We’re Not Losing the Culture Wars Anymore

City Journal ^ | 27 OCT 03 | Brian C. Anderson

[dsc]

"Sometimes it does. One can dress well without dressing up."

Nope. Never. Dressing up is the whole point.

"What clothing would the "anything goes" hippies get pissed at? (Besides, obviously, a suit). :)"

Since it's so subjective, it's hard to express verbally--except for hair length, of course. Dress such as seen on "Laugh In" (or more recently, in the Austin Powers movies) would evoke scorn and contempt, as would things like regular oxford shirts, cowboy attire, and regular shoes (and don't even think about dress loafers).

Anything that looked like it was an attempt by "straight" society to copy "freak" attire was right out. Like software programs now, your attire had to have a certain "look and feel" to it, or you would be dismissed as a "wannabe" or a "narc." Your appearance had to express that you were walking the walk on a full-time basis.

This was a problem for police departments early on, because the officers they asked to infiltrate and identify drug dealers didn't have that subjective knowledge of the "look and feel."

"I totally disagree with you."

On what basis? I'm telling you the impression it creates, and you're telling me what? That it doesn't? Sorry, it does create that impression.

"I'd rather be comfortable then look good."

Uh, huh. That's the point. "I." I, I, I, I, I. You're telling people that their opinions don't matter very much to you, nor does whatever activity you're engaged in. You're telling them that when the chips are down, that "I" will trump.

"Now, it seems, the middle classes emulate the lower classes."

That's similar to something I've read recently in a couple of places. One was Barzun's "Dawn to Decadence," I think. In the ascendence of a civilization, people idealize and pursue the highest and best; it its decline, they idealize and pursue the lowest and worst. I think we're seeing that in America today, and the attitude toward appearance that you express is part and parcel of it.

But it's not just a question of "the middle class." There are people in every economic stratum who are trying to hold the gates against the barbarians, and others who are gleefully riding the roller coaster to Hell.

[jjm2111]

" Dressing up is the whole point." - Point of what?

"Sorry, it does create that impression."

For some people, like yourself, it does. My boss who is close to fifty loves my company's dress down policy and I never see him in a suit unless he absolutely has to wear one. My dad was born in 1939 and he hates wearing suits. My dad is as conservative as they come.

"You're telling people that their opinions don't matter very much to you, nor does whatever activity you're engaged in."

In most things, other people's opinions don't matter. IMO, life is too short to run around caring what other people think about me.

"But it's not just a question of "the middle class." There are people in every economic stratum who are trying to hold the gates against the barbarians, and others who are gleefully riding the roller coaster to Hell."

How did you go from hippie to doom-and-gloomer? I really don't see it that way. Good old days? In the good old days people weren't going to do business with you (real business; fortune 500 business) if you were Irish or Italian, much less Jewish or Black. I really don't share your pesssimistic appraisal of modern culture. Sure, somethings are a little screwy; and something are out-and-out wrong, (Abortion!) but I think society has made a lot of progress in the past 50 years. And I sure don't think the indtroduction of comfortable clothing is the equivalent of defunding the army.

BTW, would you like to see a return of 1910, where people wore three piece suits to ride bikes in the park?

[jjm2111]

"You're telling people that their opinions don't matter very much to you, nor does whatever activity you're engaged in. You're telling them that when the chips are down, that "I" will trump.

Not to pat myself on the back, but I'm the kind of person who'd risk his life to pull someone from a burning car and I give up my seat on the subway to old people and pregnant ladies (unlike many "men"). I suborn the "I" quite often and can certainly understand the need to suppress one's id from time-to-time.

But really, why should I care about what other people think of the clothes I wear? So they can feel better about me. Total strangers on the street can say to themselves, "What a nice young man, he's wearing a suit." So what. Only a certain percentage of people think the way you do anyway. Hell, half of liberals see a suit and they think, "suit". Not that I care what they think either. Clothes are so trivial, you shouldn't care either. If you were struggling with a bulky box through a building door, and some punky looking guy all in piercings and tattoos said, "Hey man, let me give you a hand." would you turn him down because he looks like a freak?

Some of the best people I know, dress like freaks. Not casual/comfortable like me, but weird. Some of the worst people, I mean bordering on evil people, wore suits every day. Clothes do NOT make the man.

[dsc]

" Dressing up is the whole point." - Point of what?"

Showing willing.

"For some people, like yourself, it does. My boss who is close to fifty loves my company's dress down policy and I never see him in a suit"

If your boss is close to 50, then he was around 6th or 7th grade when Kennedy was assassinated. That positions him to have been affected by the "jeans and topsiders" Kennedy mystique.

"My dad was born in 1939 and he hates wearing suits. My dad is as conservative as they come."

And does he say that serious, important, public undertakings don't warrant dressing up?

"In most things, other people's opinions don't matter."

When you are mutually engaged in a serious, important undertaking, the opinions of the other people involved had better matter to you. Casual clothing says they don't. Why should people have confidence in you if their opinions don't matter to you?

"IMO, life is too short to run around caring what other people think about me."

A person can care too much, and he can care too little.

"How did you go from hippie to doom-and-gloomer?"

God's infinite mercy. But actually, I am not a doom and gloomer. I point out how bad things have gotten in the interest of turning them around, not because I think the cause is lost.

"Good old days? In the good old days people weren't going to do business with you (real business; fortune 500 business) if you were Irish or Italian, much less Jewish or Black."

The forces of evil have been so subtle in distorting the historical record that it's hard to untwist.

Every immigrant group experienced discrimination; and every immigrant group assimilated.

The blacks were on the road when the forces of evil highjacked their cause and created the civil rights movement. The road they were on was a long one, but it wouldn't have taken them into today's slough of despond with the black family practically destroyed.

The bad things were not as presented to you, and the good things were far better than you have been told.

"but I think society has made a lot of progress in the past 50 years."

Everything done in the last 50 years has been a ghastly mistake. Even where the goals were noble, the means used were wrongheaded and the unintended consequences terrible.

When I was a boy, I could safely walk through "n*ggertown" at night without encountering hatred and violence. Try that today. Race relations are worse now than at any time in our history.

Truman desegregated the military, and that was a good thing. More people were cured of racial prejudice by a stint as a draftee than by any other measure--that is, up until the rise of black racial hatred put a stop to integration. And that rise was not natural, not organic, not a response to white racism, which was on the wane.

It was fostered and cultivated by those who highjacked the civil rights movement after MLK was assassinated.

Over the past 50 years America has become a 4D society: degradation, decadence, degeneracy, and death. To turn the tide, it is necessary to recognize not only the most blatant of evils like abortion, but also the subtle and often attractive influences that contributed to each incremental step in the wrong direction.

One of these is the notion that one need not show respect for social institutions such as the business enterprise by dressing seriously.

The next step after "you need not show respect" is "you need not feel respect."

The activities in which businesses engage are not trivial or casual. They are vital to civilization. They are serious and important. Casual clothing was the first step in disrespecting that social institution, which was the first step toward the widespread decay of business ethics now manifesting.

Did you know that in the "old days" you could write a check on anything, even a bar napkin, and pass it without ID? Businesses used to keep pads of "counter checks" out, so you could tear one off, write your name and bank on it, and cash it on the spot.

Did you know that in the "old days" an officer didn't need an ID card application? He just walked into the office and gave the information. It was *presumed* that he would tell the truth.

Yes, with (mainly technological) exceptions, the old days really were better--a LOT better.

"BTW, would you like to see a return of 1910, where people wore three piece suits to ride bikes in the park?"

Are you under the impression that everyone did that everywhere all the time? Where that happened, it was in places where everyone dressed up on Sunday.

It's just amazing how inacurrate a picture young people have even of history recent enough that I lived through it.

[jjm2111]

"And does he [my Dad] say that serious, important, public undertakings don't warrant dressing up?"

Yes, he does, and so do I. But he, and I, do not believe that every day at the office is necessarily a "serious, important, undertaking. Although I always err on the side of caution, I've worn suits where it wasn't really necessary and may have been a turn off to the client. I met the CEO of new client, a mid-sized public company for the first time just recently. I wore my best suit. Boy was I shocked when the guy shows up in jeans. Now, I'm never going to show up in jeans to meet with him again, but I'm not going to wear a suit. "

They are vital to civilization. They are serious and important. Casual clothing was the first step in disrespecting that social institution, which was the first step toward the widespread decay of business ethics now manifesting.

Did you ever see the suits Ken Lay or L. Dennis Kozlowski of Tyco wore? Beautiful suits. Some of the most dishonest businessmen wore the classiest suits. I know a couple of very honest and ethical small businessmen who never wear them.

When I wear a suit to work, I don't think about how I'm holding the fabric of society together, it's just something I have to do because certain people expect it. And by three pm, the thing foremost in my mind is, "When can I take this monkey suit off."

It's just amazing how inacurrate a picture young people have even of history recent enough that I lived through it.

You are perhaps right on this point, but I doubt you are going to convince young people today that stuffy, uncomfortable clothing is necessary for a moral society.

[rudy45]

I am waiting for a well made, well received, genuinely conservative film to be made. When I see that, I will know we are going to win.

What about the Mel Gibson "The Patriot"? (I have to make this qualification to prevent confusion with the Steven Seagal movie of the same name)

[Steel Eye]

You said:

"That there is a small percentage of people who control most of the wealth, and hence the power in the world is quite obvious......it has been acknowledge by all thinking people......that these people control most of the media, and, as the proposed new regulations allowing for more concentration of media ownership show, are on the brink of even more control, has been the subject of so much literature that all I can honestly and sincerely say is....."I can only leave it to you to study this for yourself."

Oh come on. Just spit it out. Just who are these people? Just who are these evil bastards?

Hmmm?

[honeygrl]

The south park guy is probably libertarian. I love the show though and don't really have any problem with libertarians.

[honeygrl]

It's too bad they mention lucianne.com but not freerepublic. FR gets more traffic than lucianne.

[Chancellor Palpatine]

Because that is an indication that one takes seriously the endeavor in which he is engaged, and, by extension, the others who are also engaged in that effort. It is a form of self-sacrifice that demonstrates respect for one's self, and for everyone else who showed up.

******snore*******

Keep your suits and your stuffy attitude to yourself, you insufferable bore.

[Chancellor Palpatine]

Dressing up is the whole point.

Pointless waste of money to pander to the snotty dictates of people wrapped up in crass and useless symbolism.

You're telling people that their opinions don't matter very much to you, nor does whatever activity you're engaged in. You're telling them that when the chips are down, that "I" will trump.

Damn right. The opinion of smeone who makes snap judgments based on their class, religious, racial or economic prejudices is not an opinion that should count for much.

[VOA]

The transformation has gone far beyond the rise of conservative talk radio, that,
ever since Rush Limbaugh’s debut 15 years ago

If liberals/socialists/Democrats thought Rush Limbaugh was the "most dangerous man"
in the USA when he was downing narcotics, they better be ready to have their heads explode
when he returns to action.

(presuming that Rush wasn't the sort that was "fueled" by his ingestion of pharmaceuticals...)

[moodyskeptic]

Thanks for projecting sober hope.

I, too, believe that the pendulum has reached its outermost liberal point and is just barely falling back the other direction. Slowly at first, but picking up momentum. Unstoppable.

Notice how the Left seems to blow everything all at once, every step a mistep? As they panic about losing one battle, their desperate reaction ensures more battles lost.

One friend of mine says he saw the trend start in 94, with the GOP surge in congress. That the Left circled the wagons to defend their version of Nixon was the beginning of their end. They can't seem to shake the Clintons. Even now.

Increasingly the GOP looks sane and the Democrats insane. Finally, after 40 years of controlling the culture, liberals are losing their clutch on the controls.

Yes, they control the Arts (minus country music), the Big Media, Higher Learning and most of the courts, but daily we see the liberal monolith crumble slightly.

Patience. Look for a forty year conservative supremacy in America. Starting now.

[GOPJ]

Sweet.

[GOPJ]

what's missing ~* a clue? *~ SOMEONE *doesn't HAVE *one*. What? * * ~ (A CLUE)**~

*I* don't *KNOW* what's *MISSING*. How *ABOUT* a *HINT*.

[GOPJ]

OK, I'm impressed. Sweet.

Brian Anderson e-mail: Update: I'm putting back in a mention--much deserved--of FreeRepublic.com in the web version of the article. The Web gets results!

[Petronski]

How *ARE* we *BECOMING* a *NATION* of *DUMBIES*?

[dsc]

"Keep your suits and your stuffy attitude to yourself, you insufferable bore."

We were discussing an issue here, and, until you appeared, with civility.

I think a better option would be for you to keep your ill-tempered bigotry to yourself.

[Voice in your head]

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