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'Sex tourists' warned: Law is watching
USA Today ^ | Feb. 19, 2004 | Donna Leinwand

Posted on 02/22/2004 9:56:25 AM PST by Robert Lomax

Edited on 04/13/2004 1:41:59 AM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]

U.S. travelers who book trips to countries that are hot spots for child prostitution will begin this month to see ads, brochures and billboards warning that sexual adventures abroad could land them in prison here.

The warnings, written and distributed by religious organizations, child-welfare groups and the federal government, are a sign of a new assault by the Bush administration on the international child sex trade. They also reflect a new law intended to catch U.S. residents who engage in or promote sex with children overseas.


(Excerpt) Read more at usatoday.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption
KEYWORDS: crime; homelandsecurity; immigration; pedophiles; sex
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Thank goodness President Bush inacted this law. It should have been done long ago.
1 posted on 02/22/2004 9:56:25 AM PST by Robert Lomax
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To: Robert Lomax
Thank goodness President Bush inacted this law. It should have been done long ago.

It's a good law, and it needs to be in place, but...

"When you're surrounded by alligators, it's easy to forget that you're here to drain the swamp."

Pedophiles are sick, disgusting people, but we should not continue to use them as convenient scapegoats when we've created the social fabric that is conducive to "intergenerational relationships" (molestation).

2 posted on 02/22/2004 10:00:11 AM PST by MegaSilver (Coulter/Harris 2008)
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To: Robert Lomax
Better late than never. I have seen this in Thailand and
Manila. Even the &*%$#@##@ cabdrivers operate as pimps. If you are American male and alone, about 20% of the cabbies will proposition you. Life in prison for pedophiles is too good for them!!
3 posted on 02/22/2004 10:07:37 AM PST by international american (Dimpled chads for sale...buy one, get one free!)
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To: MegaSilver
But wait! Isn't it time for Sandra Day O'Connor and the Supreme Court to rule that flying overseas to molest children is protected under the Constitution? Why the precedent set in Lawrence is unmistakable. Besides such a ruling would make her and her cohorts the toast of the progressive child molestors in Belgium.
4 posted on 02/22/2004 10:07:39 AM PST by trek
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To: Robert Lomax
Schmidt, a former teacher, has been convicted three times of molesting children in the USA

It is time that we start demanding the death penalty for child molestors. They can never be trusted to be turned loose into our society.

5 posted on 02/22/2004 10:10:47 AM PST by mrfixit514
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To: mrfixit514
Schmidt, a former teacher, has been convicted three times of molesting children in the USA

They knew who to look for on these trips.

6 posted on 02/22/2004 10:15:45 AM PST by demlosers (More two-face from horse face.)
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To: Robert Lomax
Obviously this is just the work of SRBB (Self Rightous Busy Bodies).

The government has no right to get into our pants/bedrooms/brothels.

Oops, sorry I had the switch set to Losertarian. My bad.

7 posted on 02/22/2004 10:17:41 AM PST by AreaMan
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To: Robert Lomax
Thank goodness President Bush inacted this law.

Perhaps a different wording is in order to bring out what you really mean. Congress enacts legislation, not the president. The president then has the option of signing it into law. I think you must be saying that you are grateful that the president signed this.

If act means to do something, then inact probably means to do nothing, although this doesn't seem to be a standard word.

8 posted on 02/22/2004 10:24:06 AM PST by stripes1776
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To: Robert Lomax
Getting Child Molestors is a great admirable undertaking, but this is not the way.

If were going to arrest them and send them back for prosecution thats fine they probably will do more time there than here.

But its absolutely unacceptable to arrest someone and try them for a crime committed on foreign soil it belongs to that nation to uphold its laws.

This opens a very wide door whats next John Smith goes to Siagon and pisses off a asian buisnessman who makes a phone call and BAM! He's arrested and ruined at home with no one who belongs to this country or is subject to our laws as his accuser?

We had better think long and hard before we open up this pandoras box.

And before the flames roll in I'm NOT I repeat NOT supporting child abuse or prostitution just a citizens right to face his/ her accuser.

9 posted on 02/22/2004 10:25:16 AM PST by Kakaze
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To: Southack
This may be another item for your list of Bush accomplishments. He signed this into law.
10 posted on 02/22/2004 10:29:11 AM PST by kitkat (Eat, purr, SNOOZE, eat, purr, SNOOZE)
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To: Robert Lomax
In Germany, sex with a 16-year-old prostitute is legal (if you're under 21, sex with a 14-year-old is legal).

Will a US citizen be arrested in Germany for sex with a 16-year-old?

11 posted on 02/22/2004 10:34:25 AM PST by robertpaulsen
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To: Robert Lomax
Oh yea, great law.

What's next? If I shoot a machingegun in Switzerland can I be arrested when I come home for possession of illegal weapons?

If I go to Denmark and smoke a joint can I be arrested when I come home?

If I deposit 20K in cash in a bank in the Bahamas can I be arrested when I come home?

Sex with children is illegal in every country in the world. If the crime is committed on their soil, let them prosecute.

L

12 posted on 02/22/2004 10:36:11 AM PST by Lurker (Don't bite the hand that meads you.)
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To: Robert Lomax
To get a conviction under the new law, prosecutors do not have to prove that U.S. residents left the country specifically to have illegal sex — only that they had illegal sex or tried to do so.

How can this be done without the active participation of the foreign government. Pressure to close the brothels and prosecute the snake heads that own them is the only long range solution. I know that in Thailand there are many groups -- Christian, Buddhist, Human Rights, etc. -- that have long fought against child prostitution (and adult prostitution as well -- a good number of the older women are slaves). The problem is in the lack of political will to prosecute. A case in point is the rise to prominance of Chuwit (King of the massage parlors in Bangkok) after he was prosecuted for another offense (Property crime). Chuwit is the darling of the tabloids -- kind of like Larry Flint in USA.

Unless a person signs up for a "Sex Tour", there would seem to be little for him to be prosecuted for. The majority of tourists are legit -- Families, retirees, beach bums, etc.

13 posted on 02/22/2004 10:36:12 AM PST by JimSEA
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To: Robert Lomax
The law was a result of pressure on Bush and Congress from conservative religious groups to be more aggressive in fighting the sexual exploitation of children worldwide.

I wonder why pressure had to be applied to get this law passed?

In any event, I don't see many successful prosecutions: Things like the accused being able to confront witness against him come to mind as being all but impossible in most cases (except, maybe, for stings, which present another Constitutional problem). It should serve as a deterrent though.

14 posted on 02/22/2004 10:43:05 AM PST by templar
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To: Lurker
If I deposit 20K in cash in a bank in the Bahamas can I be arrested when I come home?

Yes! I take it you're unfamiliar with current financial transaction laws? Cash being carried overseas is a no no. There are plenty of other things you can do to put money in Bahamian accounts though; the same ones the wealthy and politicians use.

15 posted on 02/22/2004 10:47:29 AM PST by templar
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To: templar
Why would stings present a constitutional problem?
16 posted on 02/22/2004 10:55:38 AM PST by inquest (The only problem with partisanship is that it leads to bipartisanship)
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To: Kakaze
They actually commit a crime on US soil in that they are conspiring to commit the sexual act.
17 posted on 02/22/2004 11:07:33 AM PST by sharktrager (The last rebel without a cause in a world full of causes without a rebel.)
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To: Robert Lomax
IMHO, THE world's oldest profession is pimping children.

Life is cheap and girls are worth far less to parents than boys. Girls must earn their keep for their masters. Every year, millions of girls are simply aborted or killed for being an economic burden to their own families. Sex slave markets never change.

Fact: children are a renewable resource in many locations, now destinations.

Islam's Mo'ham's favorite bride was but nine years old.
18 posted on 02/22/2004 11:16:03 AM PST by SevenDaysInMay (Federal judges and justices serve for periods of good behavior, not life. Article III sec. 1)
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To: Kakaze
Agree and understand, Kakaze.

I think pedophiles should have their dinguses (trying to be polite here) severely shortened before we decide how to punish them.

But am very uneasy about us being able to prosecute people for crimes committed in another country.

Seems to me we are opening a can of worms that will be impossible to close.
19 posted on 02/22/2004 11:44:35 AM PST by auntdot
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To: Robert Lomax
I am truly conflicted about this law. The ACLU probably will be on it soon.

While its relatively easy to support enforcement of a law that punishes the exploitation and solicitation of children for amoral sex, the underlying principle scares me.

When separated from such a "hot-button" issue as illicit child sex, one really has to question the efficacy of the U.S. Government running around the world, enforcing our laws on foreign territory.

A benign, less offensive, but clear example would be compelling U.S. citizens to obey our speed limits on German autobahns. Clearly, that's a ludicrous stretch, but the PRINCIPLE is the same. Its up to the Germans, not the U.S. government, to enforce their own speed limits.

Or, what about Americans who smoke weed in Amsterdam, are we going to go round them up too ?? By American standards it is illegal.

Now, exploiting children for sex is mightily offensive to Americans, but are we really in a position to enforce our cultural mores on foreign soil ??

The answer is fraught with legal, ethical and moral questions.

First, the obvious issue is that foreign nations set their own laws regarding prostitution and the age of legal consent. Just as in our own state of Nevada, prostitution is legal and regulated in a number of countries.

In some Central/South American countries the age of consent is as low as 12, even in Austria the age of consent for females is 14 and Thailand is 15, all still children by my reckoning. Where do we draw the line, 11 and younger ??

In the U.S., the federal age of consent is 16 (18 USC 2243(a)), and the South Carolina Constitution sets the age at 14 (although there is some dispute whether the age is now 16 by statute), http://www.ageofconsent.com/ageofconsent.htm.

The point is, no matter how odious and offensive, it is conceivable, there may be places on the face of the earth where prostitution with a 12 year old girl is legal.

Is it the intent of the U.S. government to enforce 18 USC 2243(a) in those places ??

Are we going to use TIPS, TIA, Echelon, CAPPS II and all the other government data mining and snooping resources to spy on ALL Americans to determine if just a few some may intend to travel abroad to solicit sex ??

How do you prosecute intent anyway - that's sort of like a hate crime isn't it - punishing someone on the basis of what they think -- remember, what they're thinking may be offensive, but we've got to stick to our principles here.

Pretty scary to me.

BTW, the age of consent is not applicable to legally married women. In the U.S., girls as young as 13 can be married in New Hampshire (with consent) and 14 in New York (with consent). Ironically, contrary to the stereotype, you must be at least 21 to be married without parental consent in Mississippi. http://usmarriagelaws.com/search/united_states/teen_marriage_laws/index.shtml

Finally, by what reasoning do we have the moral authority to traipse around the world enforcing such laws. We have our own rampant child (and adult) prostitution and pornography problem right here at home we haven't been able to clean up -- and we're going to go to the Philippines and track down Americans there ??

And, to what end - we don't punish these offenders here in the U.S. anyway, there are dozens of graves around this country filled with children who have met their demise at the hands of known, convicted sex offenders (and other felonies) who should have been behind bars. As "they" say, charity starts at home.

There surely must be more to this issue than described by this article, because it just doesn't make any sense to me.

Maybe we ought to focus on cleaning up America first.

20 posted on 02/22/2004 11:48:35 AM PST by skip2myloo
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