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Dan Rather Lied: Company that owns font did not License it till 1980!
Internet ^ | 5 May 1994 | Charles Bigalow

Posted on 09/10/2004 5:23:19 PM PDT by Thanatos

Times (New) Roman and its part in the Development of Scalable Font Technology

By Charles Bigelow

Charles Bigelow posted this article to the Usenet newsgroup "comp.fonts" in May 1994 in response to the question: What's the difference between Times Roman and Times New Roman? I am grateful to Prof. Bigelow for his permission to publish the article. I have taken the liberty of retitling it.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroups: comp.fonts
Subject: Re: What's the difference between Times Roman and Times New Roman?
From: Charles Bigelow
Date: 5 May 1994

"Times Roman" is the name used by Linotype, and the name they registered as a trademark for the design in the U.S. "Times New Roman" was and still is the name used by The Monotype Corporation. The face was developed by The Times newspaper for its own use, under the design direction of Stanley Morison. Originally cut by the Monotype Corp. in England, the design was also licensed to Linotype, because The Times used Linotype equipment for much of its actual production. The story of "The Times New Roman" can be found in Stanley Morison's A Tally of Types, published by Cambridge University Press, with additional, though not quite the same, versions in Nicolas Barker's biography of Stanley Morison, and in James Moran's biography of SM. (There should be an apostrophe in that name, "Times' Roman", I suppose, though no-one uses it.)

During WWII, the American Linotype company, in a generous spirit of Allied camaraderie, applied for registration of the trademark name "Times Roman" as its own, not Monotype's or The Times', and received the registration in 1945.

In the 1980's, all this was revisited when some entrepreneurs, desirous of gaining the rights to use the name, applied to Rupert Murdoch, who owned The Times; separately, a legal action was also initiated to clarify the right of Monotype to use the name in the U.S., despite Linotype's registration.

The outcome of all of the legal maneuverings is that Linotype and its licensees like Adobe and Apple continue to use the name "Times Roman", while Monotype and its licensees like Microsoft use the name "Times New Roman".

During the decades of transatlantic "sharing" of the Times designs, and the transfer of the faces from metal to photo to digital, various differences developed between the versions marketed by Linotype and Monotype. Especially these became evident when Adobe released the PostScript version, for various reasons having to do with how Adobe produced the original PostScript implementations of Times. The width metrics were different, as well as various proportions and details.

In the late 1980's, Monotype redrew its Times New Roman to make it fit exactly the proportions and metrics of the Adobe-Linotype version of Times Roman. Monotype claimed that its new version was better than the Adobe-Linotype version, because of smoother curves, better detailing, and generally greater sensitivity to the original designs done for The Times and Monotype by Victor Lardent, who worked under the direction of Stanley Morison. During the same period, Adobe upgraded its version of Times, using digital masters from Linotype, which of course claimed that it had a superior version, so there was a kind of competition to see who had the most refined, sensitive, original, genuine, bona-fide, artistically and typographically correct version. Many, perhaps most, users didn't notice and didn't care about these subtle distinctions, many of which were invisible at 10 pt at 300 dpi (which is an em of 42 pixels, a stem of three pixels, a serif of 1 pixel, and so on).

When Microsoft produced its version of Times New Roman, licensed from Monotype, in TrueType format, and when Apple produced its version of Times Roman, licensed from Linotype, in TrueType format, the subtle competition took on a new aspect, because both Microsoft and Apple expended a great deal of time and effort to make the TrueType versions as good as, or better than, the PostScript version. During the same period, Adobe released ATM along with upgraded versions of its core set of fonts, for improved rasterization on screen. Also, firms like Imagen, now part of QMS, and Sun developed rival font scaling technologies, and labored to make sure that their renderings of Times, licensed from Linotype in both cases, were equal to those of their competitors. Hence, the perceived quality of the Times design became a litmus for the quality of several font formats. Never before, and probably never again, would the precise placement of pixels in the serifs or 's' curves etc. of Times Roman occupy the attention of so many engineers and computer scientists. It was perhaps the supreme era of the Digital Fontologist.

As for the actual visual differences in the designs, well, like any good academic author, I leave the detection and analysis of those "as an exercise for the reader".

© Charles Bigelow


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Editorial; Extended News; Government; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: 1972; 1973; 60minutes; alabama; badoom; blather; bush; cbs; dan; danisafraud; dncbs; font; forgery; guard; killian; lawyers; licensing; lie; national; president; rather; rathergate; roman; seebs; selectricgate; times; timesnewroman; timesroman; typewritter; vietnam
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1 posted on 09/10/2004 5:23:21 PM PDT by Thanatos
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To: Thanatos

bump :)


2 posted on 09/10/2004 5:24:03 PM PDT by USA_Soccer (Try a better (free + open source) browser -> Mozilla Firefox @ mozilla.org)
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To: Thanatos

I do love Times New Roman... I wonder if Dan likes it or if he is just going insane....


3 posted on 09/10/2004 5:25:13 PM PDT by Porterville (How can the median price of a home in CA be 450,000 dollars? How? Where is the money?)
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To: USA_Soccer

We picked apart their first report, let's destroy their increadibly weak defense.


4 posted on 09/10/2004 5:25:15 PM PDT by waterman478
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To: Thanatos

Already posted here: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1212542/posts?page=979#979


5 posted on 09/10/2004 5:26:09 PM PDT by Chad Fairbanks (Kerry's Campaign fell 12 stories, hitting the pavement like a Hefty bag filled with vegetable soup.)
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To: Porterville

I like the elegance of Ariel, myself.


6 posted on 09/10/2004 5:26:33 PM PDT by HitmanLV (I will not be pushed, filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed or numbered. My life is my own.)
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To: Thanatos
I leave the detection and analysis of those "as an exercise for the reader".

LOL, I've decided, Rather has to go.

7 posted on 09/10/2004 5:26:39 PM PDT by Mister Baredog ((Part of the Reagan legacy is to re-elect G.W. Bush))
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To: Thanatos

This is what I love about the Internet (and FR)! This is the closest thing to omniscience ("all-knowing," "all-seeing") on the planet earth!


8 posted on 09/10/2004 5:26:46 PM PDT by My2Cents (http://www.conservativesforbush.com)
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To: Porterville
Screenshot of what Dan calls "the same superscript" on my site:

http://www.murdoconline.net/archives/001564.html

They've got nothing. And they know it.
9 posted on 09/10/2004 5:26:54 PM PDT by murdocj (Murdoc Online - Everyone is entitled to my opinion (http://www.murdoconline.net))
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To: Thanatos

LOL! That took about 5 seconds for the "idiots" in the Blogosphere to uncover.

I'm loving this. 60 minutes has been grilling people mercilessly for decades. Now they're getting the same treatment from the blogosphere. Dan Rather's acting like some Cigarette Executive being interviewed by Mike Wallace.


10 posted on 09/10/2004 5:28:13 PM PDT by VisualizeSmallerGovernment (Question Liberal Authority)
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To: My2Cents

Has someone taken a look at Kerry military records to see if they were written in the same style?


11 posted on 09/10/2004 5:28:58 PM PDT by Dutch Boy
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To: Thanatos
ROFLMAO!
BUMP
12 posted on 09/10/2004 5:30:03 PM PDT by Fiddlstix (This Tagline for sale. (Presented by TagLines R US))
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To: Thanatos

Dan Blather's report was handed to him by the CBS Legal Department, because CBS may be subject to fines and sanctions if it can be shown that they maliciously used "evidence" against a public offical that was known to be fraudulant.


13 posted on 09/10/2004 5:31:38 PM PDT by PokeyJoe (The plural for RAT is RATS, not RATICS)
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To: Thanatos

bump


14 posted on 09/10/2004 5:31:42 PM PDT by VOA
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Comment #15 Removed by Moderator

To: Thanatos
What's the Font Type Kennth!?
16 posted on 09/10/2004 5:31:55 PM PDT by TeleStraightShooter (Sorry Kerry, you're 3 decimal places adrift: 3,000,000 not 3,000 "displaced"/murdered SE Asians)
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To: VisualizeSmallerGovernment
Dan Rather's acting like some Cigarette Executive being interviewed by Mike Wallace.

Please, please..find a way to debunk this DNC mouthpiece!!

17 posted on 09/10/2004 5:32:11 PM PDT by evad (We cannot afford 9-10 thinkers in a 9-11 world)
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To: Thanatos

bumping.........


18 posted on 09/10/2004 5:33:29 PM PDT by shield (The Greatest Scientific Discoveries of the Century Reveal God!!!! by Dr. H. Ross, Astrophysicist)
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To: kjnspc

So, are you saying that Killian went to a printshop and had the memos for his personal files typeset?


19 posted on 09/10/2004 5:33:45 PM PDT by Chad Fairbanks (Kerry's Campaign fell 12 stories, hitting the pavement like a Hefty bag filled with vegetable soup.)
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To: Dutch Boy

No... Mr. kerry won't sign his SF 180 which would allow us folks to examine his complete record... What we get has been "typed" on the same typewriter used by Dan Blather... What a charade this whole thing is...


20 posted on 09/10/2004 5:33:49 PM PDT by gatorgriz ("The world is full of bastards - the number ever increasing the further one gets from Missoula, MT")
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To: Thanatos

Send this to the news agencies!!!


21 posted on 09/10/2004 5:34:00 PM PDT by Tempest (Don't blame me, I'm voting for Bush.)
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To: kjnspc

You signed up on FreeRepublic today just to advise us that an obvious forgery shouldn't be criticized?


22 posted on 09/10/2004 5:34:09 PM PDT by Mr. Lucky
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To: TeleStraightShooter

23 posted on 09/10/2004 5:34:11 PM PDT by Chieftain (Support the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth and expose Hanoi John's FRAUD!)
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To: Dutch Boy

I hear the North Vietnamese are searching their records for Kerry's military correspondence.


24 posted on 09/10/2004 5:34:24 PM PDT by small voice in the wilderness (Quick, act casual. If they sense scorn and ridicule, they'll flee..)
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To: All

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/1212607/posts

Okay, now let's see if anyone can replicate the document in WordPerfect or, for that matter, MSWord for Macintosh.

Also, other programs. Using default settings.


25 posted on 09/10/2004 5:34:35 PM PDT by lavrenti (Think of who is pithy, yet so attractive to women.)
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To: Chad Fairbanks

This deserves it's own thread for sure.


26 posted on 09/10/2004 5:34:52 PM PDT by Tempest (Don't blame me, I'm voting for Bush.)
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To: zip

ping


27 posted on 09/10/2004 5:34:57 PM PDT by Mrs Zip
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To: Mr. Lucky; kjnspc

kjnspc is probably just some CBS Staffer hoping to do some Damage Control before the ship lists too far to port...


28 posted on 09/10/2004 5:35:18 PM PDT by Chad Fairbanks (Kerry's Campaign fell 12 stories, hitting the pavement like a Hefty bag filled with vegetable soup.)
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To: murdocj

your graphic on your site didn't show up on my machine....only got the red x.


29 posted on 09/10/2004 5:35:33 PM PDT by xzins (Retired Army and Proudly Supporting BUSH/CHENEY 2004!)
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To: Tempest

Oh, I know. Just wanted to point it out (I have an ego that needs stroking every now and them, or I get the shakes and imaginary spiders)


30 posted on 09/10/2004 5:35:55 PM PDT by Chad Fairbanks (Kerry's Campaign fell 12 stories, hitting the pavement like a Hefty bag filled with vegetable soup.)
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To: Thanatos
Did you post this thread using Times Roman or Times New Roman? =)
31 posted on 09/10/2004 5:36:01 PM PDT by LayoutGuru2 (Triskaidekaphobia ? Never heard of it !)
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To: TeleStraightShooter

That's the funniest I've seen all day. Freegards!


32 posted on 09/10/2004 5:36:05 PM PDT by murdocj (Murdoc Online - Everyone is entitled to my opinion (http://www.murdoconline.net))
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To: PokeyJoe

Fines? This must be a felony to forge documents like this. I want to see people in jail and CBS grovel.


33 posted on 09/10/2004 5:36:09 PM PDT by plain talk
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To: Porterville
I do love Times New Roman

I don't know. What's the Times of London been saying about us lately? Maybe if it's under his control, Jim Robinson should switch FR from what looks to me like Times New Roman to a good American font like high-readability Georgia.

34 posted on 09/10/2004 5:37:31 PM PDT by Steve Eisenberg
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To: Thanatos
Rather Lied Ping!


35 posted on 09/10/2004 5:37:31 PM PDT by GOPcapitalist ("Can Lincoln expect to subjugate a people thus resolved? No!" - Sam Houston, 3/1863)
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To: Chad Fairbanks

Ahhhh I see.


36 posted on 09/10/2004 5:37:53 PM PDT by Tempest (Don't blame me, I'm voting for Bush.)
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To: Chad Fairbanks

Ahhhh I see.


37 posted on 09/10/2004 5:37:53 PM PDT by Tempest (Don't blame me, I'm voting for Bush.)
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To: kjnspc

Welcome to Free Republic.


38 posted on 09/10/2004 5:38:28 PM PDT by EggsAckley (.......John Kerry suffers from delusions of adequacy........)
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To: Tempest

But yes, it deserves it's own thread - I was too lazy to do it, however, so I'm glad that someone picked up the slack ;0)


39 posted on 09/10/2004 5:38:36 PM PDT by Chad Fairbanks (Kerry's Campaign fell 12 stories, hitting the pavement like a Hefty bag filled with vegetable soup.)
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To: Thanatos

CBS cover-up.


40 posted on 09/10/2004 5:40:21 PM PDT by Kirkwood (I think, therefore I am Republican!)
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To: kjnspc; Thanatos

> We run the risk of this backfiring.

Careful. I think the DNC has a trademark on that
talking point :-)

Anyway, I agree.

Although Rather may be mistaken about the literal
name "Times Roman", the fact is that "Times" style
typefaces have been around a long time, and the
resolution of the "documents" in question is not
high enough to permit saying much more than that
what we see is consistent with the MS default serif
font "Times New Roman".

Occam's Razor is in the lead here. Let's not push
this horse faster than it needs to go.

Clumsy MS Word forgery using Word defaults indicts
these documents. Any historical defense gets very
weird very fast, and there are more problems than
any historical scenario can handle.


41 posted on 09/10/2004 5:40:52 PM PDT by Boundless
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To: Thanatos

The documents are real. Why would you think they weren't? I never said they weren't.

42 posted on 09/10/2004 5:42:33 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Cry......and let slip the dogs of whine.)
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To: kjnspc
Perfectly centered address at top? It's because it's not typed. It's typeset.

Yeah. "Typeset" by hitting ctrl c, ctrl v, ctrl p, enter.

43 posted on 09/10/2004 5:42:42 PM PDT by GOPcapitalist ("Can Lincoln expect to subjugate a people thus resolved? No!" - Sam Houston, 3/1863)
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To: Chieftain

Perfect! Kudo's!
Hey, Ho, Rather must go!
Rather lied and the mainstream media died!


44 posted on 09/10/2004 5:42:53 PM PDT by Arkady
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To: Boundless

Again, however, I am curious if the documents can be replicated on WordPerfect or on a Macintosh platform.


45 posted on 09/10/2004 5:42:53 PM PDT by lavrenti (Think of who is pithy, yet so attractive to women.)
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To: murdocj

that picture is too dark, can you lighten it to make it easier to see?


46 posted on 09/10/2004 5:43:43 PM PDT by Truthsearcher
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To: plain talk

Well.... notice how they couch it in "unofficial personnel files" - hence they avoid the charge of forging official government documents, only private documents meant to "CYA" . . . Libel law with punitive fines.


47 posted on 09/10/2004 5:44:45 PM PDT by PokeyJoe (The plural for RAT is RATS, not RATICS)
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To: Thanatos

I sent this to Drudge. I would suggest bombarding Drudge with this piece of info.

Go in for the kill


48 posted on 09/10/2004 5:44:49 PM PDT by Republican Red (We're going to win one for the gipper...they're going to lose one for the flipper)
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To: Thanatos

bump :D


49 posted on 09/10/2004 5:45:05 PM PDT by Tempest (Don't blame me, I'm voting for Bush.)
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To: Dutch Boy
Has someone taken a look at Kerry military records to see if they were written in the same style?

There's a thread up with a copy of F'n's military BONUS CHECK for "serving" in Vietnam: Sen. Kerry's Bonus (check) From The Vietnam War - Howie Carr

50 posted on 09/10/2004 5:45:43 PM PDT by arasina (So there.)
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