Posted on 09/04/2004 9:03:30 AM PDT by ArcLight
...unless I see Muslims marching in the streets to denounce this horror, I'm giving up on the lot of them. No Jew, no Christian would ever tolerate or excuse this atrocity. Where are the Muslims? Not just leaders, but ordinary men and women? Why aren't they protesting all over the Islamic world? Why not in America?
I'm sick of pretending to myself that most Muslims are good people, while seeing so little evidence of it. If they really are, they'll step up. Right now.
AMEN, Arc.
Don't hold your breath. Will be a very, very long wait!
Every comment I've seen so far from Muslims blames this atrocity on someone else, so I don't personally hold out much hope.
TERRORISM IN THE QUR'AN
Muhammad taught his followers to oppress or kill non-Muslims. Generally, Jews and Christians were allowed to live as such, provided they paid a special tax. This tax is Jizya, a tax revenue given to the Muslims to make up for revenues they lost from no longer dealing in pagan activities. If the Jews and Christians refused to pay this extortion tax they would have to convert to Islam or be killed. Non-Jews and non-Christians, such as idolaters or pagans, had to convert to Islam or be killed. Generally they didn't have the option of paying the tax. Here is the verse that teaches Muslims to oppress Jews and Christians:
"Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in the latter day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Apostle have prohibited, nor follow the religion of truth, (which is Islam that abolishes all other religions ) of the people of the Book, (meaning the Jews and the Christians ) until they pay the Jizya (the tax imposed upon them) with willing submission and feel themselves subdued . (with humiliation and submission to the government of Islam.) 9:29."
(Commentary in parenthesis is from the Tafsir Al-Jalalein. i.e., Al-Jalalein’s Interpretation of the Koran.)
The order to subjugate or kill Christians and Jews is in that verse. It is clear that Muhammad ordered his followers to fight those Christians and Jews to convert them or pay the Jizya, and if they didn't convert or pay, do you think that he told the followers to let them go in peace? It is very clear: convert, pay with submission, or die. The background for this is found in "The Life of Muhammad", op cit, page 620,
"until they [the Jews and Christians] pay the poll tax out of hand being humbled", i.e. as a compensation for what you fear to lose by the closing of the markets. God gave them compensation for what He cut off from them in their former polytheism by what He gave them by way of poll tax from the people of scripture."
Muhammad told his followers to attack the Jews and Christians. If they humble themselves and submit to the Muslims, but choose to remain Christian or Jewish, then they had to pay the Muslims. Again, as Muhammad's circumstances changed, Allah changed. Now Muhammad was an extortionist. Also note that the tax levied upon the Christians and Jews was not to support the state in general affairs, it was to compensate the Muslims. Muhammad was exactly like Mafia crime boss, making others pay for "protection," except it was Christians and Jews who really needed protection from the Muslims! Here is the verse in the Qur'an that teaches Muslims to attack and kill pagans:
"When the sacred months are over, slay the idolaters wherever you find them. Arrest them, besiege them, and lie in ambush everywhere for them. If they repent and take to prayer and render the alms levy, allow them to go their way. God is forgiving and merciful." Sura 9:5
The background for this verse is found in "The Life of Muhammad", op cit, page 617-619. Please note that my comments are in [ ] type brackets, and that it is a very long passage, so I have only quoted a portion of it:
Your post just stuck me.....
If this terrible act had been done in the namn of Christianity, wouldn't Christian leaders and organizations be clamoring to make it heard very vocally that they and normal Christians whole-heartedly denounce such acts of terrorism?
I've never believed islam was anything but a cult of death and destruction. The world must be rid of this scourge and Mecca/Medina must be destroyed. This is World War III and if we don't treat islam for what it is thousands of American kids will be blow to bits-maybe not this year, but it will happen!
I know exactly how you feel. There are some very few muslims who have explicitly denounced the terrorists, but it is really very few.
I was just thinking about this very thing. Just like after 9-11. Big deafening silence from the Muslim world.
When evil is all you see from them, how can you think any are good. They need to take off those head scarves and burka's, and the men need to stop preaching hate. Will not happen, they are committed to evil.
ISLAM'S WAR AGAINST THE WEST
By Howard Bloom
http://www.howardbloom.net/islam.htm
Osama Bin Laden, Terrorism, And The Great Crusade Against America
Holy War Goes Global
http://www.howardbloom.net/osama.htm
2 points: I'm aware they are going to be politically very UN correct, but whose counting?
A) How much can we really expect from a "religion" founded upon the divine mutterings of a talking goat?
B) How much can we honestly expect from Islamic followers who convert on the spot; as did so many Black soldiers did upon getting off the plane in Saudi Arabia when deployed during the Gulf War? Running for the nearest prayer rug vendor while claiming (in uniform) conscientious objection? IMHO, that's treasonous. This is fact and I'll be happy to provide the specific name of the witnessed offenders Army unit upon request.
So does the NY Slimes.
Kill them all, and build hog feedlots and packing plants on top of the mass graves.
So9
Read about 1200 years of history and see if your position changes.
To quote Huntingdon:
Islam's borders are bloody... So are its entrails...
Islam is not a "religion" within the meaning of this Constitution or of any of the Laws of the United States of America or any of it's political subdivisions.
Followers of Islam are not "persons" within the meaning of this Constitution or of any of the Laws of the United States of America or any of it's political subdivisions.
So9
Of course this was done by Jews... Now what a new idea for these b...
By now, I consider Islam a disease!
I wish I still believed in Santa Claus....we all grow up, at least those of us the muslim mongrels don't get their hands in.
Muhammadans are little cowardly women beating child killing pig terrorist murderers, little Hitlers in head scarves...fascism with a rag on its head this time. Hitler got along pretty well with the Muhammadan demon possessed freaks in his day...
Denouncing ain't gonna cut it.
The only people that can stop these Muhammadans are other Muhammadans. They look, speak and mingle with these people and their supporters.
Frankly, if Muhammadans don't solve this disease, then we must collectively assume that they are all diseased...
No, because as long as you leave them "persons" they have rights to trial, etc.
If they are not "persons" then you can just call the exterminator, like you would for rats in the attic.
So9
AMEN.
They are freakin cowards. They can bust into a school, butcher teachers and little kids, and we're supposed to get all weepy and sympathetic because a couple Arabs got to wear panties on their heads.
They should count their lucky damn stars that they still even HAVE HEADS!
http://freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1136113/posts
"...we're supposed to get all weepy and sympathetic because a couple Arabs got to wear panties on their heads."
Amen to that. I don't think that Abu Whatever stuff is playing anywhere but in the minds of the media and others who already hate America. I don't think ordinary people give a damn about it.
The media really does think people are sheep and can be lead around by their noses. However, this is not the case.
You should see the grafitti appearing in Athens. ("explitive deleted" Islam)
Time to start building Internment camps in America? I think so. Of course the main gate must be facing Mecca!
They are for the most part sleepwalkers. They need to wake up. Who would want to follow such a religion that attracts baby killers?
These people are insects.
Reality BTTT
lol
They still have to be persons because they are. However, if they insist on violating our liberties, these people must die along with the ideology that diseases it's adherents...
Unfortunately Islam is the enemy. Those who follow it are brainwashed into thinking it's OK. We should squash the scourge from the Earth. Islam is an evil religion of murdering violent thugs. Islam is the enemy of freedom loving people.
Right now all the muslims are likely collecting some muslim charity money to send to the families of those militants who shot the frightened fleeing Russian children in the back before the Russians moved in and killed them. Financial rewards for the families of terrorists is actually how they define muslim charities.
The Constitution once designated Blacks as "Not Persons" until it was amended. We can amend it again to do the same to Muslims, and should.
So9
Here's the rub as I see it:
Arab countires do not permit their people to speak out
against fellow Muslims...
BUT, here in the US they're silent too.
THAT tells me all I need to know about Muslims.
As a whole, they're bloodthirsty.
I want to believe I can eat chocolate 24/7 without looking like Michael Moore-on, but...
Every now and then, reality rises up and bites another idealist in the backside.
Good post; welcome to the Loose Confederation of the Grimly Determined.
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