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Karadzic 'ordered' Bosnia carnage
BBC ^ | 2003/11/22 01:11:57 GMT

Posted on 11/23/2003 2:38:26 PM PST by mark502inf

The war crimes tribunal in The Hague has heard allegations that former Bosnian Serb leader Radovan Karadzic ordered the 1995 Srebrenica massacre. A former Bosnian Serb politician, Miroslav Deronjic, said Mr Karadzic told him days before the massacre that all local Muslims needed to be killed.

Mr Deronjic was testifying at a pre-appeal hearing for General Radislav Krstic, who was partly responsible.

The tribunal has charged Mr Karadzic with genocide over Srebrenica.

Mr Deronjic confessed to war crimes. He was a civilian head of the Bratunac municipality near Srebrenica when the Bosnian Serb's political leader Mr Karadzic told him on 9 July, 1995: "Miroslav, all of them need to be killed. Whatever you can lay your hands on," he told the hearing.

On 11 July, the Bosnian Serb army overran the UN-declared "safe area" of Srebrenica in eastern Bosnia.

Its troops separated the men from the women and children, taking them away to be executed over the ensuing week.

Alongside Mr Karadzic, the tribunal has also charged his military commander, Ratko Mladic, with genocide at Srebrenica Both men remain at large.

Condemnation

Witnesses who spoke at Friday's hearing said the slaughter of more than 7,000 Muslims at Srebrenica was planned at the highest level of the Bosnian Serb Government.

One witness - Lieutenant Colonel Dragan Obrenovic, commander of a brigade that reported to General Krstic - admitted his brigade participated in the slaughter after being given the order by General Mladic.

He told the hearing he had asked Mr Krstic why the killings had taken place.

"Krstic cut me short and said that we would speak no more about this," he said.

Experts say the statement he gave is significant because a commander can be convicted of genocide if he knew his troops were committing atrocities but failed to stop them.

General Krstic's defence has until now rested on a claim that prosecutors had never shown "whether there was an organised plan or policy... to destroy the Bosnian Muslims".

Prosecutor Norman Farrell said the new joint evidence was sufficient to prove Krstic, 58, - then commander of the Drina Corps - had personally overseen the killings.

Krstic is appealing against his conviction and the 46-year sentence handed down by the UN tribunal in August 2001 for genocide.

The prosecution is seeking to increase his sentence to life.


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: 1995; balkans; bosnia; campaignfinance; hague; icty; karadzic; massacre; milosevic; serbia; srebrenica; warcrimes
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Witnesses who spoke at Friday's hearing said the slaughter of more than 7,000 Muslims at Srebrenica was planned at the highest level of the Bosnian Serb Government.
1 posted on 11/23/2003 2:38:27 PM PST by mark502inf
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To: mark502inf
Playing soon on a thread near you...
2 posted on 11/23/2003 3:48:14 PM PST by Hoplite
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To: mark502inf
You evil fascist servant of Osama Bin Laden! You must be getting your anti-Serb propaganda sent to you by Al Qaida! You hate Serbs and are a personal enemy of the Serb Jesus Christ! {{{foaming at mouth}}}

(/serbocraze)
3 posted on 11/23/2003 3:49:04 PM PST by Ronly Bonly Jones
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To: Hoplite
ROTFLWPIMP!
4 posted on 11/23/2003 3:49:47 PM PST by Ronly Bonly Jones
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To: JohnGalt; ninenot; u-89; sittnick; steve50; Hegemony Cricket; Willie Green; Wolfie; ex-snook; ...
A former Bosnian Serb politician, Miroslav Deronjic, said Mr Karadzic told him days before the massacre that all local Muslims needed to be killed.

Yeah, sure. What would be Deronjic's sentence if he refused to "confess"?

Show trial bump.

5 posted on 11/23/2003 3:52:20 PM PST by A. Pole
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To: A. Pole
Hey, a show trial's far better than being taken into the woods without trial and having your brains blown out.

If this is a show trial, why is it going on for so bloody long, and why is Krstic being given so much money to pay for his lawyers by the very tribune trying to convict him?

Mindless serbocrazy gibbering bump.
6 posted on 11/23/2003 3:54:12 PM PST by Ronly Bonly Jones
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To: Ronly Bonly Jones
If this is a show trial, why is it going on for so bloody long

Because it is a crazy show trial. You either make a decent trial according to the cohererent, non-arbitrary and fair rules or you do it Stalin's way. Those poor judges in Hague cannot do either and as a result they create a farce.

7 posted on 11/23/2003 4:06:48 PM PST by A. Pole
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To: A. Pole
He's likely just another Momir Nikolic. The news media was all for hyping his "confessions" and implication of others this past September, even though he was a known perjurer back in May. All his "confessions" were made up stories, he admitted on the stand in October:

Key Srebrenica Witness Apologises for Lies

In his May statement to prosecutors, Nikolic said, “I initially falsely stated that I was the person in a photograph depicting a soldier in the area of Sandici, when in truth I was not the person depicted in the photograph.”

In addition I initially falsely stated to the prosecution that I had ordered executions at Sandici and the Kravica warehouse on July 13, 1995, when in fact I had not issued such orders.”

“Shortly after making these false statements – and as discussions with the prosecution continued – I voluntarily informed my lawyers and the prosecution that I had made false statements,” said his statement.

“I think we should call it for what it is, a bald-faced lie,” said Karnavas, an American lawyer.

In the original statement, Nikolic said he had seen former army officer Ljubomir Borovcanin at the Kravica warehouse.

“You needed to give him [the prosecutor] something he did not have, right?” said Karnavas. “You wanted to limit your time of imprisonment to 20 years, that was part of the arrangement, yes? Quid pro quo?”

“I’m still a little bit confused,” continued Karnavas. “How is it that you thought by admitting to one of the most horrendous executions in this area, that this would help you in getting the kind of sentence that you are hoping and praying for?”

“I wanted the agreement to succeed,” said the witness.


8 posted on 11/23/2003 4:07:27 PM PST by joan
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To: A. Pole
Because it is a crazy show trial. You either make a decent trial according to the cohererent, non-arbitrary and fair rules or you do it Stalin's way. Those poor judges in Hague cannot do either and as a result they create a farce.>>

Well, they may not be the most procedurally together bunch, but they're doing the right thing. Frankly, a show trial is far better than Krstic and his ilk deserve. I'd give the him and all the bastards who helped him a drumhead court martial and hang them from the Zvornik bridge.
9 posted on 11/23/2003 4:09:35 PM PST by Ronly Bonly Jones
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To: joan
He's likely just another Momir Nikolic. The news media was all for hyping his "confessions" and implication of others this past September, even though he was a known perjurer back in May. All his "confessions" were made up stories, he admitted on the stand in October:>>>

Yeah, Joan, and Susan Atkins told the judge that she was making up what happened at Sharon Tate's house too.

Cry me a river.
10 posted on 11/23/2003 4:10:34 PM PST by Ronly Bonly Jones
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To: Ronly Bonly Jones
Hey, a show trial's far better than being taken into the woods without trial and having your brains blown out.

Actually, probably not.The trials after the fall of Germany should never have happened. There should have been military courts by the victors with no reference to any sort of "international law" or even "crimes against humanity" and the NAZI leaders should have then been shot.Victor's justice is far less damaging to our constitutional system than is pretending there is such a thing as international law and creating precedents that come back to bite us.

11 posted on 11/23/2003 4:17:20 PM PST by arthurus (fighting them OVER THERE is better than fighting them OVER HERE)
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To: Ronly Bonly Jones
But Nikolic didn't just claim he lied: he is a proven liar. He used a photograph to prove he was at a certain place with certain others and identified himself as a man in the photo. But it wasn't him. So he was caught lying.
12 posted on 11/23/2003 4:19:37 PM PST by joan
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To: Ronly Bonly Jones
Well, they may not be the most procedurally together bunch, but they're doing the right thing.

I am sorry, but a mismanaged arbitrary trial with biased preconceived agenda is as right thing as a botched surgery done with the wrong tools.

The preconceptions in this case are the following:

1 Srebrenica massacre claim is factual in all its nebulous vagueness and lack of clear evidence

2 Each Serbs who is accused of anything hideous is automatically guilty of it, be it Mladic, Karadic, Milosevic or anyone else. Each one ordered it and each is guilty a priori and logic be damned.

3 NATO, Muslims, Western judges and journalists are infallible and saintly unless they violate the rules of Political Corectness. If they do the last they are evil haters and deserve death.

I suspect that this is a fault of Hollywood movies. They are so predicable and you know who is the villain and how the story should end. People who are miseducated by the Hollywood movies must see Serbs as evil and guilty. It simple fits the scheme.

13 posted on 11/23/2003 4:32:04 PM PST by A. Pole
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To: Ronly Bonly Jones
Yeah, Joan, and Susan Atkins told the judge that she was making up what happened at Sharon Tate's house too.

Non Sequitur

14 posted on 11/23/2003 4:36:02 PM PST by A. Pole
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To: Ronly Bonly Jones
You are a sad dupe of the Muslims and their propaganda. With every anti Serb post you make a bigger fool of yourself.
15 posted on 11/23/2003 5:30:13 PM PST by dennisw (G_d is at war with Amalek for all generations)
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To: A. Pole
2 Each Serbs who is accused of anything hideous is automatically guilty of it, be it Mladic, Karadic, Milosevic or anyone else. Each one ordered it and each is guilty a priori and logic be damned.

I wonder if Serbs are the todays PC permitted object of hatred. You can demonize/accuse Serbs and be respected for that. Defend Serbs and you are a suspect. Human nature does not change.

16 posted on 11/23/2003 5:35:53 PM PST by A. Pole
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To: A. Pole
I honestly don't know who to believe in the Bosnia mess. I never really followed it that much.
17 posted on 11/23/2003 6:08:32 PM PST by Burkeman1 ((If you see ten troubles comin down the road, Nine will run into the ditch before they reach you.))
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To: dennisw
I speak the unregenerate truth with total objectivity. That's why you think me anti-Serb.
18 posted on 11/23/2003 7:29:58 PM PST by Ronly Bonly Jones
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To: A. Pole
I wonder if Serbs are the todays PC permitted object of hatred. You can demonize/accuse Serbs and be respected for that. Defend Serbs and you are a suspect. Human nature does not change.>>>

Well, committing mindless genocide against the helpless has a BAD habit of making the guilty nationality very, very unpopular.
19 posted on 11/23/2003 7:30:59 PM PST by Ronly Bonly Jones
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To: A. Pole
No. It's absolutely on point. A murderer often speaks the truth about their participation in crime early in the investigation, then later renounces his confession. My point, for those who actually need it pointed out, is that this happens ALL THE TIME.
20 posted on 11/23/2003 7:32:16 PM PST by Ronly Bonly Jones
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