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To: ahayes
I suppose you'd say they shouldn't be found guilty for the brutal two hour murder since you think they were drunk at the time?

The murder was a crime of passion. Premeditated but still the result of rage.

I will not play these sematics games with you. You know that this man designed his own death trap by toying with what homosexuals call "rough trade". This is not the only incident where this type of thing occurs. Labelling it a "hate crime" is a fallicy. It speaks nothing of the "hate" that the homosexual community has for heterosexuals by which they feel "I'll show them, I can get them off."

It is a sexual violation which is RAPE.

59 posted on 05/27/2004 5:11:16 PM PDT by weegee (NO BLOOD FOR RATINGS. CNN ignored torture & murder in Saddam's Iraq to keep their Baghdad Bureau.)
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To: weegee

Pschaw. As I said, it's only rape if "gee, I wish I hadn't done that" date rape is rape. By law it is only rape if a sex act is committed against a person's consent by threatening force towards them or someone else or taking advantage of their unconsciousness or inebriation. Impersonating someone of the opposite sex to do a sex act does not constitute rape (unless, in some states, the minor successfully impersonated the men's wives). There is no evidence that any of these men were not able to give consent at the time of the sex act. True, if they had possession of all of the facts, they would not have given consent, but legally that doesn't constitute rape.

As I said, it was wrong, dangerous, and stupid to lie. But on the flip side it was very wrong for these men to collaborate in killing him. Definitely something like that would cause extreme anger and humiliation, but a *real man* would accept his share of responsibility and realize maybe his sexual practices need reconsidering if he can accept sexual favors from someone and not even be sure of their sex. Instead, these scum committed a brutal murder. I would be more inclined to be sympathetic if it were a sudden thing. But they initially were laughing about it, and then got slowly more angry, and ended up beating the boy for two hours. This isn't something where the disclosure caused a sudden rage and one of them stabbed or shot the transvestite immediately after finding out, causing sudden death. Any person capable of a drawn-out deliberate murder like that is capable of equally horrible things that perhaps would garner more of your sympathy, like beating to death a cheating girlfriend or a granny too slow handing over her purse, for instance.

I never called it a hate crime. I know this was a personal thing. I think hate crime legislation is an attempt at mind control, and makes some crimes more severe depending on who they are directed at. While motive can be a consideration, most of the time it shouldn't affect the charges. This was a cold-blooded premeditated murder, and the killers should be executed.


65 posted on 05/27/2004 9:32:50 PM PDT by ahayes
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