Loss of Spain hurts still, centuries after Moors' last sigh

theage ^ | March 14, 2004 | Isambard Wilkinson

[aruanan]

For Muslims, Loss of Spain Still Hurts, Centuries After Moors's Defeat

That's "...Moors' Defeat."

[RonHolzwarth]

re: "It's very pathetic that long established nations were not able to defeat transplanted Jews with shotguns and old cannibalized military weapons."

You forgot that when you have G-d on your side, you will win in end.

The G-d of the Jews and Christians can whip the moon god allah any day. Right now, He is just allowing allah and his slaves to survive, as a test for all of us.

(I claim this under the "freedom of religion clause" of the US constitution)

[aruanan]

The tale of the "Moors' last sigh" is recounted to epitomise the loss of one of the Islamic world's great jewels.

They had a big chunk of Eastern Europe for a long time and lost that too.

[Restorer]

It's very pathetic that long established nations were not able to defeat transplanted Jews with shotguns and old cannibalized military weapons.

The Arab nations around Israel were actually quite new. Most had existed less than 25 years as independent nations, with most of that time spent really under British or French occupation.

Also their military equipment and organization was pathetic in '47, much worse than that of the Jews. Arab armies then, as now, were primarily designed for massacring unarmed civilians to keep the Arab leaders in power, not for fighting a foreign army.

The Arabs did not become well armed till the Russians started arming them in the 50's and 60's, but of course the Israelis were able to stay well ahead of them in the arms race throughout. Had the Israelis of 1947 faced the Arab armies of 1967, the Israelis would have been massacred.

[Paleo Conservative]

The year 1492, when Granada was ceded to Ferdinand and Isabella, is a talismanic date for some Islamist scholars, who consider it as the beginning of the decline of the Muslim world.

"That would be when Islam jumped the shark, yes."

Not really. In the eastern Mediterranean, Islam was advancing. The Ottoman Turks captured Constantinople in 1453 about 39 years prior to the expulsion of Muslims from Spain.

The city of Constantine, Constantinople, fell to the hands of the Ottoman Turks on Tuesday, 29 of May, 1453. The remaining Christian settlements in the Aegean were thrown into a state of terror.

[freedumb2003]

(I claim this under the "freedom of religion clause" of the US constitution)

Sorry, that doesn't apply to Chistian or Jewish religion (except maybe the LTS cult). Have you considered converting to wiccan, islam or satanism (the latter 2 are of course interchangable)? Those freedoms are protected.

[Restorer]

Isn't it about time to start rounding up all Arab Muslims, for immediate deportation, from every non-Muslim country?

Nope, but I would have no problem at all deporting any Muslim who proclaims his sympathy for or identification with those who are attacking us. Treat them as an openly pro-Nazi German-American would have been treated in WWII.

Why not?

[navyblue]

I wish the Mexicans would "reclaim" southern california. Goodbye, Hollywood.

Hey! Knock it off! Many of us Americans still live in California. Do you wish ill upon us because of what the libs have done to us as well?

[68 grunt]

... the Muslims were ordered out.

Who the hell let'em back in? Islam sucks and is the embodiment of evil. Crusader Rabbit, where are you when we need you?

[Pelayo]

Do you wish ill upon us because of what the libs have done to us as well?

I find it hard to believe that even the Mexican government could do worse for you then the libs have.

[RonHolzwarth]

re: " Treat them as an openly pro-Nazi German-American would have been treated in WWII. Why not?"

Because that is to good for them, that's why not!

[AmishDude]

The Ottoman Turks captured Constantinople in 1453 about 39 years prior to the expulsion of Muslims from Spain.

Uh, yeah, prior.

And don't you mean "Istanbul", not Constantinople.

[Larry Lucido]

LOL!

[Pelayo]

And don't you mean "Istanbul", not Constantinople.

It's the same city.

[Paleo Conservative]

And don't you mean "Istanbul", not Constantinople.

No. They conquered Constantinople, then renamed it to Istanbul. 1453 was just the beginning of Islamic domination of the eastern Mediterranean. The Turks went on to invade the Balkans and other parts of Southeastern Europe. They didn't "jump the shark" in Europe till September 11, 1683, when the Polish general Sobieski defeated and routed the Turks at the battle of Vienna after the Turks had set siege to Vienna for several months and were just about to conquer it.

[Pelayo]

Hay look a site about HMCM Queen Isabella. They want to canonize her. "Cool," I say!

[Paleo Conservative]

It's the same city.

It was Constantinople when it was conquered. The Turks then renamed it to Istanbul. To say the Turks conquered Istanbul would be like saying the Spanish Conquistadors conquered the southwestern region of the United States. The United States of America didn't exist when the Spaniards were making their conquests in North America.

[Hildy]

Bubble Boy!!!!

[GulliverSwift]

till September 11, 1683, when the Polish general Sobieski defeated and routed the Turks at the battle of Vienna after the Turks had set siege to Vienna for several months and were just about to conquer it.

Amen. The blashpheming infidels. The "crusaders" were stopped. But obviously they're trying again, as well as in the United States with groups like CAIR, of the Council for American Islamic Relations.