Posted on 05/24/2013 6:35:28 PM PDT by Kevmo
As I said, chemistry is not my field.
***Then you’re just speculating.
Here we go again....
The readings as far as they go are not enough!
They are using a conversion formula based on those readings of the exterior temperature of a metal canister in room air.
They have only a rudimentary estimate based on what little they saw and measured. They were forced to use what I see as a inappropriate control to determine the heat output of the electric coils. This factor means a lot in the final results. The input power was very low but with a three phase supply and a modified wave form, I can tell you that it was intentionally done to reduce the input, not to make the test work. It is not something that is necessary so I have seen this before. In my business it’s called making the test conform to the results you want.
Time for bed..
The input power was very low but with a three phase supply and a modified wave form, I can tell you that it was intentionally done to reduce the input, not to make the test work.
***Horse manure. Asked & answered on this extensive thread at Vortex.
http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-
You are doing what we call in the investment business...”Pumping”.
You are pumping this story and have been for some time. I don’t need to know why because there are always variables, but in general it’s either for monetary gain, or emotional satisfaction.
That is why anyone not buying into it irritates you. I see it everyday in the markets...I am conditioned now after many mistakes to oppose it like a positive opposes a like charge. I try to push for answers and after a time when I get nothing but endlessly repeated phrases I know I am opposing a pumper and not a rational argument that can result in anything but repeated grief.
It’s kind funny, but pumpers usually call people like me “Bashers”. Because to them I am trying to tear down their dreams of getting rich in a single stock. But really all I am doing is trying to identify the motivation of the person I am talking to.
So either you have a interest or hope to have a interest in this device on the monetary side, or you are hopelessly wedded to the idea of cold fusion and this gives you a platform, but either way, I can’t hope to reason with you so I will retreat and leave you to your thread.
I try to push for answers and after a time when I get nothing but endlessly repeated phrases
***That is exactly what I get, and recently I started getting the treatment from you.
I tell you what. You ask one question. I answer it. I ask one question. You have to answer it. We keep going until someone breaks the chain.
what we call in the investment business
***You said you were an electrician.
Does not matter whats on that post...I know what I am talking about. There was no need for three phase power except to reduce the watts/per hour load reading. A single phase set up would have been more than sufficient but three phase on a resistive load is far more economical power wise.
If the voltage is European...it’s running at about 250VAC. Same power we use here in the US on our AC and Heating loads and we do this for economy over 120VAC...We take a second step to lower costs by installing a three phase service which reduces the load at the input by about one third.
So in the end, in the US, you can save from 55-66% by switching your high load devices to three phase but it’s expensive up front.
In the case of this lab, not sure where they got it from because their load is so small that nobody would suggest a three phase set up for it. It’s stupid to have to supply that kind of hardware for a load with less than 5KW. This load was less than 500 watts. That’s like 4 light bulbs.
So the three phase load is pointless! The waveform modification is pointless on a heating element!
Unless you are trying to shave every single bit of inefficiency from the test data to enhance it. Or that power is doing something else, but I am not going there.
There is enough secret sauces in this thing to win a cooking contest.
It’s that simple.
Retired......Now doing wallstreet.
In the case of this lab, not sure where they got it from because their load is so small that nobody would suggest a three phase set up for it. It’s stupid to have to supply that kind of hardware for a load with less than 5KW. This load was less than 500 watts. That’s like 4 light bulbs.
So the three phase load is pointless! The waveform modification is pointless on a heating element!
***Again, asked & answered on this extensive thread at Vortex.
http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex- href=”mailto:l@eskimo.com”>l@eskimo.com/msg81146.html
Whats going on is that I pose a question, you come back with the same tired phrases. basically saying all that has been settled so go pound sand....
Not trying to turn you into a critic, but you need to have some critical thinking to rationalize what they are trying to say about this device. If you don’t, you will be in lala land.
If the answer is not what I said....then it’s wrong...
I’ll tell you what we do use waveform modification on...would you like to know?
also this thread, among other places
http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-
The first test used 3-phase power, the second DID NOT.
The paper says:
“The E-Cat HT2’s power supply departs from that of the device used in December in that it is no longer three-phase, but single-phase: the TRIAC power supply has been replaced by a control circuit having three-phase power input and single-phase output, mounted within a box, the contents of which were not available for inspection, inasmuch as they are part of the industrial trade secret.”
then my proposal should be acceptable to you
Never mind....I’ll answer it anyway because your links you keep giving me don’t work so I don’t know if it was discussed.
The answer is, Inductive heating....not a wye hookup resistive coil load as described in the test papers.
Induction can use very little electricity and over time can heat to pretty high temperatures...in a controlled small space. But it would require a additional coil not shown or described in the test papers..and the current would need a way out, either through a wire or any conductor, even a metal support that loops back to the power source, preferably aluminum.
Then publish your findings and save the world from this supposed con artist. Vortex is a good place to start because they can give you the level of scrutiny your findings need. But you can start wherever you want. Best of luck with your project and eventual fame.
Yeah, I said exactly that is so many words and the input is still three phase. They installed the secret control box and they just say it modifies the wave form. But the output is not two wire as opposed to three. So that is single phase AC or could be pulsating DC depending on the wave modification. Pulsating DC is good for induction loads...among other things....TV oscillators.....amplifiers and other stuff...
Never mind....I’ll answer it anyway because your links you keep giving me don’t work so I don’t know if it was discussed.
***Cutting and pasting into the URL space is so inconvenient, I know.
Here’s another thread where the topic is discussed and your treatment is dismantled.
http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-
Don’t need no fame......just peace and quiet.....gonna get that in another two years when I move to the woods...
I’m not saying this guy is a fraud. I don’t know him.
But what his people are doing or did with this test leads one to conclude that they are not being very forthcoming with their device and are doing the absolute minimum necessary to get someone to say they might have something interesting. Which is pretty much all they said...
The testing people should have been a bit more critical of the restrictions but they chose not to be. So I don’t read much into this test and as I said, I need a lot more now, just to stay interested..
Hope you here from this bunch again...You may not, but if you do I am sure you will post it.
Here’s another Vortex thread where the output for 2wire versus 3wire led to the secret wiring hypothesis, AFAIK
http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-
With so many threads to drill down on, you can see my reluctance to get into this material. But, you’re in luck, because you can sign up at Vortex and save the world from this supposed scammer as long as your explanations hold up. Best of luck.
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