with contemporary debate of issues. Everyone is looking for 100% agreement without discussion. If people disagree on just one topic - that’s it! Finished! No more discussion.”
Excellent point well said.
You also want to enforce Exodus 21 17 and Exodus 22 17-19?
aruanan wrote:
“41 And it came to pass, that, when Elisabeth heard the salutation of Mary, the babe leaped in her womb; and Elisabeth was filled with the Holy Ghost: And she spake out with a loud voice, and said, Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb. And whence is this to me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me? For, lo, as soon as the voice of thy salutation sounded in mine ears, the babe leaped in my womb for joy.”
So your argument to me is that the proximity of Jesus to Elizabeth’s fetus certainly and in no event could have produced anything extraordinary, divine, or miraculous? Or is the point of this passage precisely that?
JNS
Republic of Texas wrote:
“If this man is going to convince me the he alone knows when the soul enters the body, I’m gonna need a miracle as proof.”
I don’t need to assert that I know for my statement to be true. I merely need to assert that the charge of murder requires knowing ... and I note a great deal of debate and theological disagreement on that point within this forum’s discussion.
JNS
Brugmansian wrote:
“No one is denying freedom or religion to anyone. No one except those who claim Christians are out to get people. As you just suggested they are.”
I make no such claim regarding “Christians” since as an individualist I would not make such a collectivist generalization.
But some individual Christians certainly have. It is to them I addressed my remarks.
JNS
That is ten million people over how many years? 1918 to, say, 1974 when he left the Soviet Union? Well, that isn’t the point anyway.
The Soviets weren’t putting everyone on those trains to kill them. The Nazis were, after they used whatever resources were left.
People left the Gulag with the blessings of the Soviet government. People weren’t released from concentration camps except by death or liberation.
No. That's their own chosen name after complaining about a campaign commercial which had the word "democrats" scroll across the screen. Of course the last part of the last syllable (rats) was the final word fragment to exit the screen.
So since I had to explain it to you: Reason #1 why most Jews are democRATs!
And, I will remember to add this time, with apologies to our pro-life conservative Jewish friends.
Repeal The 17th wrote:
“All I know is that I reviewed your posting history.
You signed up a few years ago to shill a book...
A year or so later you posted to shill another book...
6 months or so later you posted to shill another book...
No posts in between and no commentary in between.
It makes it look like you are using FR
as a resource to shill books.
Correct me if I am wrong.”
You’re wrong. The book I linked for free downloads is not new. It was first published in 1979.
And I have, without asking for compensation, cross-posted my professionally-published articles numerous times on Free Republic.
But thanks for revealing yourself as a communist who is opposed to anyone supporting their family as a professional writer.
JNS
Your logic is as twisted as a pretzel.
Good grief. With precise writing like that, you sounded like a former President there.
Ah. No wonder I didn’t get it. I’ve never been a Democrat.
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