Milosevic was right: JIHADIST HOTBED IN THE BALKANS: THE TRUTH IS OUT

when Kosovo is reunited with Serbia

Not in our lifetime. Don't bet the farm on it.

From David Binder:

I have been thinking about Serbs for almost six decades - not every day, to be sure - but more and more in the last 30 years.

There are few more outspoken sympathizers of the Serbian aspirations in the Balkans than Mr. Binder. It is easy to see that his articles are biased.

Persons who scream that other posters LIARS do not deserve any courtesy.

Persons who scream that other posters LIARS do not deserve any courtesy.

Who did I call a liar, ignoramus? I called the writer of the original document, the SPOKESMAN for the Bosnian Serbs a liar for his comments. Show me where I unjustly called a FReeper a liar.

That person apologises then turns right around and insults all of us again by saying that the writer of said article is biased. There is no evidence that the writer is biased at all.

In fact, I noted that he mentioned some things about Serbs which were not complimentary at all. The NY Times has never been pro-Serb... as long as I can remember.

It IS safe to say, whoever, that the the so-called "ny republican" IS biased against Serbs and possibly all Orthodox Christians...where ever they may be found.

Hmmmmm, a muslim or Croatian or an American married to an Albanian.... perhaps that's "ny republican"?

One wonders?

HA!HA! Why, it was in your post #103.... gone but hardly forgotten.

And that was so "rich"... YOU saying that greenwolf ought to be banned from the forum for LYING!

Oh, you are just TOO funny!! hahaha.

Now, go back to your corner and be quiet, child. And, while you are there.... wipe the egg off your face.

I think I finally understand the Serb mindset. It is guided by two principles:

1) We are the greatest people on the face of the earth

2) Because of 1) we are entitled to do whatever we want

It occurs to me that there is another peoples who uphold these principles, the Muslim Arabs. Their "defender" is OBL, the Serb "defender" is Milosevic. Both of these people are admired by their respective populations for "upholding their faith".

It is sad that after 13 years, 4 wars, hundreds of thousand dead, and 1 supposed revolution, there are Serbs who have the sort of views represented by the Serb Bureau of Foreign Press Propaganda a.k.a. Destro, Joan, FormerLib & co.

Go ahead give us another link to www.conspiracyagainsttheserbs.com.

The NY Times has never been pro-Serb

True, but it's also true that David Binder has always been overly pro-Serb.

You admitted that you're a Serb, so your hate against others from the region is disounted by anyone with half a brain, as just that, hate. I find it despicable frankly. I'll continue to rail against what I see as you and others portraying the Serb plight in terms of being the victims of the 4 wars, when in fact the Serbs were the aggressors.

I think I finally understand the Serb mindset. It is guided by two principles:
1) We are the greatest people on the face of the earth

2) Because of 1) we are entitled to do whatever we want

You know, that's one of the most moronic statements that I've ever read of Free Republic, even if I only compare it to the other usually moronic statements vomited forth by the small Serb-hating contingent here on FR.

Their "defender" is OBL, the Serb "defender" is Milosevic. Both of these people are admired by their respective populations for "upholding their faith".

And I'll say it again, if anyone thinks that I am any sort of "Milosevic-apologist" then that person suffers from a serious detachment from reality.

Go ahead give us another link to www.conspiracyagainsttheserbs.com.

Either show me a single link from me to that site or have the decency to apologize for lying.

There are few more outspoken sympathizers of the Serbian aspirations in the Balkans than Mr. Binder. It is easy to see that his articles are biased.

Prove it or have your reputation for spreading falsehoods even more firmly established.

Oh, my.... did the Serbs come over on the Mayflower or land in Virginia in 1624 and 1655.... like ALL my ancestors did????

Nope, they did not!!

Then, I am not a Serb.

You are so silly.

Back to that corner and wipe the rest of the egg off your face!

Show me where I unjustly called a FReeper a liar.

Because you did call another Freeper a liar in face of evidence to the contrary, your post number 103 was deleted from the board.

Feja e shqiptarit eshte al-Qaeda (The religion of Albanians is al-Qaeda).

LOL!

Do you guys have to take sides? Come on, Milo was responsible for the murders of many innocent people. The Islamists are responsible for the same and would like to continue it. How does it make sense to squabble over who is worse? What the US has to do is find a way for them to beat the crap out of each other, so when it comes time for us to mop up, there's not much left.

GeraldP what this gibberish in your tagline means?

"Feja e shqiptarit eshte shqiptaria"

Can you enlighten us, please?

Do you guys have to take sides?

After 911, how can we not?

Milosevic was a commie thug who was looking for a way to hold onto power as Communism collapsed. The persecutions of the Serbs in Kosovo at the hands of the nationalist Albanians handed him the means. He tried to replay it in Bosnia where it was a disaster for all involved.

It became our business when the Muslims in Bosnia and Kosovo began working with al-Qaeda.

So Milosevic was right about that, big deal! You know the old adage about a stopped clock being right twice a day? I'm glad Slobo is in a cell, that's where he deserves to be!

And Ceku and Thaci should be across the hall from him where they can live out there lives having a nice chat together.

bump for later...

You know, that's one of the most moronic statements that I've ever read of Free Republic, even if I only compare it to the other usually moronic statements vomited forth by the small Serb-hating contingent here on FR.

I am sure you have read the following clips before

SANU Memorandum 1986 - Clips

"Ethnic interests have taken precedence over class interests, and the provinces have insisted more on their status as a constituent element of the federation than on the fact that they are an integral part of Serbia. Balances of this sort have served as a means of pacifying those who were concerned about maintaining the state and economic integrity of the country as a whole, but they have also encouraged separatists of all stripes to push through their own agendas in practice".

[...]

"In order for the necessary changes to be effected, we must throw off the ideology which lays primary emphasis on ethnic and territorial considerations. Whereas in modern-day civilized society integrational trends are gaining momentum, with full affirmation of civil and human rights, the superseding of authoritarian forms of government, and democratization of government, what we have in our own political system is growing centrifugal forces, local, regional and national egoism, and authoritarian, arbitrary government, which on a large scale and at all levels of society violates universally recognized human rights. The propensity to divisions and fragmentation of global entities in society, which is in fact resistance to a modern, democratic, integrated federation, takes shelter behind the specious ideological catchword of a struggle against ‘‘unitarism’’ and ‘‘centralism.’’ However, the real alternative to ‘‘unitarism’’ and ‘‘centralism’’ is ethnic egoism and polycentrism, with local ‘‘national’’ (in fact republican and provincial) economies, with forcible restriction of science, culture, and education within territorial boundaries and the subjugation of all aspects of public life to the unchecked power of republican and provincial oligarchies. The real alternative is a democratic, integrating federalism, in which the principle of autonomy of the parts is in harmony with the principle of coordinating the parts within the framework of a single whole, in which political institutions at all levels of society are set up in a consistently democratic way, in which decision-making is preceded by free, rational, and public debate, and not by secret behind-the-scenes manoeuvring by cabals of self-styled and self-appointed champions of special ethnic interests".

[...]

"Self-management is stunted and deformed not just because it has been reduced to the level of social micro-entities, but also because it has been completely subordinated to the organs of alienated authority -- from the communes all the way up to republican and provincial governments. The disintegrated working class has been turned into a conglomerate of work collectives, placed in a situation where they have to fight with one another over how to divide up income".

[...]

"It is paradoxical that in a society which considers itself to be socialist, the working class has no opportunities of becoming organized or of being represented in the Federal Assembly. Just how much the ethnic and territorial principle has gained ascendancy over the economic principle of production can best be seen from the vehemence with which the idea of setting up a chamber of associated labour in the Federal Assembly is being resisted".

[...]

"There is no need to say that separatism and nationalism are both at work on the social scene, but there is not enough awareness that such trends were made ideologically possible by the 1974 Constitution. The constant strengthening and synergetic effect of separatism and nationalism have cut the national groups off from one another, to a critical degree. Machinations with language and the caging of academics and cultural personalities in republican and provincial enclosures are depressing signs of the burgeoning strength of particularism. All the new ethnogenies are not so much the unfortunate fabrications of an academic community shut up within a provincial bell jar and plagued by the incubus of regional ideologies as they are symptoms of growing alienation, not only from a common present and future but even from the common past. It is as though people were in a hurry to get out of a house which is tumbling down around their ears and were trying to run away as fast and as far as possible. The intellectual climate provides a warning that the political crisis has come close to the flash point of complete destabilization of Yugoslavia. Kosovo is the most obvious portent. Incidents such as Slivnitsa leave no one in doubt that those who have aspirations to Yugoslav territory have already defined their interests".

[...]

"The working class cannot stay a genuine vanguard for long if its intellectuals are looked upon as unreliable fellow travelers of the revolution. The limited confidence placed in the intelligentsia is perhaps most disastrous in that the country is losing step with technical advances. Deliberations on the system of production, the taking of investment decisions, organi-zationand development of production do not go beyond the conceptual framework of the second technological revolution, which is on the way out. The right moment for joining in the third technological revolution has, it appears, been missed".

[...]

"We have come to such a pass that almost nobody knows what values Yugoslav society seeks to uphold. The horizon of needs has never been seriously opened up for democratic debate. Consequently, the scale of priorities of needs is created spontaneously, largely under the influence of the consumer society mentality. This psychology, linked with an untrammeled primitivism, has greatly strengthened the propensity towards kitsch in literature, music, film, and entertainment of all types. This propensity is even being deliberately and systematically pandered to by the press, radio and television. Under the assault of the aggressive kitsch which reigns supreme on the scene, genuine cultural values have failed to take root on a large scale in society, despite the large number of important accomplishments in Yugoslavia’s cultural life. There are few planned efforts to bring these works to a wider public".

[...]

"The crisis in culture is seen not just in the fact that genuine social values cannot compete against kitsch. Cultural life is becoming more and more regionalized; the Yugoslav and universal significance of culture is becoming obliterated, and in large part it is putting itself in the service of republican and provincial aspirations to carve out their own fiefdoms in this sphere as well. The overall provincialization of cultural life lowers standards and makes it possible for the less talented to gain wide public recognition. Deep-rooted as they are in provincial cultural life, separatism and nationalism are becoming increasingly aggressive".

[...]

"The economic reform of 1965 essentially marked a change of course in the strategy of social development: the plan for political democratization was supplanted by a plan of economic liberalization. The idea of self-management, which pivots on the disalienization of politics, was replaced with the idea of decentralization, which led to the setting up of regional centres of alienated power. The ethics of mutual aid and the welfare state gave way to a spirit of grasping individualism and promotion of group interests".

[...]

"The working class enjoys no legal right of self-organization or strikes, and it does not have any real voice in political decision-making. Relations between national groups are characterized by clashes of conflicting interests, exploitation, and poor cooperation between autarkic national economies. We can no longer even speak seriously of a Yugoslav development policy or an integral Yugoslav market. Etatism has not been abolished; it has merely been transferred to the republican level, where it is the most inefficient and malignant".

[...]

"Unless there is a change in this Constitution and the political and economic system based on it, it will be impossible to resolve any of the basic problems in our society; it will be impossible to halt the present process of disintegration, and the country will slide ever deeper into crisis".

[...]

"If a monopoly of economic power is also one of the means by which elites are formed, which can foist themselves upon society and gain full control over its political life, then all the institutions which make such a monopoly of power possible are incompatible with the principle of the sovereignty of the people, regardless of whether it is big capital or a bureaucratic state. In this sense, full sovereignty of the people could be achieved only in a classless society, in which political, economic, and cultural life would be organized in a democratic manner. The prerequisite for such a democracy (‘‘consultative democracy’’ or ‘‘integrated self-management’’) is the free election and recall of all officials, public oversight of their work, a separation of powers, and the absence of bureaucratic privileges. These prerequisites have long ago been created in modern society. Yugoslavia has still not achieved this level, even though many years have gone by since it proclaimed the ideas of self-management, de-bureaucratization, and de-professionalization of politics".

[...]

"In modern, civilized society, any political oppression or discrimination on ethnic grounds is unacceptable. The Yugoslav solution of the national question at first could have been regarded as an exemplary model of a multinational federation, in which the principle of a unified state and state policy was happily married to the principle of the political and cultural autonomy of national groups and ethnic minorities. Over the past two decades, the principle of unity has become weakened and overshadowed by the principle of national autonomy, which in practice has turned into the sovereignty of the federal units (the republics, which as a rule are not ethnically homogeneous). The flaws which from the very beginning were present in this model have become increasingly evident. Not all the national groups were equal: the Serbian nation, for instance, was not given the right to have its own state. The large sections of the Serbian people who live in other republics, unlike the national minorities, do not have the right to use their own language and script; they do not have the right to set up their own political or cultural organizations or to foster the common cultural traditions of their nation together with their co-nationals. The unremitting persecution and expulsion of Serbs from Kosovo is a drastic example showing that those principles which protect the autonomy of a minority (the ethnic Albanians) are not applied to a minority within a minority (the Serbs, Montenegrins, Turks, and Roms in Kosovo). In view of the existing forms of national discrimination, present-day Yugoslavia cannot be regarded as a modern or democratic state".

[...]

"Only Serbia made genuine sacrifices for the sake of the development of the three underdeveloped republics and the Socialist Autonomous Province of Kosovo, helping others at the price of its own economic stagnation. This has not been the case as far as the three developed regions are concerned. Application of a rate of contributions proportional to the social product did not observe the basic rule that taxes should be levied according to ability to pay. The proportional rate of contributions spared Slovenia, Croatia, and Vojvodina from progressive rates of taxation, a fact which enabled them not only to grow at a normal rate but also to improve their own relative position in relation to the Yugoslav average. However, such rates of taxation have been an enormous burden for Serbia proper. Its economy has been setting aside about half its net capital savings for the underdeveloped regions, as a result of which it has itself been dragged down to the level of the economies of the underdeveloped republics".

[...]

"The attitude taken to Serbia’s economic stagnation shows that the vindictive policy towards this republic has not lost any of its edge with the passing of time. On the contrary, encouraged by its own success, it has grown ever stronger, to the point of genocide. The discrimination against citizens of Serbia who, because of the representation of the republics on the principle of parity, have fewer federal posts open to them than others and fewer of their own delegates in the Federal Assembly is politically untenable, and the vote of citizens from Serbia carries less weight than the vote of citizens from any of the other republics or any of the provinces. Seen in this light, Yugoslavia appears not as a community of equal citizens or equal nations and nationalities but rather as a community of eight equal territories. And yet not even here is Serbia equal, because of its special legal and political status, which reflects the desire to keep the Serbian people constantly under control. The watchword of this policy has been ‘‘a weak Serbia ensures a strong Yugoslavia,’’ and this idea has been taken a step further in the concept that if the Serbs as the largest national group are allowed rapid economic expansion, they would pose a threat to the other national groups. It is for this reason that all possible means have been used to hamstring Serbia’s economic progress and political consolidation by imposing more and more restrictions on it. One such restriction, which is very acute, is the present undefined and contradictory constitutional status of Serbia".

[...]

"In the absence of a commensurate counterbalance in coordination, as a rule the practice of regionalization turns into provincial narrow-mindedness and blindness to broader national interests".

[...]

"The problem will never be resolved in this fashion, and Serbia will continue to dissipate its energies coping with conflicts without any prospect of achieving complete success in the enterprise. This no doubt was the idea when the provinces were given wider autonomy, especially since the perpetuation of strife in Serbia gives others an excuse to interfere in its internal affairs and in this way prolong their domination over it. After the federalization of the League of Communists of Yugoslavia, such interference in the internal affairs of a republic has only remained possible in the case of Serbia".

[...]

"There has been no real showdown with neo-fascist aggression; all the measures taken to date have merely removed manifestations of this aggression from the streets, while in fact steeling resolve to achieve its uncompromising, racially motivated goals at any cost and using all possible means. Even the deliberately draconian sentences handed down against young offenders have been designed to incite and spread ethnic hatred".

[...]

"…between 1876 and 1912, some 150,000 Serbs were driven from hearth and home by the savage terror of the local privileged Albanian bashibazouks. During World War II, more than 60,000 Serbs were expelled from Kosovo and Metohija, but it was after the war that this exodus reached its highest proportions: in the last twenty-odd years, upwards of 200,000 Serbs have been forced to leave".

[...]

"Unless things change radically, in less than ten years’ time there will no longer be any Serbs left in Kosovo, and an ‘‘ethnically pure’’ Kosovo, that unambiguously stated goal of the Greater Albanian racists, already outlined in the programmes and actions of the Prizren League of 1878-1881, will be achieved".

[...]

"Kosovo’s fate remains a vital question for the entire Serbian nation. If it is not resolved with the sole correct outcome of the imposed war; if genuine security and unambiguous equality for all the peoples living in Kosovo and Metohija are not established; if objective and permanent conditions for the return of the expelled nation are not created, then this part of the Republic of Serbia and Yugoslavia will become a European issue, with the gravest possible unforeseeable consequences. Kosovo represents one of the most important points in the central Balkans. The ethnic mixture in many Balkan lands reflects the ethnic profile of the Balkan Peninsula, and a demand for an ethnically pure Kosovo, which is being actively pursued, is not only a direct and serious threat to all the peoples who live there as minorities but, if it is achieved, will spark off a wave of expansionism which will pose a real and daily threat to all the national groups living in Yugoslavia".

[...]

"The fanatic zeal to create a separate Croatian language countervailing any idea of a common language of the Croats and Serbs in the long run does not leave much hope that the Serbian people in Croatia will be able to preserve their national identity".

[...]

"The school system based on so-called ‘‘career-oriented’’ education and characterized by inferior quality of instruction has proven to be completely bankrupt. Several generations of school-leavers have been intellectually crippled and impoverished; we are turning out a surplus of uncultured, half-baked professionals, unequipped to take an effective role in the economy and social services and unprepared for creative and Intellectual efforts".

[...]

"Law-makers have de jure created eight educational systems, which are growing farther and farther apart from one an-other, and no amount of consultation about core curricula can reverse the course of development which has been mapped out in the legal statutes".

[...]

"What first must be done is to eliminate those laws which have a centrifugal effect so as to continue along the line of togetherness and unity which has been followed in these parts for more than one hundred and fifty years. Otherwise, we shall produce, and we are producing, generations who will be less and less Yugoslavs and more and more dissatisfied national romantics and self-seeking nationalists. A country which does not have a uniform system of education cannot hope to stay united in the future".

[...]

"Precisely at a time when public funds are being lavishly squandered, a policy of restricted spending has been introduced for the universities, which have been receiving less and less money. For a decade and a half the university faculties have not been able to employ new teaching assistants, so that the oldest Yugoslav universities, especially the Belgrade University, have never before in their history had such a high average age of their professors and researchers. Higher education and scientific research, which in all countries are the basic engine of development in the computer age, have been completely neglected. University ‘‘reforms,’’ most often carried out under political duress and not for academic reasons (as witnessed by the introduction of vocational diplomas in higher education, the compartmentalization of university faculties on the model of basic organizations of associated labour in the economy, etc.), have all been wide of the mark. Particular harm was done by the removal of the scientific research effort from university auspices, the creation of barriers, systemic and administrative, between research done in institutes and research done in universities. As a result the universities lost access to many laboratories; parallel programmes were created; research personnel in the field of science lost contact with one another, and the normal flow of scientists from universities to research institutes and from institutes to the universities was interrupted".

[...]

"After the dramatic inter-communal strife in the course of the Second World War, it seemed as though nationalism had run its course and was well on the way to disappearing completely. Such an impression has proven to be deceptive. Not much time passed before nationalism began to rear its ugly head again, and each successive constitutional change has created more of the institutional prerequisites needed for it to become full blown. Nationalism has been generated from the top, its prime initiators being the politicians. The basic cause of this manifold crisis is the ideological defeat which nationalism has inflicted on socialism. The disintegrational processes of all descriptions which have brought the Yugoslav state to the verge of ruin, coupled with a breakdown in the system of values, are the consequences of this defeat".

[...]

"The present state of depression of the Serbian people, against a background of chauvinism and Serbophobia which are gaining in intensity in some milieux, provides fertile soil for an ever more drastic manifestation of the national sensi-bilities of the Serbian nation and reactions which might be inflammatory and dangerous. It is incumbent upon us not to overlook or underestimate these dangers for a single moment. But at the same time, while calling for a struggle against Serbian nationalism as a matter of principle, we cannot condone the ideological and political symmetry, which has been established in apportioning historical blame. This equal apportionment of historical guilt, so corrosive to the spirit and morale, with its time-worn injustices and falsehoods, must be abandoned if we wish to see a democratic, Yugoslav, humanistic climate prevail in contemporary Serbian culture".

[...]

Admittedly, the first article of the Constitution of the Socialist Republic of Serbia contains a clause declaring that Serbia is a state, but the question must be asked what kind of a state is denied jurisdiction over its own territory or does not have the means at its disposal to establish law and order in one of its sections, or ensure the personal safety and security of property of its citizens, or put a stop to the genocide in Kosovo and halt the exodus of Serbs from their ancestral homes. Such a status is evidence of political discrimination against Serbia, especially in the light of the fact that the Constitution of the SFRY has imposed upon it internal federalization as a permanent source of conflict between Serbia proper and its provinces. The aggressive Albanian nationalism in Kosovo cannot be brought to heel unless Serbia ceases to be the only republic whose internal affairs are ordered by others".

[...]

"It is imperative that this constitution be amended so as to satisfy Serbia’ s legitimate interests. The autonomous provinces should become genuinely integral parts of the Republic of Serbia, while receiving that degree of autonomy which does not disrupt the integrity of the Republic and which will be able to satisfy the general interests of the community at large".

[...]

"While supporting the arrangements first outlined by the Anti-Fascist Council of National Liberation during the war, Serbia will have to bear in mind that the final decision does not rest with it, and that the others might prefer some other alternatives. Consequently, Serbia has the task of clearly assessing its own economic and national interests, lest it be taken unawares by events. By insisting on the federal system, Serbia would not only be furthering the equality of all the national groups in Yugoslavia but also facilitating resolution of the political and economic crisis".

[...]

"An era in the evolution of Yugoslav society and Serbia is obviously coming to an end with an historically exhausted ideology, general stagnation, and a deepening recession in the economic, moral and cultural spheres. Such a state of affairs makes it imperative to carry out radical, well-studied, scientifically based and resolutely implemented reforms of the entire state order and organization of the Yugoslav community of nations, and also in the sphere of democratic socialism, for a faster and more effective participation in contemporary civilization. Social reforms should to the greatest possible extent harness the natural and human resources of the entire country so that we might become a productive, enlightened, and democratic society, capable of living from our own labour and creativity and able to make a contribution to the world community".

[...]

Can you enlighten us, please?

My pleasure.
The phrase "Feja e shqiptarit eshte shqiptaria" is Albanian and it means roughly "The religion of the Albanian is Albanianism". It is a rallying phrase for Albanians of all religions: Muslim, Orthodox, and Catholic. It means that outside forces cannot come against this nation with the pretext of religion (read the subject of the thread), since Christians (like yours truly) will stand behind their Muslim brethren whether in Kosova or elsewhere.