Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

S.F.proposes limited non-citizen voting
Washington Times ^ | June 21, 2004 | UPI

Posted on 06/21/2004 4:51:14 PM PDT by Nachum

Edited on 07/12/2004 4:16:44 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]

San Francisco, CA, Jun. 21 (UPI) -- A plan is being considered that allow non-citizens, including illegal immigrants, to vote in San Francisco school board elections.

The San Jose Mercury News said Monday the proposed November ballot measure was aimed at getting more parents involved in their children's education by waiving California's requirement that voters be U.S. citizens.


(Excerpt) Read more at washtimes.com ...


TOPICS: Government; News/Current Events; US: California
KEYWORDS: aliens; alienvote; limited; noncitizen; proposes; sf; voting
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-6061-8081-95 next last
To: Psycho_Bunny

Did you have the same reaction when similar laws were enacted in New York, Chicago, and Maryland?


41 posted on 06/21/2004 6:26:24 PM PDT by Xenalyte (This dog bite me.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Nachum

Ego problems much? You agreed below they pay taxes both sales and property. They're paying their share and if they ARE illegals using bogus social security numbers they're leaving behind BILLIONS UPON BILLIONS of social security funds which will NEVER EVER BE COLLECTED.

That's an enforcement problem. Want more enforcement, raise taxes and hire more imigration officials. And what about the ones here legaly, in all this imigrant bashing nobody bothers with that pesky little question.

Proof please. Links and all that rot. Because the way I see it, if every illegal in california went home right now your garbage would rot in the street, your produce would rot in the fields, your sewer lines wouldn't get dug, and you wouldn't enjoy the full protection offered by all those fine imigrants in the US armed forces, and all the crappy horrible jobs you're just way to good for would cease to function and so would California. And lets not even go into the comming social security and medicare crisis where all those baby boomers are going to want their social security and medicare paid by the few children they were so kind as to bestow on the world (overpopulation and all).

I agree, vote for more border patrol agents and INS agents and when the economy starts to collapse vote to allow more in.

No but it does say "Do unto others as you would have done unto you" and all sorts of other really wonderful things that apply wonderfully to this particular issue, you really should take a read sometime.

42 posted on 06/21/2004 6:31:13 PM PDT by pcx99
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 39 | View Replies]

To: Carry_Okie
Careful now don't wanna prove what all those liberals say about conservatives right.

Oh this is a gem. Where do you get that education is free huh? Even if they take the kids out of public school and pay to put them in private school because the liberals don't allow school vouchers they still get to pay public school taxes through their sales tax and property tax (through rent).

43 posted on 06/21/2004 6:33:38 PM PDT by pcx99
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 40 | View Replies]

To: ridesthemiles
Are they going to print up special ballots which ONLY have the "School Board" candidates on them? Another waste of the taxpayer money. And the cost of counting them separately.

Maybe that'll be the supposed intent, but recall the March primary election errors in Orange and San Diego Counties, where many people voted incorrectly (wrong ballots, wrong candidates, wrong measures; one district reported more votes than registered voters). As long as the votes are cast, even if they are cast in error by people ineligible to vote for those measures or candidates, the votes count.

In a close election, a pollworker could influence the outcome by simply "accidentally" giving a normal/full ballot to a noncitizen special "voter."

44 posted on 06/21/2004 6:34:07 PM PDT by heleny
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: pcx99
Actually not that bad.

It is if it in any way involves how taxpayer money is to be spent. The illegals have no right at all in determining how money they don't contribute into gets spent.

45 posted on 06/21/2004 6:34:15 PM PDT by FITZ
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: FITZ

The inverse of your reasoning would be, if illegals DO pay taxes, they should have a say in where the money goes. GOTCHA!!!


46 posted on 06/21/2004 6:35:51 PM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives On In My Heart Forever)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 45 | View Replies]

To: Xenalyte
No.  This is the first I've encountered the issue of non-citizens being considered for/granted a right to vote in Civil matters.

lol....."BATTLE ON, XENA!" heheh

47 posted on 06/21/2004 6:37:16 PM PDT by Psycho_Bunny
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]

To: FITZ

Property tax (if through rent), sales tax, gas tax, income tax (unless the employer is breaking the law), social security tax (unless the employer is breaking the law), medicare tax (unless the employer is breaking the law). If they are here they are contributing even if you chose to ignore the fact.

48 posted on 06/21/2004 6:39:24 PM PDT by pcx99
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 45 | View Replies]

To: pcx99
pay taxes both sales and property

Not necessarily. If the people actually file taxes, California provides a renters' credit to offset the property taxes that renters pay indirectly through rent payments.

California provides many benefits to low income people. Illegal aliens claim those benefits disproportionately, since CA offers many of the benefits without regard to immigration status. Education is one social service that the feds require CA to provide to illegal aliens, but CA has its own share of blame for luring illegal aliens with many other social benefits.

Illegal aliens with more money usually try to normalize their status (through several past amnesties or amnesty-like programs) and be right with the law. The rest are in violation of our laws.

49 posted on 06/21/2004 6:43:23 PM PDT by heleny
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: pcx99
So long as the parents are forced to send their children to school, so long as they live in the school district (and unless they live on the streets) and pay taxes even if indirectly through a landlord then really it's not right and it's not RIGHT to expect them not to have a say in the education that's being forced upon their kids.

What if the parents are felons who have served their time?

What if a parent is dead but used to really care about his child's future education?

50 posted on 06/21/2004 6:47:59 PM PDT by heleny
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 34 | View Replies]

To: heleny
At last! A sensible argument :) I didn't know about the rebate (I live in Texas, similar situation but less explosive than it apparently is in california). Even still, they will be paying taxes through sales and wire and income and medicare. Since I don't know the legality of filing a california return as an illegal immigrant I won't comment on that.

But even if an illegal alien knows the tax code well enough to file for the renters credit (and in my book anyone who can figure out a tax form is probably smart enough to be a great citizen) they're still contributing their fair share of taxes through other forms of taxation (sales tax, income tax, medicare, social security (last 3 unless employer is breaking the law), phone taxes especially on international calls, even those who support friends and relatives back home get hit with wire transfer taxes and fees.

The government is remarkably good at soaking, I think on that we can all agree :)

51 posted on 06/21/2004 6:49:35 PM PDT by pcx99
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 49 | View Replies]

To: pcx99
if every illegal in california went home right now your garbage would rot in the street, your produce would rot in the fields, your sewer lines wouldn't get dug

Sure ---- their own country doesn't want them, doesn't see them as necessary to get all that done --- and this country had sewers dug and regular garbage pickup long before Mexicans ever heard of any of that.

52 posted on 06/21/2004 6:52:22 PM PDT by FITZ
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: pcx99
Careful now don't wanna prove what all those liberals say about conservatives right.

And just what would that be?

Where do you get that education is free huh? Even if they take the kids out of public school and pay to put them in private school because the liberals don't allow school vouchers they still get to pay public school taxes through their sales tax and property tax (through rent).

It's the same in every country in the world, except for the tax rate and the fact that it's easier to become a citizen here than just about anywhere. If immigrants and legal residents don't find that attractive, they are likely not to stay long enough to participate in public schools even if they could vote. If they are committed to America they'll become citizens. There's nothing wrong with that.

Meanwhile, some immigrants still have the right to vote in their home countries by absentee ballot. Nobody is robbing them of their rights.

53 posted on 06/21/2004 6:52:35 PM PDT by Carry_Okie (There are people in power who are truly evil.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 43 | View Replies]

To: heleny

Some states already allow this. I see no problem with it. Not like he's going to be voting on laws only on the people who are going to be teaching his kid.

If the parent is able to enter the voting booth and cast a vote of their own violition then I'd have to say sure. Then I would be wondering if Jesus finally decided to make another housecall.

54 posted on 06/21/2004 6:52:47 PM PDT by pcx99
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 50 | View Replies]

To: goldstategop

Not really because they flaunt the laws. Why on earth are people actually obeying our laws on immigration, filling out papers and waiting for years when lawbreakers are so heavily rewarded?


55 posted on 06/21/2004 6:53:25 PM PDT by FITZ
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 46 | View Replies]

To: Nachum
S.F.proposes limited non-citizen voting

Limited? Right.

Watch this open the door for more proposals for these non-citizens to be given the vote on other things besides school boards, like local elections.

56 posted on 06/21/2004 6:53:28 PM PDT by lowbridge ("You are an American. You are my brother. I would die for you." -Kurdish Sergeant)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

Comment #57 Removed by Moderator

To: FITZ

Most of us believe in obeying the law. You should direct your question to the people who want to make life easier for illegal aliens.


58 posted on 06/21/2004 6:56:36 PM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives On In My Heart Forever)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 55 | View Replies]

To: pcx99
If they are here they are contributing even if you chose to ignore the fact.

If they live in government subsidized housing --- which they very often do -- and with several families in a one family apartment, and they aren't paying health insurance premiums (how many bother to do that???), and they aren't paying their own school tuition, they are not contributing. If they collect food stamps and welfare checks, have unpaid hospital and doctor bills they certainly are not contributing.

59 posted on 06/21/2004 6:57:53 PM PDT by FITZ
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 48 | View Replies]

To: Carry_Okie

That we're a bunch of goosestepping racists. And there is that element within the conservative branch just as there is an element that blows up hummer dealerships in the left so both sides have their loons. But there's no need to feed them.

Problem with that is we're not every country in the world the is the US, the pinacle of freedom -- that to which others aspire and dream. I've got no desire to be every other country that's germany (lets kill a few jews, zeig heil!), that's Saudi Arabia (lets kill a few jews, allah willing), that's FRANCE ( do you really need an example? ).

And while they are in the process of becomming citizens or are in this country legally they should have every right to ensure they have a voice in their children's education and if they do not have this they should be rebated the taxes they pay. Since they are not rebated the taxes they pay they should have their voice.

You are.

60 posted on 06/21/2004 6:58:22 PM PDT by pcx99
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 53 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-6061-8081-95 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson