help me talk to my liberal sister (VANITY)

me

[votelife]

My sister recently emailed me and suggested I see Michael Moore's Bowling for Columbine. I found a good article that exposes the film for the propaganda that it is at this link:

http://www.hardylaw.net/Truth_About_Bowling.html

She admitted that Moore "did distort the sequence of events a bit" but she still thinks "his overall theme is correct." Help me out Freepers!

She really wants me to look at this timeline from Michael Moore's site. Freepers can you give me some good articles, comments, etc on how to respond to Moore's liberal nonsense, in a way that I can relate to my sister?

Here is the timeline: http://www.bowlingforcolumbine.com/library/wonderful/index.php

I especially need rebutall stuff on Iraq and Rumsfeld.

Thanks in advance for all your brilliant work, Freepers.

[KC_Conspirator]

There is only one recourse - fire your sister and hire a new one.

[Hildy]

Try this and then search on FR under MOORE. There have been many stories posted. SHAME ON YOU, MR. MOORE

[votelife]

one other problem is that she has spent the last two years, in Europe and she is very sensitive to America acting in America's interests. for 9/11 she was in Spain. Now she is in Prague. I can only imagine the biased news she gets over there.

[Hildy]

Oops.. try this...SHAME ON YOU, MR. MOORE

[mystery-ak]

Your family needs to do an intervention with your sister...she is a kool-aid drinker.

[elbucko]

One cannot "distort facts" and arrive at an "overall correct theme". The thought is contradictory and is intellectually dishonest.

[dep]

sadly, as in "invasion of the body snatchers," the condition is irreversible. just try to think of your sister in happier times.

dep

[Zipporah]

here are some links that may help you..

http://www.spinsanity.org/columns/20021119.html

http://www.theovangogh.nl/Bowling.html

[backhoe]

Go to the last entry here:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/833678/posts
DUBOB 11- more tales from the Dark UnderBelly Of the Beast...
various links and websites | 01-31-03 | The Heavy Equipment Guy

...and scroll backwards- you'll find links to posts & info about the subjects you mentioned. Good luck!

[HighWheeler]

40 Reasons To Implement Gun Control:

1. Banning guns works, which is why New York, DC, and Chicago cops need guns.
2. Washington DC's low murder rate of 69 per 100,000 is due to strict gun control, and Indianapolis' high murder rate of 9 per 100,000 is due to the lack of gun control.
3. Statistics showing high murder rates justify gun control but statistics showing increasing murder rates after gun control are "just statistics".
4. The Brady Bill and the Assault Weapons Ban, both of which went into effect in 1994, are responsible for the decrease in violent crime rates, which have been declining since 1991.
5. We must get rid of guns because a deranged lunatic may go on a shooting spree at any time and anyone who would own a gun out of fear of such a lunatic is paranoid.
6. The more helpless you are the safer you are from criminals.
7. An intruder will be incapacitated by tear gas or oven spray, but if shot with a .357 Magnum will get angry and kill you.
8. A woman raped and strangled is morally superior to a woman with a smoking gun and a dead rapist at her feet.
9. When confronted by violent criminals, you should "put up no defense-give them what they want, or run" (Handgun Control Inc. Chairman Pete Shields, Guns Don't Die - People Do, 1981, p. 125).
10. The New England Journal of Medicine is filled with expert advice about guns; just like Guns and Ammo has some excellent treatises on heart surgery.
11. One should consult an automotive engineer for safer seatbelts, a civil engineer for a better bridge, a surgeon for internal medicine, a computer programmer for hard drive problems, and Sarah Brady for firearms expertise.
12. The 2nd Amendment, ratified in 1787, refers to the National Guard, which was created 130 years later, in 1917.
13. The National Guard, federally funded, with bases on federal land, using federally-owned weapons vehicles buildings and uniforms, punishing trespassers under federal law, is a "state" militia.
14. These phrases; "right of the people peaceably to assemble ", "right of the people to be secure in their homes", "enumerations herein of certain rights shall not be construed to disparage others retained by the people", and "The powers not delegated herein are reserved to the states respectively, and to the people."all refer to individuals, but "the right of the people to keep and bear arms." refers to the state.
15. "The Constitution is strong and will never change." But we should ban and seize all guns thereby violating the 2nd, 4th, and 5th Amendments to that Constitution.
16. Rifles and handguns aren't necessary to national defense! Of course, the army has hundreds of thousands of them.
17. Private citizens shouldn't have handguns, because they aren't "military weapons", but private citizens shouldn't have "assault rifles", because they are military weapons.
18. In spite of waiting periods, background checks, fingerprinting, government forms, etc., guns today are too readily available, which is responsible for recent school shootings. In the 1940's, 1950's and 1960's, anyone could buy guns at hardware stores, army surplus stores, gas stations, variety stores, Sears mail order, no waiting, no background check, no fingerprints, no government forms and there were no school shootings.
19. The NRA's attempt to run a "don't touch" campaign about kids handling guns is propaganda, but the anti-gun lobby's attempt to run a "don't touch" campaign is responsible social activity.
20. Guns are so complex that special training is necessary to use them properly, and so simple to use that they make murder easy.
21. A handgun, with up to 4 controls, is far too complex for the typical adult to learn to use, as opposed to an automobile that only has 20.
22. Women are just as intelligent and capable as men, but a woman with gun is "an accident waiting to happen" and gun makers' advertisements aimed at women are "preying on their fears."
23. Ordinary people in the presence of guns turn into slaughtering butchers but revert to normal when the weapon is removed.
24. Guns cause violence, which is why there are so many mass killings at gun shows.
25. A majority of the population supports gun control, just like a majority of the population supported owning slaves.
26. Any self-loading small arm can legitimately be considered to be a "weapon of mass destruction" or an "assault weapon."
27. Most people can't be trusted, so we should have laws against guns, which most people will abide by because they can be trusted.
28. The right of Internet pornographers to exist cannot be questioned because it is constitutionally protected by the Bill of Rights, but the use of handguns for self defense is not really protected by the Bill of Rights.
29. Free speech entitles one to own newspapers, transmitters, computers, and typewriters, but self-defense only justifies bare hands.
30. The ACLU is good because it uncompromisingly defends certain parts of the Constitution, and the NRA is bad, because it defends other parts of the Constitution.
31. Charlton Heston, a movie actor as president of the NRA is a cheap lunatic who should be ignored, but Michael Douglas, a movie actor as a representative of Handgun Control, Inc. is an ambassador for peace who is entitled to an audience at the UN arms control summit.
32. Police operate with backup within groups, which is why they need larger capacity pistol magazines than "civilians" who must face criminals alone and therefore need less ammunition.
33. We should ban "Saturday Night Specials" and other inexpensive guns because it's not fair that poor people have access to guns too.
34. Police officers have some special Jedi-like mastery over handguns that private citizens can never hope to obtain.
35. Private citizens don't need a gun for self-protection because the police are there to protect them even though the Supreme Court says the police are not responsible for their protection.
36. Citizens don't need to carry a gun for personal protection but police chiefs, who are desk-bound administrators who work in a building filled with cops, need a gun.
37. "Assault weapons" have no purpose other than to kill large numbers of people. The police need assault weapons. You do not.
38. When Microsoft pressures its distributors to give Microsoft preferential promotion, that's bad; but when the Federal government pressures cities to buy guns only from Smith & Wesson, that's good.
39. Trigger locks do not interfere with the ability to use a gun for defensive purposes, which is why you see police officers with one on their duty weapon.
40. Handgun Control, Inc., says they want to "keep guns out of the wrong hands." Guess what? You have the wrong hands.

[Lauratealeaf]

Good luck. Hope you have success with your sister. Is she pretty young? There is more hope for her if so.

[laredo44]

one other problem is that she has spent the last two years, in Europe and she is very sensitive to America acting in America's interests. for 9/11 she was in Spain. Now she is in Prague. I can only imagine the biased news she gets over there.

No doubt she's of the "we're in it for the oil" crowd, so ask her why we left Kuwait in 1991. We had a perfect opportunity to take over the country to protect it from Saddam, but we simply left. Why?

[Zipporah]

Here's another.. from The Australian..

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/printpage/0,5942,5763232,00.html

[O.C. - Old Cracker]

How old is your sister? If she's between the ages of 16 and 25 there's hope that a well-reasoned argument will bring her back from the brink. Beyond that, only a heavy dose of reality will cure this sad sack.

[votelife]

my sister is only 24. She's the only one in our nuclear family who's a liberal. I do have hope for her, but right now, if she's getting her's news from Michael Moore, well, that's tough!

[Dergie]

Here's a site that exposes the lies of Michael Moore.

http://www.hollywoodhalfwits.com/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=2&t=2809&hl=michael+moore&s=948f23ddad5302f2472e39f30be4e18c

[Scoop]

As far as the movie goes, don't argue the politics: it's just a boring movie. The only reason to see it would be if you did agree witht Moore's politics and needed the media pat-on-the-back. It's not worth watching for any kind of entertainment or educational payoff.

I think any defense of the war should be based on the first, most basic, and most rock solid reason that it is being fought: Iraq took over Kuwait, was driven out by a coalition of nations, and agreed to a cease-fire that required them to do certain things or hostilities would resume. On hundreds of occassions they did not do what they agreed to do (they fired on allied planes, violated the no-fly zones, refused to disclose where weapons, radar installations, ammunition stockpiles, etc were, etc.), and so the coalition leaders have resumed hostilities.

Those are indisputable facts. As far as WOMD or the war on terrorism, I think they were valid reasons to go into Iraq, but it is a harder argument to fight against any determined anti-war rhetoritician.

[cebadams]

America acting in America's interests

Tell her YES -- that's the whole point. Who's interest is America supposed to be acting for if not our own?

This page you point to is typical Moore -- first state some fact (relevant or not) then state some conclussion not related to the quoted fact. This is the stuff good conspiracy theories are made of.

[elbucko]

I especially need rebuttal stuff on Iraq and Rumsfeld.

The reason we invaded Iraq was to prevent nuclear war in the Middle East.

Saddam Hussein was paying the "suicide bomber" families $25,000 per "Martyr". This is a lot of money to a poor Arab. If you recall, the suicide bombings in Israel were bringing that country to its knees, both psychologically and economically. Israel's army is not large enough to cross Jordan and invade Iraq. Israel's only chance to stop the suicide bombers was to nuke Baghdad. That might have meant strikes on Damascus, Syria and Cairo, Egypt. More nuclear strikes would, by necessity have to follow on Saudi Arabia.

Instead, GWB and the US stepped up to the plate and knocked Hussein out of the park. Bush made the decision to wage a US conventional war, rather than for the Israeli's to wage a nuclear war. Saved a lot of lives. Millions.

So which would your sister have preferred?