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Not Your Grandfather's Rifle (Joyce Foundation - Big money gun grabbers)
Join Together ^ | 5-21-04

Posted on 05/23/2004 10:51:56 PM PDT by Dan from Michigan

Not Your Grandfather's Rifle
5/21/2004

Feature Story
from the Joyce Foundation Newsletter

Unless Congress acts, the ban on military-style assault weapons will expire this September. But there's still time to strengthen protections against these dangerous weapons.

Ten years ago, Congress banned sale of AK-47s, Uzis, and other military-style assault weapons from the civilian market. Legislators reasoned that such weapons -- designed to accept a high-capacity ammunition magazine, with grips and other features enabling the shooter to spray an area with bullets -- had no legitimate sporting purpose and were too dangerous for civilian use. Law enforcement groups reported that criminals armed with assault weapons were outgunning the police. A more recent study by the Violence Policy Center shows that 20 percent of police killed in the line of duty between 1998 and 2001 fell victim to assault weapons.

Gun makers bitterly fought the 1994 ban. But over the years they have found simple ways to modify their guns to evade the provisions of the law. Now, even that flimsy protection may disappear. The assault weapons ban expires this September, and the House of Representatives seems poised to let it die without bringing the matter to a vote.

The Senate is on record as favoring the ban. In a complicated set of votes in early March, senators tacked extension of the assault weapons ban and another gun control measure onto a bill that would exempt gun manufacturers from civilian lawsuits. But the bill's sponsor objected to the amendments and killed the entire measure.

So it's back to square one for law enforcement, medical, and citizen groups who want the public to understand why it's so important to extend the ban and make it more difficult to evade. Members of Physicians for Social Responsibility, with support from a $100,000 Joyce grant, are getting the word out that the ban is in danger of expiring. The group is organizing events on the 13th of each month, leading up to the September 13 expiration date, to keep the issue before the minds of lawmakers and the public.

Another group, Doctors Against Handgun Injury, won a resolution from the American Medical Association urging that the ban be renewed and strengthened, and secured support for a strong ban from 11 other national medical societies, including the American Academy of Pediatrics, the American College of Physicians, and the American College of Surgeons.

At the state level, Iowans for the Prevention of Gun Violence is collecting endorsements from police chiefs and holding press conferences to help the public and legislators understand what's at stake and why the ban needs to be strengthened. Supporting the work is a two-year, $250,000 Joyce grant. Says John Johnson, the group's head: "We're doing everything we can to increase awareness in the media and among the general public that the ban will expire in September, that the current law hasn't worked the way it was intended to, and that Congress needs to renew and strengthen the ban."

The Illinois Council Against Handgun Violence is organizing as well. The Council's head, Thom Mannard, cites polls in Illinois and nationally showing strong public support for keeping assault weapons off the street, including a November 2003 NBC/Wall Street Journal finding that 78 percent of Americans support the ban. A survey released in April by the child advocacy group Voices for Illinois Children found that 72-75 percent of Illinois voters favor extending the ban and strengthening its provisions.

Like their counterparts in Iowa, Illinois law enforcement groups such as the Fraternal Order of Police and the Illinois Association of Chiefs of Police have called for extending and strengthening the ban. The On-Target Coalition, organized by the Council, brings together law enforcement, medical, religious, and other groups, all of whom are getting the message out about the need to strengthen protections to keep military-style assault weapons off the streets.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: bang; banglist
I wish I could toss $250 K like that.............
1 posted on 05/23/2004 10:51:57 PM PDT by Dan from Michigan
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To: *bang_list

Boom


2 posted on 05/23/2004 10:52:12 PM PDT by Dan from Michigan ("Today we did what we had to do. They counted on America being passive. They were wrong. - Reagan)
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To: Dan from Michigan

All of this AWB talk is screwing up my buying habits. I need some new mags for the Glock, but I can definitely wait for September if it means that hi-cap mags will be back and available at a reasonable price. Decisions, decisions.


3 posted on 05/23/2004 10:57:25 PM PDT by July 4th (You need to click "Abstimmen")
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To: Dan from Michigan

'Ten years ago, Congress banned sale of AK-47s, Uzis, and other military-style assault weapons from the civilian market'

Well that will come as a shock to all the gun dealers in America who've been selling them. I guess the SAR family doesn't exist.


4 posted on 05/23/2004 11:00:52 PM PDT by Bogey78O (I voted for this tagline... before I voted against it.)
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To: Dan from Michigan
Ten years ago, Congress banned sale of AK-47s, Uzis, and other military-style assault weapons from the civilian market

Already they start the disinformational lies to the sheeple.

Stay Safe Dan....

5 posted on 05/23/2004 11:02:53 PM PDT by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet.)
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To: Dan from Michigan

'Legislators reasoned that such weapons -- designed to accept a high-capacity ammunition magazine, with grips and other features enabling the shooter to spray an area with bullets'

HAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHA!!!! LOL Yes, grips and mags allow bullets to be sprayed.

You have to not know anything about firearms to buy into the VPC's argument.


6 posted on 05/23/2004 11:03:38 PM PDT by Bogey78O (I voted for this tagline... before I voted against it.)
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To: Dan from Michigan
They must have one of those hi-cap assault keyboards with "spray grips", because the bull sure is flying!

Molon Labe!

7 posted on 05/23/2004 11:03:48 PM PDT by TERMINATTOR ("In my opinion, the M1 Rifle is the greatest battle implement ever devised." -General Patton)
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To: Dan from Michigan

Is it just me or are the Gun Grabbing Democrats under the delusion this is a winning issue for them? This is a looser for them, it will always be a looser.

The more they howl and yell about the expiration the more they votes they loose.

Bush will not budge on this for fear of creating the stay home conservatives.

So this puts us back to why do they think this is a winner?


8 posted on 05/23/2004 11:42:56 PM PDT by longtermmemmory (Vote!)
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To: Squantos
My so called "arsenal" is safe, well prepared, and totally legal....

MOLOM LABE!

9 posted on 05/23/2004 11:44:27 PM PDT by JDoutrider
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To: JDoutrider


I prefer "...my gun lobby..."

Then there is "...my gun den..."

"...my gun parlor..."

Etc.



10 posted on 05/23/2004 11:53:42 PM PDT by devolve (````````````````` [..........................Hello from Sunny South Florida.........................)
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To: JDoutrider; Mulder; Eaker; TexasCowboy; Travis McGee; SLB; Joe Brower; *bang_list
Wonder what these sorts would do up against a "knowledgeable" firearms owner one on one on say FOX Nooooze when these POS Socialists are allowed to rant about how much safer they are with AWB and how blood in the streets will flow again if AWB sunsets yada yada etc.....

And then it is brought to alls attention that the firearms they do rant about have been among us in a grandfathered mode and new in manufacture and sales sans a flash supressor and a bayonet lug and NEW magazines holding more than 10 rounds.

As we all know we can go and purchase a pre-ban military look alike sporter any day of the week legally , over the counter within the current laws , rules and guidelines of pretty much every state in the union cept parts of the coastal regions.

Now those facts , truths and current laws and BS fees and wait periods have had no bearing on the crime rate at all .....up or down IMO. The rant from the grabbers screams, panics and lies to the chickenlittle crowds and IMHO "created" a lot of the "skoul" shootings which seem to pretty much stay in check till the socialists need them to push an agenda.

Kinda like the one coming up on 9-13..........Guard yer children as the socialist are selling fear again my friends. Rats'n Rinos have deemed it dying time again.

Stay Safe !

11 posted on 05/24/2004 12:05:49 AM PDT by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet.)
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To: PoorMuttly; B4Ranch; Long Cut

#11 ping ........Stay Safe !


12 posted on 05/24/2004 12:12:22 AM PDT by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet.)
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To: Dan from Michigan; All
Ironic, isn't it, that Physicians (...who cause SO many, many more deaths each year than gun owners) seem to be so vocally, rabidly, anti-Second Amendment...???

Is this some sort of attention-deflecting 'red-herring' tactic for them...?

This article may amaze you... It SHOULD scare you.

Why Doctors Are 9,000 Times More Likely to Accidentally Kill You Than Gun Owners

A widely publicized report saying that as many as 98,000 people die each year in the United States from medical errors is conservative, and the number is probably much larger than that. The estimate by the Institute of Medicine (IOM) is low because it looked only at deaths of patients at hospitals. The Institute is a private, nonprofit organization that provides health policy advice under a congressional charter to the National Academy of Sciences. Janet M. Corrigan is the IOM's director of health care services. The Institute is a private, nonprofit organization that provides health policy advice under a congressional charter to the National Academy of Sciences. She told reporters at a Capitol Hill briefing May 8 that the study did not look at medical-error deaths at nursing homes, emergency rooms or in doctors' offices. The mortality estimates are low also because most of the information was based on medical record reviews. Medical errors are a problem that has been hidden from the public for far to long.

Number of physicians in the US = 700,000

Accidental deaths caused by physicians per year = 120,000

Accidental deaths per physician = 0.171

Number of gun owners in the US = 80,000,000

Number of accidental gun deaths per year (all age groups) = 1,500

Accidental deaths per gun owner = 0.0000188

Therefore, doctors are approximately 9,000 times more dangerous than gun owners.

...

...Source: http://www.happyherbalist.com/guns_vs_doctors.htm

13 posted on 05/24/2004 1:57:07 AM PDT by Seadog Bytes ("Benedict Arnold was also a hero....before he became a traitor.")
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To: Squantos; AAABEST; sit-rep

The liberals continually keep pecking away at freedoms. They are there with gun bills, excessive taxes, limiting purchases of toilet paper at stores (don't want teenagers papering the teacher) and the environmentalist wackos are going to get an infusion of strength with the opening of "The Day After Tomorrow" next weekend. I am afraid this is going to be a long, hot summer.

I put my "Vietnam Veterans Against John Kerry" sticker on one of the Suburbans this weekend, sure hope folks start opening their eyes.


14 posted on 05/24/2004 3:02:18 AM PDT by SLB ("We must lay before Him what is in us, not what ought to be in us." C. S. Lewis)
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To: Dan from Michigan
Beginning of paragraph:

Ten years ago, Congress banned sale of AK-47s, Uzis, and other military-style assault weapons from the civilian market.

End of same paragraph:

A more recent study by the Violence Policy Center shows that 20 percent of police killed in the line of duty between 1998 and 2001 fell victim to assault weapons.

If true, which I doubt, it appears the law ain't workin' anyway.

15 posted on 05/24/2004 3:57:45 AM PDT by metesky (You will be diverse, just like us.)
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To: All; SLB; Squantos
Joyce Foundation = http://www.joycefdn.org/ = UN/NGO

THE JOYCE FOUNDATION was established in 1948 by Beatrice Joyce Kean of Chicago. The Joyce family wealth came from the lumber industry (Tremont Lumber Company), including family-owned timberlands, plywood and sawmills, and wholesale and retail building material distribution facilities which were located in the state of Louisiana and the Midwest.

Projects: The foundation emphasizes environmental, campaign-reform, and gun control issues, with education and culture programs.

02/08/02 NEWS RELEASE Center files complaint with IRS against Environmental Working Group Group calls on IRS to revoke non-profit status for unlawful lobbying and political action. Joyce Foundation grant is a material factor in EWG's unlawful lobbying.

___________________________________________

Joyce Foundation News Letter

Lawmakers Wait for Bush Cue on Ban

U.S. lawmakers are being cautious about renewing the federal assault-weapons ban that expires in September, and some may be worried about jeopardizing their political contributions, the Houston Chronicle reported May 17.

According to the Center for Responsive Politics, in the 2000 election gun-rights groups contributed $4 million to candidates, 88 percent of whom were Republicans. In addition, the National Rifle Association (NRA) spent $16 million in 2000 on contributions and other campaign activities, including television commercials, billboards, and member mailings.

In comparison, gun-control groups donated about $500,000, mostly to Democrats.

The NRA has already announced that it will not make any political endorsements until after the date that the ban is set to expire. "Of course, we're watching to see how this issue is handled on Capitol Hill," said Chris Cox, the NRA's chief lobbyist.

Lawmakers are waiting to see whether President Bush presses for the ban's renewal. Bush supported the ban during the last presidential campaign, but has been silent on the matter since.

U.S. House of Representatives Majority Leader Tom DeLay (R-Texas), a gun-control opponent, said without a push from Bush, "the votes are not there in the House to pass the bill."

He said that House Republicans would likely let the measure expire. However, moderate Republicans may press for the ban's passage, which has the support of the U.S. Senate.

Gun-control advocates said Bush is staying in the middle of the road on the issue by rhetorically supporting the ban to appeal to moderates, while maintaining the support of Republicans by allowing the House to kill the measure.

"He is telling the American people he is with them on this issue, but with a wink and a nod," said Eric Howard, a spokesman for the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence.

___________________________________________

"Legislators reasoned"

Impossible! A statesman would know how to reason, but we haven't had one in our government for fifty years. Now we have deceitful legislators who are working against our Constitution with their prime concern of being re-elected.

___________________________________________

Until "we" get off of our dead butts and demand that the elected officials, from the President on down start to follow every word in their Oath of Office, we are gonna pay for this inaction.

Having a republican President who is acting more like a damn socialist than a conservative isn't going to do us any good whatsoever!

I do not understand how any American can support Bush or Kerry. Both of them are working for the new world order, as are both political parties.

If you disagree with this opinion then simply tell me why one party is not screaming 24 hrs a day that America needs to get out of the UN, the prime promoter of the NWO.

16 posted on 05/24/2004 4:36:17 AM PDT by B4Ranch ( "Lady, I only speak two languages, English and Bad English!" - Corbin Dallas "The Fifth Element")
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To: Squantos
Facts that are keeping governments under control!

There are an estimated 100-500 million small arms and light weapons in circulation in the world, with 50-80 million being AK-47 assault weapons. This is an estimated one small arm for every twelfth person.

Source: U.S. Department of State (2001). Bureau of Political-Military Affairs. Background Paper: Can Small Arms and Light Weapons Be Controlled? June 2, 2001.

Related Facts

The largest producers and exporters of small arms are China, Russia, and the United States.

Source: Center for Global Security and Health (2002) Small Arms and Light Weapons: The Basic Facts. April, 2002.

The United States and Russia account for 70% of all new arms made each year. (HURRAH! Lets keep them on their toes)

Source: Graduate Institute of International Studies (2003). www.smallarmssurvey.org, 2003 Small Arms Survey: Development

17 posted on 05/24/2004 4:45:21 AM PDT by B4Ranch ( "Lady, I only speak two languages, English and Bad English!" - Corbin Dallas "The Fifth Element")
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To: metesky
>>police killed in the line of duty <<

Are these numbers included?

" We've had about 300 Iraqi police killed in the line of duty since the restarting of the Iraqi police service -- and those numbers of going up of late,"

Depressing News:
Decline of the Violence Policy Center
Aw shucks! I am so torn to hear that facts are winning the war on weapons.

/sarcasm

18 posted on 05/24/2004 4:57:38 AM PDT by B4Ranch ( "Either fight for your Rights or lose them!)
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To: Dan from Michigan
The Clinton Gun Ban sunsets exactly sixteen weeks from today. Expect the gun-grabbers to get more and more shrill between now and then.

Meanwhile, we need to keep the pressure on not just our legislators, but on the RNC as well. With Bush's poll numbers reportedly slipping, the last thing the RNC leaders want to hear is that gun owners will stay home on election day if the Clinton Gun Ban doesn't sunset on schedule. Write to the RNC as well as your legislators. They need to hear from gun owners.

19 posted on 05/24/2004 5:27:39 AM PDT by gieriscm (The AW ban sunsets on 09/13/2004)
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To: Dan from Michigan

NRA Anti-AWB Website

SUNSET THE AW BAN

20 posted on 05/24/2004 6:18:19 AM PDT by xsrdx (Diligentia, Vis, Celeritas)
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To: Dan from Michigan

""We're doing everything we can to increase awareness in the media and among the general public that the ban will expire in September, that the current law hasn't worked the way it was intended to, and that Congress needs to renew and strengthen the ban." "

In other words, it failed but they're damned and determined to try it again. Just like every single time socialist policies come up.


21 posted on 05/24/2004 6:23:55 AM PDT by Monty22
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To: July 4th

"All of this AWB talk is screwing up my buying habits. I need some new mags for the Glock, but I can definitely wait for September if it means that hi-cap mags will be back and available at a reasonable price. Decisions, decisions."

If the ban is extended, watch the prices skyrocket hardcore.


22 posted on 05/24/2004 6:24:55 AM PDT by Monty22
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To: Squantos; B4Ranch
Where does the "Joyce Foundation" get their operating money?

My guess is George Soros, who believes only governments should own guns.


23 posted on 05/24/2004 6:43:08 AM PDT by Travis McGee (----- www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com -----)
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To: Travis McGee

THE JOYCE FOUNDATION was established in 1948 by Beatrice Joyce Kean of Chicago. The Joyce family wealth came from the lumber industry (Tremont Lumber Company), including family-owned timberlands, plywood and sawmills, and wholesale and retail building material distribution facilities which were located in the state of Louisiana and the Midwest.

Projects: The foundation emphasizes environmental, campaign-reform, and gun control issues, with education and culture programs.


24 posted on 05/24/2004 7:21:12 AM PDT by B4Ranch ( "Either fight for your Rights or lose them!)
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To: Squantos

BTTT !! Post # 11

This is clearly and demonstrably true.


25 posted on 05/24/2004 7:27:56 AM PDT by PoorMuttly (Cud. The other green meat.)
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To: Dan from Michigan
Ten years ago, Congress banned sale of AK-47s, Uzis, and other military-style assault weapons from the civilian market.

Well, no they didn't. They ban the manufacture of certain rifles and ammo magazines, but the law didn't take a single gun off the streets. And guns nearly identical to the banned ones have been for sale all the while.

If crime with "assault weapons" is down, it certainly has nothing to do with the ban.

26 posted on 05/24/2004 8:31:09 AM PDT by MileHi (The ballot box is corrupt, the soap box spews leftist propaganda, that leaves....)
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To: Dan from Michigan

I'm not interested in a rifle that has legitimate sporting uses. I want a weapon that is equal or better in firepower to what I may be up against in a home invasion, or a few other senarios I can think of.
I don't hunt, I just see a breakdown in this country of law and order, and the lack of raising kids to be law abiding citizens (thank you liberals). I'd rather be judged by 12 then carried by 6.
I can understand the police concern about having to confront semi-auto weapons, but that doesn't give them a right to go around my 2nd amendment rights. They won't be able to protect me the moment I need it. The supreme court has said they have no responsibility to do so either. My safety rests with me, and no one else.


27 posted on 05/24/2004 8:39:51 AM PDT by ampat (to)
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To: ampat
I'm not interested in a rifle that has legitimate sporting uses...

I could not have said it better.

28 posted on 05/24/2004 10:24:06 AM PDT by nonsporting
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To: Dan from Michigan
The Senate is on record as favoring the ban. In a complicated set of votes in early March, senators tacked extension of the assault weapons ban and another gun control measure onto a bill that would exempt gun manufacturers from civilian lawsuits. But the bill's sponsor objected to the amendments and killed the entire measure.

well... that is certainly ONE way to summarize that contentious session. Has about as much to do with reality as Clinton does with virtue. Some Senators tacking on a rider does not equate to The (WHOLE) Senate endorsing the AWB... not even close.

29 posted on 05/24/2004 11:37:29 AM PDT by King Prout (the difference between "trained intellect" and "indoctrinated intellectual" is an Abyssal gulf)
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To: B4Ranch

Thanks. Home grown lefties.


30 posted on 05/24/2004 2:34:39 PM PDT by Travis McGee (----- www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com -----)
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To: Squantos
Kinda like the one coming up on 9-13..........Guard yer children as the socialist are selling fear again my friends. Rats'n Rinos have deemed it dying time again.

They know most Americans are waking up, and are opposed to gun control, so they have to resort to outright lies in the hopes of advancing their seditious agenda.

However, none of the elites in either party like us peasants having guns, so I suspect that they will try to slip the AWB ban through before September.

If they fail at that effort, they will likely do so after the election if Bush loses or if the RATS regain one of both houses of Congress.

Folks need to prepare themselves financially to buy up some stuff between September and November, if the ban does expire.

And they need to prepare themselves mentally just in case the rats and rinos pass something far worse than the AWB after the elections.

31 posted on 05/24/2004 7:46:59 PM PDT by Mulder (Fight the future)
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To: Dan from Michigan
I don't know that my either of my grandfathers had centerfire rifles, but since I'm old enough to be a grandfather myself (but am not..yet), I'll just say that this was my father's rifle:

And this is my rifle (well one of them :)) :

Although mine has a slightly different receiver and is fitted with a telescopic sight, which I guess makes it an evil assault sniper rifle. :)

32 posted on 05/24/2004 9:49:14 PM PDT by El Gato (Federal Judges can twist the Constitution into anything.. Or so they think.)
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To: July 4th
I need some new mags for the Glock, but I can definitely wait for September if it means that hi-cap mags will be back

Go ahead, if you really need them. When the ban expires (confidence, confidence), there will be a glut of Glock mag springs and followers to create normal-capacity magazines from the current crop of restricted mags on sale now. ;)

33 posted on 05/25/2004 3:34:36 PM PDT by kAcknor (That's my version of it anyway....)
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