Georgia Passes Laws Limiting Protests

AP ^ | Apr 18-04 | RUSS BYNUM

[AmericanMade1776]

Georgia Passes Laws Limiting Protests Sun Apr 18, 1:34 PM ET Add U.S. National - AP to My Yahoo!

By RUSS BYNUM, Associated Press Writer

BRUNSWICK, Ga. - Robert Randall never knew free speech could cost so much — in dollars and in compromises — until he tried to organize a large-scale, peaceful demonstration for this summer's G-8 summit.

The coastal city of Brunswick, where Randall hopes to gather up to 10,000 people to protest the world leaders' summit, passed a law last month that places conditions on public demonstrations.

Organizers of protests like Randall's "G-8 Carnival" must put up refundable deposits equal to the city's estimated cost for clean up and police protection. Demonstrations may only last 2 hours, 30 minutes. Signs and banners may not be carried on sticks that might be brandished as weapons. And the signs may not be larger than 2-by-3 feet.

"This law would not exist if the G-8 was not coming here," said Randall, 51, a local therapist who has attended demonstrations since the Vietnam War. "It makes it impossible to express oneself through assembly or speech on public property unless you have money."

Thousands of anti-globalization protesters are expected June 8-10 when President Bush (news - web sites) hosts the leaders of Britain, Japan, Germany, Italy, France, Canada and Russia on secluded Sea Island.

Brunswick, Savannah and surrounding counties have passed ordinances governing protest permits. The American Civil Liberties Union (news - web sites) has threatened to sue, saying the laws "place impermissible limits on free speech."

Observers say the cities' actions fit a national pattern of managing dissent with beefed up laws and police powers that constrict constitutional guarantees of freedom of speech and assembly.

The new laws are a response to the violent protests during the 1999 World Trade Organization (news - web sites) meeting in Seattle and the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks in 2001.

Demonstrators are facing some of their toughest restrictions since the 1960s, said Ronald Collins of the First Amendment Center in Arlington, Va.

"Post-Seattle and 9-11, it seems more municipalities are considering measures that may well undermine existing First Amendment law," he said.

Miami banned props such as water pistols, balloons and sticks before demonstrators arrived for a global trade summit in November. The city repealed the law last month in the face of lawsuits.

On Thursday, federal appeals court judges ruled that an Augusta, Ga., ordinance violated the rights of a women's group that sought to protest outside the all-male Augusta National Golf Club during the 2003 Masters golf tournament.

The ordinance, adopted just before the tournament, let police keep protesters a half-mile from the club's gates and required a permit for any assembly of five or more people. The appeals court said the law "creates the opportunity for undetectable censorship."

Activists also have complained that security plans for so-called "free speech zones" at the Democratic Convention in Boston will keep protesters from being seen or heard.

Cities "are choosing sides and what they're doing is trying to silence people from speaking out," said Mara Verheyden-Hilliard, a Washington attorney and co-founder of the Partnership for Civil Justice. "And they're using the law as a political tool to do it."

During the G-8 summit in Georgia, both Brunswick and Savannah expect to see protesters.

Brunswick is the nearest inland community to Sea Island, which will be off limits to demonstrators. Savannah, 60 miles north, will house 5,000 international journalists and dignitaries.

With the summit less than two months away, neither city has approved any permits for demonstrations — in part, activists say, because of steep requirements.

Brunswick requires groups of six or more to apply for permits at least 20 days before an event. The city's ordinance sets no limit on deposits, and says permits may be denied if a demonstration is likely to congest traffic, impede commerce or endanger the public.

Savannah's law is similar but does not specify the size of groups needing permits, which the ACLU says could be applied to one person.

City officials have said that protesters wanting to use public parks will be charged the same fees — $150 to $700 per day — as people renting those spaces for private events such as weddings. Groups of 150 or more must pay maintenance deposits of $1.50 per head.

Savannah Mayor Otis Johnson declined to comment, citing the threat of litigation from the ACLU. But City Attorney James Blackburn told the Savannah Morning News the city would review the ordinance in light of the appellate decision on the Augusta lawsuit.

In Brunswick, Randall says he's waiting to find a site for his demonstration before requesting a permit. The city's mayor says the city is trying to help him.

[beardog]

works for me.

[edeal]

Because you disagree with the content of their protest. Holding this type of belief is dangerous to a free society. You should have no expectation of freedom if you do not believe that people you disagree with should have any.

[ContemptofCourt]

Until you are the one protesting.....good grief.

[Riley]

When you're talking about 10,000 G-8 protestors, 'speech' means burning dumpsters, overturned cars, harassed citizens and smashed windows of businesses.

[The kings dead]

Principle seems like a foreign idea to some FReepers.

[The kings dead]

When you're talking about 10,000 G-8 protestors, 'speech' means burning dumpsters, overturned cars, harassed citizens and smashed windows of businesses.

Isn't burning dumpsters, overturning cars, harassing citizens, and smashing windows of businesses already against the law?

[An.American.Expatriate]

While I am always leary of any restrictions on the First Ammendment, I can understand the city's standpoint in requiring a deposit for the cleanup effort and placing limits on the types of poles used to carry the placards. Both of these "limitations" in no way infringe upon a individuals right to speech. They do pose some limits on groups, although a group of 6 or so obviously won't be creating the mess that 10,000 would. In effect the city is saying that the organizers of the protests are to be treated the say way that organizers of any other type of gathering. They are responsible for the "cleanup", and, in some cases a deposit for such services may be required.

I think this is a good, common sense approach to a difficult problem.

[Riley]

Because you disagree with the content of their protest. Holding this type of belief is dangerous to a free society. You should have no expectation of freedom if you do not believe that people you disagree with should have any.

I agree with this statement, although speech does not include 'criminal mischeif'. Nobody is especially worried about a bunch of leftists chanting and waving signs around. The problems is all of the destruction that this mob always seems to bring with it. Breaking windows and burning cop cars isn't, in my view, 'speech'.

[kevkrom]

I'm in two minds on this... no person should have their free speech rights infringed, and the right to "peacefully assemble" is guaranteed by the Constitution... however... group protests, especially of this size, do pose a bit of a problem for civil order, maintenance, security, etc.

Any organized gathering like this probably should have to post some kind of assurance that they will cover any "above and beyond" costs, but it seems like the Georgia law is overly restrictive.

[freeeee]

The new laws are a response to the violent protests during the 1999 World Trade Organization (news - web sites) meeting in Seattle and the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks in 2001.

Protesters flew planes into buildings on 9-11? WOW! I heard it here first!

[zeugma]

These types of restrictions are getting more and more common, and more and more restrictive. This is not a good thing IMO. Many Freepers chafed at the restrictions that often accompanied the impeached one, and justifiably so. Just because many of the protesters in this case are socialist/communist/anarchists doesn't make it right.

Freedom is for everone or it will be for noone.

[Hodar]

Isn't burning dumpsters, overturning cars, harassing citizens, and smashing windows of businesses already against the law?

This is true, however who pays for the ~500 (that's a 20:1 ratio) for law enforcement that the demonstration will likely require? Historically, these protests have resulted in damage to local businesses, assault on the police, overturned cars, and chaos.

In the case of Seattle, the gut-less liberals couldn't see their way to actually pressing charges against the scum that were arrested while burning, looting, assaulting and resisting the officer's attempts at restoring peace.

[Hodar]

Any organized gathering like this probably should have to post some kind of assurance that they will cover any "above and beyond" costs..

I like the way you think. If the organizers would post an 'Insurance' bond; or a 'damage deposit'; they would have a vested interest to keep things under control. This way, they get their rights, but they also have some actual responsibility.

[edeal]

I agree with the criminal mischief, but we already have laws against that. Does this mean April 15th tax protests are ilegal now without a license from the Governemnt?

Things like this, in the long run, are scary.

[Riley]

Isn't burning dumpsters, overturning cars, harassing citizens, and smashing windows of businesses already against the law?

Yes, such acts are. I cannot speak for the city of Brunswick or the state of Georgia, but they have a pretty good idea what to expect from the anti G-8 mob. I suspect that it was seen as a 'sit here and take it or do something about it' situation. A better response might have been to rustle up every cop they can get their hands on to be in town and quietly inform the protest organisers that nonsense will not be tolerated.

If your city is going to host a G-8 event, police pay and overtime are part of the cost of doing such business. If I scheduled events for the G-8, I'd lean towards holding them on cruise ships, where the security situation is more easily managed.

[Ready4Freddy]

I remember well the Christmas season of 1971, when Texas Tech had passed some rules designating 'free speech' & 'free association' areas, and otherwise limiting the ability of students and others to protest the war in Vietnam (primarily).

Trouble was, the rules were written so broadly that Tech's traditional 'Carol of Lights' Christmas procession also violated them. After the univ was taken to court, Tech went without their Carol of Lights that year, and did away with the 'free speech' rules soon thereafter.

[Riley]

I agree with the criminal mischief, but we already have laws against that. Does this mean April 15th tax protests are ilegal now without a license from the Governemnt?

I do not favor acts of government which constrain free speech. I think that this could be handled better.

I don't see April 15th tax protestors doing the things that the G-8 yahoos do. The criminal mischeif is clearly the issue. It also sticks in mind that whenever somebody wants to hold a demonstration in most major cities in the US, they are required by the city to obtain some form of 'protest permit'. This chafes me, because it amounts to requesting the government's permission to peaceably assemble. Permission, can always be denied.

The practical side of it is that cities are obligated to protect the interests of their citizens. A bit of advanced warning that there are going to be thousands of folks, many from out-of-town showing up, most or all of them angry about something, isn't an unreasonable thing to ask. So I am of two minds on the issue of protest permits.

As much as I dislike this bunch of destructive cretins, they are within their rights to peaceably assemble to express their views. When you get a bunch with a track record like theirs, I am not sure what the answer is. There will be trouble. How the city handles it, ultimately remains to be seen. I don't like laws that set bad precedent. But I also don't like groups who willingly and knowingly abuse their rights. On the balance, the first duty of government is to protect the Constututional rights of its citizens, so I disagree with the passage of laws that constrain free speech. I think that it'd have been wise to handle this differently.

Lots of coppery in evidence to deal with the destructive types, would be my first inclination. I am intrigued also by another poster's suggestion that groups who are going to have these kinds of protests put up a bond or financial guarantee against damages and injuries caused, giving them an incentive to police their own. Discuss?

[The kings dead]

who pays for the ~500 (that's a 20:1 ratio) for law enforcement that the demonstration will likely require?

I have no problem with the refundable deposit; the other provisions assume guilt before the fact.

[lilylangtree]

Can see a lawsuit by the ACLU down the road.

[cksharks]

It would be hunky-dory if these f-ing bastards would just protest.The problem is they tear up everything in site.If you can gurantee that they will not destroy the towns then I will gurantee that they can have 50k if they want them.Fair enough? The kicker is you pay if they dont obey.

[dmz]

I hate to say it, but I think there are plenty of freepers who would be perfectly content with any and all restrictions on the other side. The problem is that sooner or later, everyone is on "the other side".

The attitude that these restrictions are OK surprises me in about the same way as those freepers espousing monarchism.

[Hank Rearden]

works for me.

Yes, it "works" for all totalitarians.

[FreedomPoster]

You're in the neighborhood. Thought you might want a ping, and might even want to comment.

[Vigilantcitizen]

First, the headline is totally misleading:

"Georgia Passes Laws Limiting Protests"

Second paragraph of the article...

The coastal city of Brunswick, where Randall hopes to gather up to 10,000 people to protest the world leaders' summit, passed a law last month that places conditions on public demonstrations.

Second, the protesters are in for a bad day if they start trouble...I'm sure the security personnel will be heavily populated with local prison "goon squad" employees. Not a nice bunch of guys at all.

[backhoe]

I, too, have reservations about limiting speech... but I want you all to consider this:

When you're talking about 10,000 G-8 protestors

I live here- despite misrepresentations by the city fathers to the contrary, based on actual meter connections and phone service, Brunswick is believed to have 16,000 residents. The whole of Glynn County, including the islands, has about 60,000 people.

Our police force ran- I say again, ran- from racial disturbances about 6 blocks away from our house. This happened about 2 years ago, and the news was suppressed, even locally. My wife & I unshipped weapons from the armory, and waited, and we got lucky- it burned out before reaching us- but the old house we inhabit is tactically indefensible. Talk about sweating blood.

G-8 is a farce, in my opinion- we, the sheep, are being sold it as we were the 1996 Atlanta Olympics ( for your info, ATL is about a 5-hour drive from here ) where we were all told to put up with the inconvienience because it would make everybody here rich & famous.

We're still waiting on our cut of the money and fame, and G-8 will be no different.

These characters who are wanting to protest look to me like professional malcontents, with the usual smattering of useful dupes thrown in to fool the press. Like Seattle.

[backhoe]

The coastal city of Brunswick, where Randall hopes to gather up to 10,000 people to protest the world leaders' summit, passed a law last month

I caught that right off, VC-- it's a local ordinance. See my #26-- I neither kid nor exaggerate about what I mentioned. The local police ran away from about 30 unruly people at a nightclub- I shudder to think what they'd do if faced with even a thousand organized anarchists.

[DoughtyOne]

Free speech? Yes. Deal harshly with violence and destruction? Yes.

I understand the thought behind this law, but view it as unconstitutional. Further, I do not like protesters being moved miles away from the activity of summits or meetings. Within reason those attending these conferences should see what the public thinks about what they are doing.

Now I realize there needs to be security concerns, so I'd make sure these peckerheads were disarmed before allowing them to protest, otherwise the leaders who are just glorified citizens anyway, should have to put up with noise and discomfort to screw the populace, if that's what they are doing.

Those who are doing right, should have the character to stand up for that right, and damn the protesters, full speed ahead.

[kevkrom]

a thousand organized anarchists

Oxymoron alert?

[backhoe]

I do see your point... maybe "controlled chaos-ists" would be more accurate!

[Vigilantcitizen]

See my #26-- I neither kid nor exaggerate about what I mentioned. The local police ran away from about 30 unruly people at a nightclub- I shudder to think what they'd do if faced with even a thousand organized anarchists.

I believe it. But you can bet the elitist attending the G8 have the money to bring in private security by the busload, and will do so.

Sorry to hear you almost had trouble neighbor. If I lived closer, I'd been right over. I know you'd let me use one of your BAR's. ;^)

[Tamar1973]

The American Civil Liberties Union (news - web sites) has threatened to sue, saying the laws "place impermissible limits on free speech."

This is the same group that supports the laws which tell anti-abortion protestors they can't protest within 500 ft of an abortion clinic.

Another example of liberal, ACLU hypocricy.

[Glenn]

Poll taxes were deemed illegal and this set of laws amounts to a poll tax on protestors. That's not right and will surely be found illegal down the road.

And if these morons think a rule is going to stop 10,000 apparent scofflaws from tearing through their hamlet, they are in for a surprise. The only thing they will do is push this to a Kent State situation where the guard will be called to clean up the mess.

[backhoe]

I do have a spare...

What outsiders don't realize is that there is a "gulf fixed between Brunswick and the Islands"- one that goes beyond the actual distances involved, or the salt marshes lying between.

These protesters might as well stage in Darien or Waycross, for all the nonexistent impact it will have on G-8 on those on the Islands.

To me, they are just self-indulgent pests trying to get attention from the usual suspects in the Jackal Pack Press, and to have their 15 minutes of fame on the TV.

You are right about an abundance of private security- the actual attendees have little to fear; they will be well-guarded.

It's us peons out in the hinterlands who will be annoyed by roadblocks, checkpoints and other manifestations of the Iron Fist inside the velvet glove.

[grellis]

My parents live on Jekyll Island so this is a hot topic for them, too. Most people don't realize just how small a community Glynn County is, and the press nationwide hasn't helped much--more often than not, I hear the press saying that the summit will be in Savannah. An influx of 10,000 protesters to Savannah would probably not be too big a deal. In Glynn County its going to be a nightmare.

Keep us posted on how things go. A FReeper on the scene! Cool!

[backhoe]

My parents live on Jekyll Island so this is a hot topic for them, too. Most people don't realize just how small a community Glynn County is, and the press nationwide hasn't helped much--more often than not, I hear the press saying that the summit will be in Savannah. An influx of 10,000 protesters to Savannah would probably not be too big a deal. In Glynn County its going to be a nightmare. Keep us posted on how things go. A FReeper on the scene! Cool!

Thanks for pointing that out- this is a fairly big area geographically, but we are a small community by most standards.

My plan is to hunker down and try to vanish, but I will report whatever, or what little, I observe.

My regards to your folks- I'll be holding forth from my little bastion in the South End.

[gogeo]

A small suburb of Seattle was hosting a fundraiser for W. The usual leftists were bussed in from Seattle and other points. There was, obviously, a lot of cops around, a lot of overtime.

Who should pay for the OT?

[mwyounce]

Ahh yes, the infamous July 4th race riots of Brunswick... I was glad I was on the Island... we heard the news the next morning, with the burned out police cars and all...

I'm glad i'm not going to be in that mess, but unfortunately my family still is... My father runs an exterminating company in Brunswick, and they've been told just to accept the fact that they will not be getting on Sea Island, and might as well not even try to come across the St. Simons causeway...

I'd love to hear W.W. and the Chamber of Commerce explain how this is a benefit to the businesses of Glynn County....

[dansangel]

The local police ran away from about 30 unruly people at a nightclub- I shudder to think what they'd do if faced with even a thousand organized anarchists.

You and all of the legitimate, year-round residents of Brunswick and St. Simons will figure heavily in my prayers as G-8 approaches.

You know how I feel about you, your family and St. Simons Island. I was heartsick when I heard the G-8 was going to be held there. When .45MAN and I visited last fall, the natives were a-buzz about the upcoming meetings. None, that I could see, were paticularly happy about it.

I hope and pray all goes well for you and that the unruly, hate-driven malcontents choke on their own bad karma.

[upchuck]

Brunswick is the nearest inland community to Sea Island, which will be off limits to demonstrators. Savannah, 60 miles north, will house 5,000 international journalists and dignitaries.

Brunswick is a pretty small place. I doubt it can hold 10,000 protesters without stacking them :)

I wonder why they're heading north on I95? A quick glance at a Georgia map shows heading south on I95 to Jacksonville, FL to be closer. Jax is considerably larger than Savannah also.

Regarding the free speech issue.. IMHO, it makes sense for the city to require a permit. This gives the city notice of the event so the city can plan for it. Requiring a deposit is pretty much on the edge for me. I'd rather have the police disperse the gathering if they (police) felt the protesters were making a mess.

As far as overtime pay, etc. goes, the city and state should consider this a "cost of doing business" and build this into their respective budgets.

[backhoe]

I'd love to hear W.W. and the Chamber of Commerce explain how this is a benefit to the businesses of Glynn County....

I would too- I ran retail businesses here for years ( remember the old Yellow Frog? ) and I regarded the CC as an outfit that welcomed & helped my competitors to come into town and do me dirt.

I know your Dad, of course, and he ( and perhaps you ) know my old mechanical mentor, Roger Parsons.

[lodwick]

Welcome to the NWO's new america.

What steenking 1st Amendment?

[Little Bill]

What happens when WE want a large scale protest?,/p.

[backhoe]

I (we) thank you and Dan for your kind thoughts. I suspect we denizens of the benighted Mainland will be fine since attention will be focused on Sea Island and the associated barrier islands, and while terrorist incidents can't be ruled out, the logistics of such a strike make it unlikely, aside from the heightened security.

People unfamiliar with this area have no idea how the causeways limit access, or how close-knit people in this area are. Strangers stand out like sore thumbs.

As for the protesters, they are largely self-aggrandizing malcontents who would find another cause if this one weren't available. The sad thing is they corrupt and drown out legitimate debate and opposition, forsaking it for cheap street theatre. Like with Free Trade, I think you can make fairly decent arguments pro and con- but not with these clowns hogging the spotlight.

[spunkets]

This is only possible, because of past leftist failures to punish those that were out, not to protest, but destroy. This sort of prior restraint is abhorent to Freedom.

[.45MAN]

It's too bad that the whole thing has to be here in the first place. As always even a well organized well meaning demonstration can become unruly and a completely disorganized mob scene with just a couple of people placed in the middle.

Hopefully the state and federal people will be able to handle anything that gets out of hand. As I said before too bad it has to be there in the forst place.

I hope that after this is over the area will get back to normal, it's a nice area and until know unknown to most.

[backhoe]

...and until know unknown to most.

Back when Jimmy Carter was President, we had our 15 minutes of glory when he visited Musgrove Plantation on SSI. My folks were friends with the owners, and we used to visit there- a fixture of the place was Johnny Reb, a huge, ancient bloodhound who looked fierce as a bear, but who was actually very laid-back and friendly.