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Why do we keep assuming the Sikh shooter thought he was killing Muslims?(vanity chat)
Mamzelle

Posted on 08/07/2012 6:12:50 AM PDT by Mamzelle

This appears to be the assumption of Sikhs in America, the news media and even the internet media.

The shooter was military trained in psychological warfare, I believe is a fact? Why do we think that he would confuse Sikhs with Muslims?

I certainly do not. I can tell the difference between a Sikh and a Muslim from a hundred yards in an Atlanta shopping mall. Sikhs have an elegant and kindly air about them, their beards are trimmed with a romantic style and their turbans draped artistically and distinctively. Their woman do not cringe and crouch and do not behave as if they are beaten daily.

Whatever this nut was thinking, there's no evidence yet that this is a matter of mistaken identity.


TOPICS: Conspiracy
KEYWORDS: massacre; muslim; sikh; sikhtemple; wadepage; wisconsin
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1 posted on 08/07/2012 6:13:03 AM PDT by Mamzelle
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To: Mamzelle

I want to know why the psychological field isn’t taking more heat in these shootings. They sure seem to be somewhere involved in nearly all of them.


2 posted on 08/07/2012 6:15:19 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: Mamzelle

Perhaps he hated the smell of curry.


3 posted on 08/07/2012 6:16:15 AM PDT by .45 Long Colt
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To: Mamzelle

I believe the shooter made an assassination business agreement with a foreign power, news the MSM won’t tell anyone about.

One of the victims did have a bounty on his head.


4 posted on 08/07/2012 6:17:26 AM PDT by Eye of Unk (Going mobile, posts will be brief. No spellcheck for the grammar nazis.)
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To: Mamzelle

The word Muslim makes headlines, creates controversy and sells advertising so the MSM bends over backwards to get it in, even if they have to make it up!


5 posted on 08/07/2012 6:19:33 AM PDT by vet7279
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To: Mamzelle

There was a Sikh in my community who owned a gas station. After 9/11, he put up a sign that he as a Sikh and not a Muslim. Quite frankly, I don’t think anyone cared but I think he was sensitive to the fact that he thought people would mistake him for a Muslim and associate him with the 9/11 bombings. He is still there operating the gas station. I don’t believe he had a drop off in business after 9/11 (I still went there). So perhaps some of this is the Sikh community itself being sensitive to people’s views of Muslims and making clear that they are not Muslims.


6 posted on 08/07/2012 6:19:57 AM PDT by Opinionated Blowhard ("When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic.")
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To: Mamzelle

Some may be over-playing his psy-ops role. Enlisted in psy-ops means he couldn’t shoot so someone stuck him repairing radios.

I think a lot of the assumption comes from the amount of attacks on sikhs since 9/11 mistaking them for Muslims.

You are right though, it is too early to know motivation. For all we know, he was just fired from a job and his boss went to that temple.


7 posted on 08/07/2012 6:20:05 AM PDT by mnehring
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To: Mamzelle

Because lots of people want it to be that way.


8 posted on 08/07/2012 6:21:30 AM PDT by stuartcr ("When silence speaks, it speaks only to those that have already decided what they want to hear.")
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To: Eye of Unk
--an arrangement with a foreign entity--

That's exactly the thought that came to me. The Muslims have been killing Sikhs for centuries.

9 posted on 08/07/2012 6:22:05 AM PDT by Mamzelle
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To: Opinionated Blowhard
The Indians I know would hate, hate, hate to be thought Muslim. It may be that the Sikhs are insulted when they are mistaken for Muslims.

"I'm not Muslim. Not that there's anything wrong with that."

10 posted on 08/07/2012 6:24:20 AM PDT by Mamzelle
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To: Eye of Unk

Obviously, by the quick response of the government, there is more to this story.....and of course we will never know. The area surrounding this neighborhood is filled with pockets of homosexuals, Amish gang bangers, Mexicans and Asians. So why pick the Sikhs?


11 posted on 08/07/2012 6:24:30 AM PDT by mouse1
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To: Mamzelle

I would LOVE to see the NRA offer to train the Sikhs in the safe and legal use of firearms to protect themselves.

This incident should prove to the Sikhs, and everyone else, that the police can not protect you from violence.

Citizens, trained and armed, are the only protection for their family and loved ones.

That’s the way it’s done here in America; welcome.


12 posted on 08/07/2012 6:24:30 AM PDT by Darteaus94025
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To: Mamzelle
I certainly do not. I can tell the difference between a Sikh and a Muslim from a hundred yards in an Atlanta shopping mall. Sikhs have an elegant and kindly air about them, their beards are trimmed with a romantic style and their turbans draped artistically and distinctively. Their woman do not cringe and crouch and do not behave as if they are beaten daily.

I have a Sikh temple in my town, so I know the difference. If you live in a large metro area like Atlanta, it's likely that you would also have been exposed to this rather small Indian sect.

Take that 75 miles out of the big city and that isn't the case, and when somebody's never seen a Sikh before, he's just another foreigner with a rag on his head. Believe me, there are a lot of people who don't know the difference.

Pity, since Sikhs are very pro-USA.

13 posted on 08/07/2012 6:26:03 AM PDT by Kenton (Pssst - I just heard from a guy that Harry Reid isn't just corrupt, he showers with kids!)
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To: cripplecreek

When you are a happy, polite and friendly guy, the psychiatrists try to keep you hooked into their system because they like sitting with you. They are eager to “help you” and extend that “help”.

But if you are really sick in the head and dangerous, they will seek to pass you off down the line so they don’t have to deal with that.


14 posted on 08/07/2012 6:27:18 AM PDT by Berlin_Freeper (Siri: Gold Baby, Gold!)
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To: Darteaus94025

That is a good idea. Sikhs have a long romantic warrior history—regular knights. I doubt they’ll want to be disarmed, not because they might be mistaken for Muslims, but because Muslims do not like Sikhs.


15 posted on 08/07/2012 6:28:05 AM PDT by Mamzelle
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To: Mamzelle

Because, anyone stupid enough to be that racist is also stupid enough to think “turbin = muslim”


16 posted on 08/07/2012 6:28:28 AM PDT by Private_Sector_Does_It_Better (I AM ANDREW BREITBART)
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To: Mamzelle

I just assumed that the neo-nazi types hated anyone that isn’t white, so the Sikhs qualified.


17 posted on 08/07/2012 6:29:53 AM PDT by ZX12R (FUBO GTFO 2012 !)
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To: mnehring

I agree that the psy-ops role is being over-emphasized.

Psy-ops means blaring rock music at Noreiga in Panama...not some journey into somebody’s mind. And, he enlisted as a private, an indication he had no academic training in pschology or psychiatry.

As far as I’m concerned, his ‘psy-ops’ role is completely meaningless.


18 posted on 08/07/2012 6:30:39 AM PDT by lacrew (Mr. Soetoro, we regret to inform you that your race card is over the credit limit.)
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To: Kenton

Well, of course they might be mistaken. Hindu Indians are mistaken for Muslims. It’s just that there is as much evidence, at this point in time, that the shooter knew what he was doing as there is that he was acting in total ignorance about Sikhs. Temples do not look like Mosques (although I don’t know what the one in Wisconsin looks like)—and Muslims don’t “worship” on Sunday.


19 posted on 08/07/2012 6:31:37 AM PDT by Mamzelle
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To: cripplecreek
I want to know why the psychological field isn’t taking more heat in these shootings. They sure seem to be somewhere involved in nearly all of them.

Bingo!

I take a lot of heat for saying so, but I see pyschology as modernist religion/cult. The learning and practice of it seems to disproportionately attract those with mental problems.

20 posted on 08/07/2012 6:31:37 AM PDT by PGR88
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To: Mamzelle

“Why do we keep assuming the Sikh shooter thought he was killing Muslims?”
****************

Cuz, 0’Pinhead’s “The Folks” mostly dunno/or care the difference....

Not like we’re dealing w/the brightest of the brightest here....

Semper Dummies
*****


21 posted on 08/07/2012 6:33:41 AM PDT by gunnyg ("A Constitution changed from Freedom, can never be restored; Liberty, once lost, is lost forever...)
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To: Mamzelle

I was wondering the same.

Too many — media, politicians, FReepers — are quick to jump on the nearest bandwagon.

I never heard where the guy lived, but I wondered whether this was a crime of opportunity, rather than a crime aimed at this specific group.

Initially, there were reports of up to 4 shooters. That gave rise to all kinds of conspiracy reports.

I also wondered whether the guy’s girlfriend (they apparently had broken up recently) might have had any connection to this religious community.

Without something more from the shooter [a manifesto, a love-sick letter/message/Facebook, insights from family and associates] all this is just speculation.

What makes a person go crazy and start killing? That is an age old question.


22 posted on 08/07/2012 6:41:07 AM PDT by TomGuy
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To: Mamzelle

It doesn’t much matter (to me, at least) what this nutcase’s motivation was. Walking into a house of worship, or any room full of people, and starting to shoot is wrong and evil. Period. I don’t care if they were Sikhs, Muslims, Christians, or whoever. I don’t care if it was mistaken identity or not. It was an act of evil.


23 posted on 08/07/2012 6:42:11 AM PDT by Conscience of a Conservative
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To: Mamzelle

I had never heard of a “white supremacist heavy metal band” which supposedly this guy was a member of.

Is that something that really exists or an MSM creation?


24 posted on 08/07/2012 6:48:45 AM PDT by nascarnation
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To: PGR88
I take a lot of heat for saying so, but I see pyschology as modernist religion/cult. The learning and practice of it seems to disproportionately attract those with mental problems.

I know it does. I knew a psychologist who was arrested and thrown off Wright Patterson AFB for stalking his estranged wife and threatening to kill her. We all knew he was nuts and knew there was trouble coming.

Hatred of Christianity and manipulation were at the very center of everything he did. His wife was estranged because of the psychological torture she endured and she walked away when he started doing the same to their toddler.

I also had a neighbor who was seeing a psychologist for her depression. His "treatment" was all about instant gratification. He told her to spend money on herself. She cleaned out he husband's bank account and ended kicking him to the curb. Then she stated sleeping with the shrink and he eventually dumped her. She ended up in a mental hospital.

We need to go back to the days when the local Pastor, Priest, or Rabbi dealt with these minor emotional issues. They at least had a moral basis that was far more effective in the long term than anything a psychiatrist can provide.

I was an angry troubled teen and I saw psychiatrists but the only real help I found was with my pastor. He helped me find my inner peace. He didn't try to manipulate me or anything, he simply told me the truth. Life is tough and everybody deals with the same issues and my only chance for finding happiness was in finding the strength to be happy in the face of it all.
25 posted on 08/07/2012 6:52:41 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: nascarnation

Many of these articles quote the Southern Poverty Law Center, a Marxist front supported by the Soros gang. They’re the ones with the “skinhead band” story. The SPLC is a bunch of dirty liars, but for this story they’re quoted all over the place!


26 posted on 08/07/2012 6:55:04 AM PDT by Mamzelle
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To: nascarnation
Is that something that really exists or an MSM creation?

White Nationalist/Skinhead punk and metal bands are substantial community that has been around for decades, all on their own small record labels. It's even bigger in Europe, where it is a controversial sub-genre of "Oi" music.

27 posted on 08/07/2012 6:57:08 AM PDT by Strategerist
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To: lacrew

Psyops is also about propaganda leaflets, etc.

It’s a lot less “woo-woo” than people think, as you have indicated.


28 posted on 08/07/2012 6:59:00 AM PDT by Strategerist
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To: Mamzelle
Temples do not look like Mosques (although I don’t know what the one in Wisconsin looks like)—and Muslims don’t “worship” on Sunday.

I also have a mosque at the head of my street, which was previously a Jehovah's Witness church. The Sikh temple was previously a Masonic temple, so neither of them really fits preconceived notions about appearance.

Also, the Ahmadiyya Muslims at the mosque frequently have a full parking lot on Sundays. Not sure what they're up to, but they're there in numbers.

But as to your point, there's nothing really indicating as of yet that this skinhead whacko mistook the Sikhs for Muslims. To him, like I said, maybe they were just dark-skinned foreigners with rags on their heads.

29 posted on 08/07/2012 7:00:01 AM PDT by Kenton (Pssst - I just heard from a guy that Harry Reid isn't just corrupt, he showers with kids!)
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To: Mamzelle

Don’t underestimate the power of ignorance or stupidity (said in a Darth Vader voice).

One of the great ironies of the Military Intelligence branch, which includes Psychological Operations, now officially, “Military Information Support Operations”, is that their junior officers typically have bachelor’s degrees, 1/4th of their enlisted personnel have advanced degrees (and are a lot smarter than the officers), and the other 3/4ths are “fairly stupid”, as one MI NCO put it.

I had the charming opportunity to meet, in the stockade, one of these latter, who was the most vicious, nasty, violent serial criminals I could imagine. He had accumulated an enormous list of horrific felony charges, and was a one man crime wave. Everyone in his entire battalion wanted him dead for all the people he had harmed.

I was expecting a heavily tattooed, muscled monster, yet the guy was just a shrimpy white trash kid. Yet he was the devil himself.

In any event, for all his villainy, he was no Moriarty. In fact, I was amazed that he made it through high school, which I suspect promoted him to get rid of him.

For this reason I am not at all surprised at the Sikh-shooter’s biography. Still an E-5 Sgt. after six years means that he had reached a promotion dead end, as four years is typical for the next grade. And to be kicked down to Specialist E-4 means that he had seriously fouled up.

Then he spent a decade or more with white supremacists, who are also not great fonts of wisdom.


30 posted on 08/07/2012 7:00:13 AM PDT by yefragetuwrabrumuy
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To: Eye of Unk

Where did you get this information about a bounty???? Who had a bounty on his head?

One of the people shot and killed is the father of a guy involved with the Sirius documentary.


31 posted on 08/07/2012 7:01:20 AM PDT by RummyChick
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To: TomGuy

Pretty much every single mass shooting I’m aware of had bogus multiple shooter reports.

These events are confusing and eyewitness reports are horrifically unreliable.


32 posted on 08/07/2012 7:04:39 AM PDT by Strategerist
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To: Mamzelle

You are assuming the general public knows the difference between a Sikh and a Muslim. I would have to disagree. The general public are quite ignorant.


33 posted on 08/07/2012 7:19:57 AM PDT by caver (Obama: Home of the Whopper)
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To: cripplecreek

Who exactly is the psychological field you’re talking about?


34 posted on 08/07/2012 7:20:42 AM PDT by stuartcr ("When silence speaks, it speaks only to those that have already decided what they want to hear.")
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To: mnehring

He also got tossed out of the army because he was a drunk.


35 posted on 08/07/2012 7:24:22 AM PDT by stuartcr ("When silence speaks, it speaks only to those that have already decided what they want to hear.")
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To: Darteaus94025
Sikhs refuse to be disarmed. They are naturals to be recruited now as Second Amendment defenders. I'm actually surprised the shooter didn't get his throat slit by the men of the congregation.

The kirpan (/kɪərˈpɑːn/; Punjabi: ਕਿਰਪਾਨ kirpān) is a ceremonial sword or dagger carried by Sikhs. It is a religious commandment given by Guru Gobind Singh (the tenth Guru of Sikhism) at the Baisakhi Amrit Sanchar (a holy religious ceremony that formally baptizes a Sikh) in AD 1699, all baptised Sikhs (Khalsa) must wear a kirpan at all times

The Sacred Kirpan

Painting Depicting A British colonial incident which we cannot recount. The Kirpan is the sabre of the Sikhs. It symbolizes the command given by Guru Gobind Singh to the Sikhs enjoining them to remain fully armed at all times. We believe that the young Sikh lad was publicly flogged for refusing to take off his sabre in a “court of law”.

Only fools entrust the security of their bodies to governments. Or as wise people say: Stalin, Mao Tse Tung and Lenin love gun control (Civilians killed by Mao – 60 million, by Lenin – 5 million, by Stalin - 40 million). That is why the 2nd amendment to the constitution gave the people the inalienable right to be fully armed. As you can imagine there are more jackasses than wise men in this world."

36 posted on 08/07/2012 7:26:02 AM PDT by Mormon Cricket
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To: stuartcr

The who freakin bunch of the morons who have managed to convince the world that they’re doctors of anything.


37 posted on 08/07/2012 7:27:50 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: ZX12R

Seeing’s as how Nazi’s and Muslims go hand in hand, I’d be little surprised to see the perp ending up having a connection to the religion of peace seeings as how they and Sikhs have a hard animosity for each other.

By my understanding, (correct me if I’m wrong) the Sikhs arose as a more martial branch of Hindu to prevent forceable conversion to Islam.


38 posted on 08/07/2012 7:28:44 AM PDT by Axenolith (Government blows, and that which governs least, blows least...)
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To: Mamzelle

Notice how the government is clamping down in the info so that if there are facts that refute the MSM narrative, they will be hidden for a long time.

Tom


39 posted on 08/07/2012 7:28:52 AM PDT by Fido969
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To: Mamzelle
I agree. Kinda hard to see how even the most dense liberal could have confused them in this case.


40 posted on 08/07/2012 7:29:50 AM PDT by VeniVidiVici (Congrats to Ted Kennedy! He's been sober for two years now!!)
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To: Strategerist

Thanks for the info.
I was clueless.
(living a sheltered life, even though I have the internet, LOL)


41 posted on 08/07/2012 7:31:59 AM PDT by nascarnation
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To: cripplecreek

You want them all to answer?


42 posted on 08/07/2012 7:33:01 AM PDT by stuartcr ("When silence speaks, it speaks only to those that have already decided what they want to hear.")
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To: stuartcr

I want them exposed for the manipulative charlatans and liars they are.


43 posted on 08/07/2012 7:35:07 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: nascarnation

Go to you tube and type in “Skrewdriver”. See for yourself. They even do merchandising tie ins.


44 posted on 08/07/2012 7:44:35 AM PDT by Free in Texas (Member of the Bitter Clingers Association.)
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To: Mamzelle

Muslims hate Jews. Neo-Nazis hate Jews. I find it odd he would go supposedly try to kill Muslims.


45 posted on 08/07/2012 7:45:40 AM PDT by PghBaldy (Obama 07/22/12: "we all reflect on how we can do something about some of the senseless violence...")
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To: Mormon Cricket

One report did say that one of the victims had a bloody knife in his hand and had charged the shooter.


46 posted on 08/07/2012 7:57:38 AM PDT by mnehring
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To: Mamzelle

“We” don’t.


47 posted on 08/07/2012 8:06:35 AM PDT by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both)
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To: TomGuy
What makes a person go crazy and start killing? That is an age old question.

Usually something involving love and/or sex.

48 posted on 08/07/2012 8:25:12 AM PDT by TurboZamboni (Looting the future to bribe the present)
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To: Mamzelle
I never assumed he “was confused” or “made a mistake”. I determined that as he was a known Neo-Nazi, and Nazis have always had close ties with Islam, and that Muslims have an abiding hatred for Sikhs, that he killed the Sikhs in a Neo-Nazi/Muslim flip out.
49 posted on 08/07/2012 8:33:53 AM PDT by Durus (You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality. Ayn Rand)
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To: Mamzelle
I agree it's a big leap that was taken by the MSM immediately. My local news was interviewing Sikhs the day of the shooting, asking them if they are often mistaken for muslim.

It may turn out to be the case, but it is an irresponsible assumption for the media to take.

They've been promising a "muslim backlash" for more than a decade, so they can reconfirm that white Americans are racist. It's way behind schedule, but they'll announce its arrival daily, until it gets here.

50 posted on 08/07/2012 9:23:25 AM PDT by dead (I've got my eye out for Mullah Omar.)
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