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Fired Custodian To Fight For Job (A "Don't hurt the little brats feelings" POST)
GF Herald ^ | 05.01.04 | Stephen J. Lee

Posted on 5/2/2004, 2:03:44 AM by wallcrawlr

A Grand Forks school custodian fired this week over what he calls a teasing comment made to a student says he's going to hire an attorney to fight his dismissal.

But a school official said proper procedures were followed in firing the man.

It happened fast at Wilder Elementary School, just off Gateway Drive on North Third Street.

Tuesday morning, custodian Mike Baynes told a boy in kindergarten wearing shorts that his legs were so hairy, he would have to take a lawn mower to them, according to Baynes and several parents who questioned school officials about the incident.

"The kid thought it was a joke and kept on running around like he always does," Baynes said Friday. "He just laughed and said 'You're not going to cut my legs,' and kept running around. I didn't think he took offense."

That was about 8 a.m. By noon, the student's mother showed up at school with a police officer to meet with Baynes and the school principal, Scott Johnson.

He apologized, Baynes said, but by Wednesday, he was told to clean out his office.

Baynes 54, retired in 1993 from the U.S. Air Force after nearly 22 years, including four stints at the Grand Forks base. He said he worked at RDO Foods and at two local motels in maintenance before being hired by the school district Jan. 29, 1997. He has been at Wilder since July 29, 1998, a school official said.

He's a widower with three grown daughters and four grandchildren, some of whom attend Wilder.

Petition support

Several parents are raising support for Baynes and collecting signatures on petitions. They say he is well-liked by the students and known as a teaser, said Mary Sand.

"Mike is like their big buddy," said Sand, who has children in kindergarten, second and fifth grades at Wilder. "He's always been there for my kids. He comes over to the house and visits them. Two of my girls have had surgery, and he comes and brings them treats. He's just been a companion for them."

Jody Thompson, assistant superintendent for elementary education in the Grand Forks district, said because it's a confidential personnel matter, he can say little about the reasons for Bayne's dismissal.

"However, we don't terminate employees without cause and without consideration," Thompson said.

The incident involved a comment made by Baynes to the student, and did not involve any physical contact or injury, Thompson said.

Sand said it was nothing more than a failure to communicate.

"It was a miscommunication between a child and an adult," Sand said. "I do believe what happened with Mike was an honest-to-God mistake. Maybe it did scare the kid, but an apology should be enough."

Mandy Carlson, who has a son in Wilder's first grade, also is protesting Baynes' firing.

"I think he got a raw deal," Carlson said. "My son is very saddened. Mike was always the one that greeted them in the morning, always there for them."

Students made cards for Baynes in class, Carlson said. "There have been tears shed over this."

Sand's daughter, Jaclyn, 10, is one of several "junior janitors," Baynes chose to help him at special events.

"After school events, we just stay after and help him clean up," Jaclyn said. "He's kind of been here since I started kindergarten, and he gave us all nicknames and played around with us, and when he left, it's kind of been really boring. When they all found out he was fired, they were all crying in the school."

Mary Sand said, "Mike is a joker, and if your kid looks like he's having a bad time, Mike walks by and hands them candy to buck them up. Everyone of them has a nickname."

But Baynes was told to stop handing out candy and nicknames, Sand said.

Baynes said he knows when to kid a kid, and when not to, but he's not kidding about fighting his firing.

Attorney fund

Baynes signed papers Friday at US Bank for a trust fund set up to raise money for an attorney, he said. So far, there's only about $100 in the account, he said. Next week, he will start looking for a lawyer, he said.

Sand said she and others are meeting with leaders of Wilder's Parent Teacher Organization.

"We want to help with a defense fund, so he can get his job back," Sand said. "We're pretty sure the school board is not going to back down, but he needs to know people are supporting him."

Thompson said he appreciates the concern, but there is little recourse.

"They have a right to call principals and administrators and voice their concerns and their support for an employee and disagree with a decision," Thompson said. "We have talked at length with concerned parents at Wilder and understand their emotions. But at the same time, we feel the proper decision was made."

No appeal policy

Two meetings were held with Baynes over the incident Tuesday, Thompson said.

Baynes, like office employees and other buildings and grounds employees, is an "at will," classified employee, not working under a contract like teachers do, Thompson said. It means there is no appeal policy for Baynes.

According to the school district's policy, all classified employees "may be terminated at any time, with or without cause, upon notice which is reasonable under the circumstances ... The school district recognizes that inappropriate or ineffective employee conduct may require disciplinary action. The school district may utilize any disciplinary method it deems appropriate for any employee, including oral warnings, written warnings, probation, suspension with or without pay, demotion, transfer, termination or other actions deemed appropriate by the school district."

Sand and Carlson said they realize that in recent years, sensitivity over child abuse has heightened everyone's concern. But they say in this case, Baynes is the victim.

Baynes said he's never been in trouble, which made the school visit by a police officer so embarrassing. He received no citation but was told by the police officer it was considered to have been handled internally by the school, Baynes said.

"I have never had a previous incident," Baynes said. In fact, his latest job review came Monday and was all positive, he said.

"All these parents know me. I know a lot of grandparents, and a lot of little brothers and sisters," Baynes said. "It's a small school, and everybody knows everybody."

Background checks are not typically done on custodial employees, a school official said. Security guards are hired only after a criminal background check, and teachers, through the state certification process, undergo background checks, the school official said.


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What a disgrace...as a Wilder alum I find the treatment of this Veteran pathetic.

I sure hope he gets his job back.

1 posted on 5/2/2004, 2:03:45 AM by wallcrawlr
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To: wallcrawlr
I hope he sues the pants off this district and gets a boatload of money.
2 posted on 5/2/2004, 2:13:14 AM by CzarNicky (The problem with bad ideas is that they seemed like good ideas at the time.)
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To: wallcrawlr
Poor judgment...yeah. Kindergartners don't get sarcasm and teasing particularly well...it takes a first grader to really start to "get it" and dish it out and take it.

But firing someone over it...that's a bit extreme. Bet the mom threatened to sue and that's why he lost his job.

Once upon a time when we didn't have kids yet and didn't have a whole lot of patience with them I had a friend over with a passel of toddlers and I had them splashing in some big container on the patio while we talked in the kitchen. My husband came home and put his camera bag on the picnic table and the brats splashed it in their play. He told them if they kept doing it he was going to hold them under till the bubbles stopped. I guess they were in the 3-6 age range? BOY there was a to-do. The mother was upset, and after she got upset, the kids got upset and scared of him....all blown out of proportion, but it was $2800 worth of Air Force property and we couldn't afford to pay for it. The camera bag was $100....

Gotta say though that the only way to make a kid learn to take a little teasing is to tease 'em. If they don't get teased the skin stays awfully thin. We all remember cruel teasing from our childhoods and teasing from adults was about the cruelest in some ways, but imagine being so overprotected you hit middle school totally unprepared....

Can you say IMPLOSION? Or maybe COLUMBINE?
3 posted on 5/2/2004, 2:13:45 AM by Triple Word Score (Meretriciousness Everywhere.)
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To: wallcrawlr
I didn't think people who live in North Dakota have such thin skin as this mommy has. Must make winter very miserable for her.
4 posted on 5/2/2004, 2:16:58 AM by White Eagle
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To: CzarNicky
That is right; he should sue the school.

And he should definitely get a well-known attorney who has made a reputation in this kind of conflict.
5 posted on 5/2/2004, 2:17:02 AM by Tax Government
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To: wallcrawlr
No wonder why kids can't handle growing up and become nobody's. No one is allowed to say boo to kids anymore. Just plain stupidity.
6 posted on 5/2/2004, 2:20:04 AM by codyjacksmom
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To: Triple Word Score
Some people just have no sense of humor, or sense of silliness and the absurd, so their kids are dry, too.

Kidding was a family tradition when I was growing up, and I've carried it on.

I remember the horrified look on a woman's face when, while admiring some alligators at the Phoenix Zoo, I causually asked my daughter Elizabeth, then 5 years old, if she wanted me to lower her into the water! The kid answered in a casual voice "No." She was used to kidding.
7 posted on 5/2/2004, 2:21:49 AM by Jeff Chandler (Why the long face, John?)
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To: wallcrawlr
This was mom's doing, not the boy's. What a humorless shrew.
8 posted on 5/2/2004, 2:22:29 AM by SoDak
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To: wallcrawlr
Why were the police involved, what law was broken?
9 posted on 5/2/2004, 2:24:12 AM by Husker24
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To: wallcrawlr
Witchy mommy.
10 posted on 5/2/2004, 2:27:22 AM by Temple Drake
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To: Jeff Chandler
Same here. Dad used to say he was going to rock us to sleep, "with real rocks." ;-D
11 posted on 5/2/2004, 2:33:42 AM by Judith Anne (HOW ARE WE EVER GOING TO CLEAN UP ALL THIS MESS?)
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To: wallcrawlr
I hate government skoolz
12 posted on 5/2/2004, 2:42:37 AM by GeronL ("We are beyond right and wrong" the scariest words from the radical left.)
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To: wallcrawlr
He shouldn't have teased the child. Teasing stinks.
13 posted on 5/2/2004, 2:44:31 AM by cyborg
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To: GeronL
Sounds to me like mom was more upset. Or needed cash.
14 posted on 5/2/2004, 2:46:23 AM by cyborg
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To: wallcrawlr
The people who fired him are morons. It's obvious from the story that he likes the kids and they like him. There's teasing and teasing, and it's obvious from the story that he is not a bully or mean. Minor misunderstanding at most.
15 posted on 5/2/2004, 2:57:41 AM by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: cyborg
There are different kinds of teasing of course, some mean and some loving.

My grand son comes in from playing on a hot day and asks me for a glass of water, I tell him no. Do you think water just falls out of the sky? You'll drink a soda pop like I had to do when I was a kid! It's teasing because I know what he really wants to drink and it aint water. It's teasing and he thinks I'm the grandest. Where's the harm?

16 posted on 5/2/2004, 2:59:58 AM by Graybeard58
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To: Graybeard58
Between family and friendly teasing in one thing, and if you know someone and teasing won't hurt their feelings that's okay. I just think he was out of place BUT I don't think he should have been fired for it and the mom needs to get a grip. I've had worse said to me in life and never sued.
17 posted on 5/2/2004, 3:03:06 AM by cyborg
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To: Judith Anne
Let's see. Slow eating got us, "Do you want it orally or rectally?" If we mentioned we might take showers, he'd say, "Smells like a good idea." My dad had a kind of cutting quip for all occasions, and we definitely hit middle school prepared to be teased and to tease back.

Yes, but we're in danger here of getting into "We walked to school uphill both ways in the snow and we liked it!" competition, which is always GREAT fun. "My Dad used to feed us hominy grits with no sugar or butter and we were grateful!" "Yeah, my dad wouldn't cook it first." "My dad wouldn't buy it first--had us pretend to eat it after he pretended to cook it--and we were grateful!" "My dad would talk about food but never brought any home, and we were grateful just to have the conversation...."

It can go on all night if people really try....

I gotta cop out and get some sleep, alas.
18 posted on 5/2/2004, 3:05:22 AM by Triple Word Score (Meretriciousness Everywhere.)
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To: Triple Word Score
Night, kiddo. ;-D
19 posted on 5/2/2004, 3:14:14 AM by Judith Anne (HOW ARE WE EVER GOING TO CLEAN UP ALL THIS MESS?)
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To: Triple Word Score
I had to eat rocks and lived in a shoebox and was lucky for the rocks.
20 posted on 5/2/2004, 3:19:31 AM by Atchafalaya
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