[cyborg]

I realise I am a little late in this discussion. This article is VERY confusing. It does not state whether the SS money are going to legal documented immigrants and permanent residents OR illegal aliens with stolen SS numbers. This is probably what is feuling this discussion. My grandmother and uncle came up here worked legally, paid into the system but they went back home. Legally, they are entitled to SS benefits (but they haven't collected yet). Lots of people die who are American citizens and never collect on SS as well.

[Luis Gonzalez]

"This article is VERY confusing."

Consider the source.

It's yellow jopurnalism.

[Klickitat]

I have read other articles that mention the totalization would include provisions to allow illegals to collect SS. A good link to check out is provided in post #36, part of which follows.

The Chair recognizes the gentlewoman from Tennessee, Ms. Blackburn, for 5 minutes.

Mrs. BLACKBURN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Ms. Bovbjerg, I want to stay right with that train of thought right there. So what I am understanding from you is that illegal immigrants and their families, their survivors, their dependents could be eligible or a family of someone who worked illegally in this country could be eligible for Social Security benefits under the totalization agreement in part because it is silent on the condition of being here legally or illegally?

Ms. BOVBJERG. You are required under the law from the Welfare Reform Act of '96 to be legally present to get benefits here. How you earn those benefits is not relevant to the Social Security Administration's work. If you earned them legally or illegally and you are legally present, you will be paid those benefits. If you are not legally present, you can get them if you are a Mexican citizen in Mexico.

Mrs. BLACKBURN. In Mexico.

Ms. BOVBJERG. Yes. But your family—under current law it is difficult for your family to do that, and a provision that is in current law is waived in the totalization agreements generally.

Mrs. BLACKBURN. Okay, but what you are saying is the family could be there in Mexico, the person could have worked here, have been an illegal immigrant here and still draw those benefits?

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Ms. BOVBJERG. Under totalization.

Mrs. BLACKBURN. Under totalization. So when you consider this and consider the 5 million undocumented workers that you all estimate are here in the U.S. And you are looking at Social Security and survivor benefits and widow benefits and then these have to be included in your compilation, your cost estimate, would you please give me what you think is a top range of a cost estimate for this?

Ms. BOVBJERG. I wish I could. We looked at the actuaries' estimates because we know that they are in the best position to provide this kind of information and we felt that, given other things, we knew the estimates could be on the low end of the range. I think what we were really looking for is what might the range be and how really could we think about this apparent disconnect between the number of people assumed in the estimate and the number of people that the former INS estimated in the year 2000. I think that is the conversation and that is the kind of analysis that would be helpful in thinking about a totalization agreement with Mexico.

[american spirit]

The GAO report has just as many misgivings about what this agreement is going to cost the SSA. Even in the first page of their report phrases such as "The proposed agreement will likely increase the number of UNAUTHORIZED Mexican workers eligible for Social Security benefits...."the cost of such an agreement is highly uncertain"....(responding to the estimates that there are only 50,000 beneficiaries living in Mexico today & that number is expected to increase sixfold)..."However, this proxy figure does not directly consider the estimated MILLIONS of current and former unauthorized workers and family members from Mexico and appears small in comparison with those estimates"

Even the GAO's report sheds light on the glaring ineptness of the SSA and the fedgov to implement this scheme to reward lawbreakers. What's not even considered is the billions of taxpayer $ already spent on these people who've latched themselves to our welfare system thus allowing many large and small corporations alike to have to only pay minimal wages to their foreign workers living here. This is just another sellout of the American taxpayer by GW (one term) Bush and his cronies.

[NeoCaveman]

Sounds like illegals. Is it still OK to use that word? This is OK though, this will get us the LaRaza vote for sure.