RYO tobacco tax increase?

[djf]

There was a brief blurb on the morning news about an increase to the tax on pipe tobacco, which many people are using for roll your own cigarettes. Does anyone have more info? I thought I heard them say it goes into effect tomorrow. I can't find info if it is a change to state law or federal law.

Anybody know more about this?

[cripplecreek]

5000% is a nice round number. Hell why not, they raised the taxes on loose cigarette tobacco by 2300% a couple years ago.

Welcome to America

[Copenhagen Smile]

Grow your own.

[libertarian27]

Just looked around - see articles from Maryland, Illinois and California....state increases.....what channel were you watching? (PM me if needed)

[djf]

What makes me just as mad is that they have about a 90 second piece on it on the morning news, so I go to the KING5 site and try to find the story - use Google Search, use Yahoo search, use their own website internal search and NUTHIN!!!

Anything that they broadcast on the air ought to be easily findable on the web site.

A reasonable man would expect that...

[listenhillary]

Still about $13.50 a pound before shipping where I had been buying.

[libertarian27]

http://www.king5.com/news/politics/Did-state-lawmakers-pass-a-tax-without-actually-calling-it-a-new-tax-148023655.html

[eartick]

Yep, exactly what I am doing. Friend of mine gave me 4 different seed types and am starting my own patch.

[libertarian27]

http://www.westseattleherald.com/2012/06/29/news/update-judge-rules-state-cant-tax-roll-your-own-c

[libertarian27]

Use this search when you need to dig around(I use it a bunch)
http://www.google.co.uk/advanced_search

Really good search engine to search Free Republic too!

[djf]

Both the state and the feds have been moaning and groaning about it. That’s why I’m trying to find out. A State law might not affect the Indian smoke shop where I get my stuff.

But I’m pretty sure that a federal tax increase they have to go along with it.

I just bought 5 more pounds, so I have a total of about 12 lbs in storage... but hey, 22 bucks a pound, damn, that’s larceny!

[unixfox]

Grow your own.

Until they make that illegal as well.

[cripplecreek]

Few people were aware of the 2300% increase in 09 until it hit. In the eyes of media, smokers are unworthy of serious reporting on issues of importance to them.

Nonsmokers like myself can ignore or even find justification for massive tax increases like that but in the end we'll hurt just as much. The revenue stream will slow to a trickle and something else will come into the IRS gun sites.

Between the 2300% increase and our own state imposed tax increases the revenue dried up here in Michigan and our legislators immediately went looking for something else to tax. They even considered taxing free food eaten by restaurant employees.

Michigan Lottery sales, taxes on cigarettes and casino gambling plummet; Gov. Jennifer Granholm says revenue decline is 'breathtaking'

[mrsmith]

There’s a tax increase in the Highway bill for places that provide a RYO machine on-premise :

“SEC. 100122. ROLL-YOUR-OWN CIGARETTE MACHINES.
(a) IN GENERAL.—Subsection (d) of section 5702 of the Internal
Revenue Code of 1986 is amended by adding at the end the following
new flush sentence:
‘‘Such term shall include any person who for commercial purposes
makes available for consumer use (including such consumer’s personal
consumption or use under paragraph (1)) a machine capable
of making cigarettes, cigars, or other tobacco products. A person
making such a machine available for consumer use shall be deemed
the person making the removal as defined by subsection (j) with respect
to any tobacco products manufactured by such machine. A person
who sells a machine directly to a consumer at retail for a consumer’s
personal home use is not making a machine available for
commercial purposes if such machine is not used at a retail premises
and is designed to produce tobacco products only in personal
use quantities.’’.”

I’d guess stores that have those machines will just remove them.

[mrsmith]

Uh oh, you’re in Washington state?
http://blog.thenewstribune.com/politics/2012/06/29/ap-washington-supreme-court-puts-injunction-against-roll-your-own-smokes-tax-on-hold/

Too bad. (Oh, and it’s “not a tax increase” LOL!)

[kingu]

I was a Roll Your Own’er for 4 years, stopped smoking just before Valentine's Day this year, mostly by switching over to a personal vaporizer. Being able to sidestep the massive amount of regulation in California over where smoking is permitted is a side benefit - biggest is that I've discarded the smell, the mess, the chemicals of smoking and kept the one part I really wanted, the nicotine.

I loved how someone came charging up to me, berating me for contaminating her airspace with ‘my disgusting habit.’ I asked her how my organic watermelon juice was doing that.

Admittedly, having been a lifelong smoker who had parents who were lifelong smokers, I really had no idea how strong the smell was on just about everything around me.

Anyway, not trying to hijack a thread - sounds like the old ‘well, we meant to include these people in the law, we just didn't realize how many of them there were..’ pickpocket attempt. And I think it's a pretty easy ruling by a judge that it is a tax - after all, it affects a new group of people, it has an effective date, and a quantifiable amount that is separate from the existing tax.

Only issue is, I've really never seen smokers fight back against these laws.

[cripplecreek]

I’d guess stores that have those machines will just remove them.

I'd rather remove congressmen who vote for such stupidity.

[djf]

It’s still very unclear. What are they taxing?

The tobacco? The papers and filters? The finished product?

I guess it doesn’t matter to them, they just want THE MONEY!!!

They’d make 100 times more cash with a five cent tax on fast food french fries, but that’s just my opinion...

[mrsmith]

Washington and the feds are just raising the tax on cigs made on the RYO machines at some stores.
There’s nothing about pipe tobacco or the tubes being taxed more.

Here’s a good article on the Wash law:
http://www.thenewstribune.com/2012/06/30/2200306/franklin-court-ruling-wont-stop.html

If, like me, you buy ‘pipe tobacco’ and tubes and make your own at home there shouldn’t be any change.

[cripplecreek]

The tobacco? The papers and filters? The finished product?

Sounds to me like they're taxing them as a manufactured product. Taxes on manufacturing are a too often overlooked job killer in America. Taxes on manufacturing are very similar to VAT taxes in my opinion. They tax the mined ore, they tax the refined metal, they tax the machined part, they tax the finished product.... Apply that to the steps involved in creating a cigarette and its the same thing.

Just a basic end of the line sales tax clearly labeled on all products might slap the crap out of the people better than a whole string of taxes hidden all the way down the line.