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Wrong Door Raid and Flash-Bang Grenade Heart Attack Provoke Lawsuits
Reason ^ | October 13, 2011 | Lucy Steigerwald

Posted on 10/18/2011 8:44:26 PM PDT by Immerito

A few victims of the drug war's "standard procedure" are fighting back in court. First, a Colorado Springs woman who suffered a heart attack during a raid has brought a lawsuit:

Rose Ann Santistevan, 71, is suing for medical expenses and noneconomic losses such as pain and suffering.

An emphysema sufferer, Santistevan was alone in bed receiving oxygen on Oct. 6, 2009, when a multijurisdictional SWAT task force with a search warrant surrounded her home in the 200 block of South Prospect Street. They threw in a flash-bang grenade before rushing in with guns drawn, authorities have confirmed.

Stricken by a heart attack, Santistevan was admitted in critical condition at Memorial Hospital Central, where she remained for several days. A search of her home yielded no arrests and turned up no drugs, the family said.

(Excerpt) Read more at reason.com ...


TOPICS: Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS: donutwatch; isolatedincindent; standingarmy; swat; wod; wosd; wrongdoor

1 posted on 10/18/2011 8:44:35 PM PDT by Immerito
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To: Immerito

I believe that we need laws in every state that say when SWAT teams invade the wrong home and people and things die or are seriously injured, they all need to be fired and their pensions stripped away, and the main leaders of the team need to be brought up on criminal charges.

Seriously. This sh1t happens way too often and there’s just no downside for making lethal or permanent injury mistakes. If it’s important enough to USE a SWAT team for, it’s important enough to gather the proper effing intelligence and double and triple check it.


2 posted on 10/18/2011 9:13:33 PM PDT by Secret Agent Man (I'd like to tell you, but then I'd have to kill you.)
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To: Immerito
Surprisingly it seems that no dogs were shot in either of the raids. Did the SWAT team have to go down to the animal shelter afterward to let off a little steam?
3 posted on 10/18/2011 9:19:32 PM PDT by KarlInOhio (Compare "Delay is preferable to error" - Thomas Jefferson // "Pass this bill now!" - Barack Obama)
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To: Secret Agent Man

Totally agree with you.


4 posted on 10/18/2011 9:20:28 PM PDT by handmade
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To: Secret Agent Man

Agreed. If the only way to stop this wrong house nonsense is to fire EVERYONE involved in planning, researching and/or implementing a raid on a wrong house, then so be it.


5 posted on 10/18/2011 9:37:31 PM PDT by Immerito (Reading Through the Bible in 90 Days)
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To: Secret Agent Man

I have a more radical idea.
End the unconstitutional war on drugs and restore the 4th amendment.


6 posted on 10/18/2011 9:38:49 PM PDT by Gunslingr3
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To: Gunslingr3

That won’t get rid of SWAT. Why? Because they are not using it to take down KNOWN drug gangs in their KNOWN drug houses.

They go after an individual. in a normal house. without pit bulls and automatic weapons and fortified walls and such.

Even though that’s how they SOLD SWAT to all of us.

It’s part of State Dept Publication 5277 “Freedom From War” Stage II/Stage III. Militarization of internal police forces. That’s why they won’t get rid of it. It’s a bait and switch tactic. Claim it will be used for one thing but it’s really put in place for another.

Personally I am with you. End the war on drugs. Let the big drug companies make pure safe drugs for sale. Thing is, when people get addicted, they are locked into a big building and given as much free drugs as they want until they are dead.


7 posted on 10/18/2011 9:55:19 PM PDT by Secret Agent Man (I'd like to tell you, but then I'd have to kill you.)
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To: Secret Agent Man
You have to go up the chain of command..the one that planned it, the one that didn't do do diligence in checking out the house, the leader of the SWAT team, the judge that issued the warrent on either lies or misinformation needs to be also part of the clean up of the whole situation..Those that followed orders and assumed the above was properly done, are of a lesser degree responsible...It starts at the top with the commander..

Too many of these guys think they are super cops. There is no excuse for sloppy work when you are the ones carrying guns and flash bangs and tear gas.... Yep, the firing starts at the top....

8 posted on 10/18/2011 10:04:32 PM PDT by goat granny
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To: Secret Agent Man

I think there are times and places for SWAT (barricade/hostage - the reason it was originally created).

All the SWAT ‘horror stories’ I see involve bungled drug raids. Bad informant info, sloppy warrants, etc.


9 posted on 10/18/2011 10:23:57 PM PDT by Gunslingr3
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To: Secret Agent Man

IMO, Swat teams need to be outlawed, period. As for entering the wrong home, arrests should be made and people terminated regardless if the residents of the dwelling were injured or not. No knock warrants also need to be declared unconstitutional. The judges who allowed these travesties of justice to begin with should be doing jail time. There is nothing in the constitution to justify no knock raids or “probable cause” searches.


10 posted on 10/18/2011 11:02:11 PM PDT by calex59
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To: goat granny
"Those that followed orders and assumed the above was properly done, are of a lesser degree responsible...It starts at the top with the commander."

Bravo Sierra! When I was a combat infantryman I had a duty to ensure that I was following only lawful orders and had a right and duty to disregard an unlawful order. We need some LEOs willing to stand up to the chain of command and put a stop to these practices.

A bigger question is why there are so damned many local law enforcement agencies equipped with paramilitary equipment and units. You give those clowns all of those toys and they will look for opportunities to use it.

11 posted on 10/18/2011 11:36:43 PM PDT by Natural Law
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To: Immerito
I'm impressed that there are people here who think that firing is the right thing to do when the paramilitary police get it wrong. I have a better idea: when the police break into a home not specified in the warrant, they are treated exactly like a non-policeman breaking and entering into a home. They should do jail time, frankly.

And what about the warrant based on bad intel? Well, we have laws on the books about lying to the cops, right? Enforce them.

We don't need new law. We just need to use the ones we already have.

12 posted on 10/18/2011 11:53:58 PM PDT by asinclair (Talk is cheap, actions are priceless)
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To: Natural Law
I didn't give those clowns anything. But I do agree that SWAT is out of control in many area's...I also think any LEO that has to wear a mask so you cannot tell who is doing what should be outlawed..

If LEO's are out of control it is because the commanders allow them to do what they do.

My father was a mounted man in Detroit (during the 30-40's) he retired in 1950. He said if the cop on the beat or in the car is doing crap, its the commanders fault. Not just the guy on the beat. He was in a position of having men under him, I think he knew what he was talking about....even back then cops could get fired for getting out of line....(can we all say unions make that difficult in this day and age)

But as for your being sure you only followed lawful orders, I cannot believe that you questioned every order you were given by the one in charge over you....You wouldn't last long in the military if you did that and probably wouldn't make a very good soldier. Too busy asking your commander if the orders were lawful...Unless you misstated what you meant...

13 posted on 10/19/2011 12:16:32 AM PDT by goat granny
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To: goat granny
"I cannot believe that you questioned every order you were given by the one in charge over you"

We were very well trained and knew what constituted a violation of the UCMJ and the Geneva Convention. Further, based upon the Nuremburg precedents we knew that "just following orders" wasn't an acceptable excuse and the execution of an unlawful order would result in more than a paid administrative leave. The situation should be even more severe with domestic law enforcement.

BTW - I lasted too long.

14 posted on 10/19/2011 1:01:30 AM PDT by Natural Law
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To: Gunslingr3
>"End the unconstitutional war on drugs and restore the 4th amendment."

But who'll tell us which flowers we can't grow?

Can't be having felonious farming or aggravated agriculture occurring. Why society would collapse into a bunch of illiterate thug gangster wannabees.

15 posted on 10/19/2011 1:55:27 AM PDT by rawcatslyentist (It is necessary that a person be born of a father who is a citizen; ~Vattel's Law of Nations)
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To: Immerito
Pretty terrible for that poor old lady.

But this story is still my favorite so far this year:
The U.S. Department of Education issued the search (warrant) and called in the S.W.A.T for his wife’s defaulted student loans.

patdollard.com

16 posted on 10/19/2011 2:54:08 AM PDT by Daaave (Magically delicious!)
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To: Daaave

I know this response is from Huffpoo about the raid on the student loan. I don’t know if any reason for the raid has been found other than the explanation of a criminal investigation.

Department of Education Press Secretary Justin Hamilton confirmed to The Huffington Post that the agency’s Office of the Inspector General (OIG) did indeed order the action, although he said it was not about an issue over student loans in default.

“While it was reported in local media that the search was related to a defaulted student loan, that is incorrect,” Hamilton said. “This is related to a criminal investigation. The Inspector General’s Office does not execute search warrants for late loan payments.”

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/06/08/department-education-raid-default-student-loans_n_873272.html


17 posted on 10/19/2011 3:12:18 AM PDT by listenhillary (Look your representatives in the eye and ask if they intend to pay off the debt. They will look away)
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To: listenhillary
I just read your post. And I still see that the Department of Education did indeed order the action.

The Department of Education ordered the raid and SWAT raided the wrong house.

The Department of Education just says that it wasn't over student loans. And they won't say why they ordered the raid.

18 posted on 10/19/2011 3:51:44 AM PDT by Daaave (Magically delicious!)
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To: Secret Agent Man

“Personally I am with you. End the war on drugs. Let the big drug companies make pure safe drugs for sale. Thing is, when people get addicted, they are locked into a big building and given as much free drugs as they want until they are dead.”

Thank you, that is the same ideas I have. Restore the 4th Amendment, take away the cartels and street gangs profit, and it would be far cheaper to have clinics where addicts can do all the dope they want for free. The problem will solve itself.

I am glad that more people are seeing this. Crime will drop off greatly.

FWIW, 16 years as a police officer seeing the never ending craziness has made up my mind. Never hit a wrong door but hit plenty of dry holes and even good pops make absolutely no difference.


19 posted on 10/19/2011 4:12:13 AM PDT by Molon Labbie ("It's Free, Swipe Your EBT!")
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To: Daaave

I’d like to know what it was about. Fraud?


20 posted on 10/19/2011 5:07:04 AM PDT by listenhillary (Look your representatives in the eye and ask if they intend to pay off the debt. They will look away)
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To: Secret Agent Man

Every cop involved in a wrong address raid should be prosecuted for illegal entry, breaking and entering, kidnapping, committing a felony while armed, etc, etc, etc, etc. I’ll bet you wouldn’t need to do that more than twenty times before every cop is triple checking the address and the wrong addres raids STOP.


21 posted on 10/19/2011 5:09:03 AM PDT by magslinger (To properly protect your family you need a Bible, a twelve gauge and a pig.)
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To: Gunslingr3
All the SWAT ‘horror stories’ I see involve bungled drug raids. Bad informant info, sloppy warrants, etc.

Guess you missed the Branch Davidians.

ML/NJ

22 posted on 10/19/2011 6:03:30 AM PDT by ml/nj
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To: Natural Law
Opps, I shouldn't question anyone smarter than me..(a compliment not insult:O) Military service runs though my family...Ouchy....During my 2 son's years in the military, One Air Force, One Navy, each one has at least one time when they questioned what they were being told to do...One ended up in the brig one time (if I am remembering rightly what I was told) and lost stripes. The other situation, the one giving the order was wrong and my son knew it and refused...(they were in the service during the cold war, no active fighting)

Your one of the good guys also....were you in JAG? a military lawyer?

The military doesn't have to deal with unions, so its a tad different to get rid of the bad ones when it comes to LEO.

Question---what did you mean by *you lasted too long*, just curious and of course you don't have to answer...GG

23 posted on 10/19/2011 2:24:12 PM PDT by goat granny
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To: listenhillary
Stupidly, I thought an over due library book (A Seinfeld episode). Theft, after all there was a search warrant. And then I thought embezzlement. Fraud is as good a guess and any.

We would have to know more facts. And the Dept. of Education isn't talking.

24 posted on 10/19/2011 10:46:48 PM PDT by Daaave ("You see, but you do not observe." Sherlock Holmes)
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To: Abathar; Abcdefg; Abram; Abundy; albertp; Alexander Rubin; Allosaurs_r_us; amchugh; ...



Libertarian ping! Click here to get added or here to be removed or post a message here!
25 posted on 10/25/2011 8:10:13 PM PDT by bamahead (Few men desire liberty; most men wish only for a just master. -- Sallust)
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To: The KG9 Kid

ping.


26 posted on 10/25/2011 8:12:33 PM PDT by bamahead (Few men desire liberty; most men wish only for a just master. -- Sallust)
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To: Natural Law

“A bigger question is why there are so damned many local law enforcement agencies equipped with paramilitary equipment and units.”

It is the bigger question. So far, without good answer.


27 posted on 10/25/2011 8:22:12 PM PDT by Psalm 144 (Voodoo Republicans: Don't read their lips - watch their hands.)
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To: rawcatslyentist

“But who’ll tell us which flowers we can’t grow?

Can’t be having felonious farming or aggravated agriculture occurring. Why society would collapse into a bunch of illiterate thug gangster wannabees.”

Goodness! One might even be elected President that way!


28 posted on 10/25/2011 8:25:27 PM PDT by Psalm 144 (Voodoo Republicans: Don't read their lips - watch their hands.)
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To: rawcatslyentist
Why society would collapse into a bunch of illiterate thug gangster wannabees.

That segment already has the Presidency. Might as well let em have the rest.

29 posted on 10/25/2011 10:31:44 PM PDT by Still Thinking (Freedom is NOT a loophole!)
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To: Psalm 144

I see that phrase struck you the same way it struck me.


30 posted on 10/25/2011 10:35:26 PM PDT by Still Thinking (Freedom is NOT a loophole!)
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To: bamahead

Surprised that they didn’t tase her for being non-responsive after they got in...


31 posted on 10/27/2011 6:16:20 AM PDT by SuperLuminal (Where is another agitator for republicanism like Sam Adams when we need him?)
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To: goat granny
.Those that followed orders and assumed the above was properly done, are of a lesser degree responsible...It starts at the top with the commander.."

Yep...Although I'm old enough to remember that excuse being used post-WWII by concentration camp guards and railroad engineers (first-hand on RR engineers)...

32 posted on 10/27/2011 6:20:47 AM PDT by SuperLuminal (Where is another agitator for republicanism like Sam Adams when we need him?)
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