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U.S. Social Security Ties with Mexico is Bad for America
Insight ^ | September 9, 2004 | James R. Edwards

Posted on 09/13/2004 1:34:37 PM PDT by Tailgunner Joe

Those in Congress who really want to protect Social Security should put some action behind their bluster. They should add language to the Labor-Health-Education Appropriations bill prohibiting funds from being spent to carry out an expensive Social Security giveaway to Mexico.

U.S. Social Security Commissioner Jo Anne Barnhart signed an agreement June 29 that will allow Mexicans who have worked in the United States, their dependents and survivors to tap into Social Security.

This could spell trouble for American seniors and for baby boomers as they approach retirement.

To hear proponents tell it, this agreement is all about saving some 3,000 U.S. workers and their employers an estimated $140 million on taxes over five years. But actually, American taxpayers could be out hundreds of billions of dollars over coming years.

Social Security officials apparently believe their own (under)estimate that only 50,000 Mexican beneficiaries would receive benefits in the first five years. You don't have to be a math whiz to figure out pretty quickly that that number is laughably low. A General Accounting Office report last fall devastated the Social Security Administration's low-ball figures.

GAO concluded that the "highly uncertain" official cost estimate "does not directly consider the estimated millions of current and former unauthorized workers and family members from Mexico." Social Security must be the last agency to know we have a huge illegal immigration problem, with almost 70 percent of illegal aliens being Mexican.

Ronald Reagan said if you want more of something, subsidize it. Entitling Mexican illegal aliens and their family members to Social Security benefits would amount to a subsidy and a huge incentive to immigrate illegally to the United States.

As the GAO put it, "The [Social Security Administration] estimate also inherently assumes that the behavior of Mexican citizens would not change and does not recognize that an agreement could create an additional incentive for unauthorized workers to enter the United States to work and maintain documentation to claim their earnings under a false identity."

Moreover, untold numbers of illegal workers have returned to Mexico and, GAO noted, they and their families "could conceivably benefit from a totalization agreement." While Social Security projected 300,000 Mexican beneficiaries in 2050, GAO said that figure "represents only about 6 percent of the estimated number of unauthorized Mexicans in the United States today, and thus appears relatively low."

At a 2003 House Immigration Subcommittee hearing, investigative reporter Joel Mowbray explained that Mexicans illegally working in the United States already can qualify for Social Security benefits; the totalization agreement only makes it easier for them, plus opens up eligibility for their dependents and survivors. He also noted the "several hundred billion dollars" price tag the "progressive" Social Security structure adds when "illegal aliens from Mexico [can] get back significantly more money than the taxes they paid."

Social Security's track record has been poor at estimating the number of beneficiaries under totalization agreements. GAO found frequent overestimates and underestimates, "usually by more than 25 percent." And "where the underestimates occurred, the differences were huge." Importantly, GAO noted "the number of estimated beneficiaries for prior agreements is substantially smaller than for the proposed Mexican agreement."

In other words, for Social Security number-crunchers to underestimate the beneficiaries for a totalization agreement with Australia or a Western European country is bad but not horrible because the totals are fairly small. However, underestimates for Mexico would have serious financial ramifications for our Social Security system.

The Mexico agreement raises the stakes for a Social Security trust fund set to run red ink starting in 2018 and go broke in 2042. Messing with Social Security, upon which some 47 million Americans rely today, doesn't make good political sense - certainly not for any rational politician in an election year.

Fraud and abuse will only worsen under this agreement. Mexico is notorious for its culture of rampant fraud. GAO was troubled that Social Security officials failed to inspect adequately Mexico's recordkeeping system to ensure its integrity.

Mowbray described for Congress a frightening scenario in which Mexicans could scam the system. He said Social Security's disability insurance program "is wracked with fraud," and millions of illegal aliens and their family members could exploit that route to start collecting payments early - and continue to collect benefits for years.

Social Security bureaucrats have addressed none of the concerns raised by GAO and others.

Congress should rein in the bureaucrats at Social Security and kill this agreement, which has all the earmarks of a costly bad deal that Americans will only regret.

Given the ridiculously low estimates on which it is being sold publicly, the unstable financial future that Social Security already faces, the incentive for runaway fraud and crime, this agreement is unwise.


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Editorial; Foreign Affairs; Government; Mexico; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: aliens; immigrantlist; socialsecurity
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To: gubamyster

TFTP


21 posted on 09/13/2004 11:18:35 PM PDT by ApesForEvolution (DemocRATS are communists and want to destroy America only to replace it with the USSA)
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To: Ol' Dan Tucker
The propaganda "fact" sheet put out by the SSA:
social Security Online
Fact Sheet

Social Security

UNITED STATES/MEXICO TOTALIZATION AGREEMENT  

(Aquí en Español)
 

Totalization

An agreement with Mexico

Costs of an agreement with Mexico

Effective date of an agreement with Mexico

Countries already having totalization agreements with the U.S.

 
 (Toll-Free) 800-772-1213 (Toll-Free) TTY 800-325-0778 

June 2004

22 posted on 09/13/2004 11:41:21 PM PDT by Ron H. (Seems Bush isn't all that seriuos on the WoT afterall, else why are our borders still wide open!)
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To: gubamyster; B4Ranch

Giving Mexicans Social Security benefits is one of the last dominoes to fall before the house of cards falls in.


23 posted on 09/13/2004 11:42:06 PM PDT by Happy2BMe (50 days until November 2nd)
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To: Ol' Dan Tucker

Have you tried a FOI request?


24 posted on 09/13/2004 11:44:36 PM PDT by Ron H. (Seems Bush isn't all that seriuos on the WoT afterall, else why are our borders still wide open!)
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To: Ron H.
Social Security actuaries estimate that a totalization agreement with Mexico would have a negligible long-range effect on the Trust Funds.

Of course not. Once it's busted, it's busted.

25 posted on 09/14/2004 1:53:33 AM PDT by azhenfud ("He who is always looking up seldom finds others' lost change...")
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To: Tailgunner Joe
Entitling Mexican illegal aliens and their family members to Social Security benefits would amount to a subsidy and a huge incentive to immigrate illegally to the United States.

Oh for God's sake. Don't any of these politicians get this???????

I am frustrated to the point of instant anger at these headlines.

26 posted on 09/14/2004 4:01:53 AM PDT by raybbr
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To: Tailgunner Joe

Shouldn't the AARP be all over this one ?
They represent a large voting bloc don't they ?

I'm not retirement age so I may have missed it if they are active in opposing this.


27 posted on 09/14/2004 4:23:08 AM PDT by millefleur
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To: NRA2BFree

Mexico's own social security system is in huge trouble and I think this is just another big bailout. Mexicans have been out in the streets protesting changes to their own system --- being given access to checks from the USA certainly helps calm them down.


28 posted on 09/14/2004 5:38:40 AM PDT by FITZ
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To: Ol' Dan Tucker

It's interesting that such a big plan isn't being discussed at all with the American people. I doubt they really wanted to push this through right before an election but Vicente Fox's political party is having difficulties in Mexico so it's time to hand him something else. Right now we're doing whatever it takes to keep the current elites in power in Mexico even if they won't reform that country.


29 posted on 09/14/2004 5:40:52 AM PDT by FITZ
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To: FITZ

This is disgusting. Follow the money back to Vincente. Welcome to the United States of Mexico.


30 posted on 09/14/2004 5:46:35 AM PDT by mtbopfuyn
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To: mtbopfuyn

It seems that all this give-away is more about keeping those in power in Mexico secure. We're spending ghastly amounts of money to stave off the revolution in Mexico. The longer they don't reform the place -- and reform it the right way -- the more we are going to have to give them.


31 posted on 09/14/2004 6:20:43 AM PDT by FITZ
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To: Dubya

Not only have they not ever been honest, they laugh at us and think we are really stupid.

Social security is falling apart. There is not enough money now. Add in millions of illegal aliens collecting, and we've got a real mess.

My sisters ex father inlaw from Iran, came here with his work record from Iran and they take his word for who when he worked for. He is receiving a check monthly without never having paid into the system. Someone at S.S. told me that this is happening all over the world. People go to the embassy, and file for SS benefits.


32 posted on 09/14/2004 7:09:53 AM PDT by television is just wrong
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To: FITZ

I believe you're right and I think this whole program to include illegals for $$ is just the beginning. As the FTAA becomes reality and economies are merged under the American Union I bet this program is expanded into Central and S. America. NAFTA greased the skids for all this B.S.


33 posted on 09/14/2004 8:32:51 AM PDT by american spirit
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To: texastoo; Ron H.
texastoo wrote:
You can write the social security department and they will send you a copy of the bill. Good luck on receiving it before this becomes law.

Ron H. wrote:
Have you tried a FOI request?

Just for grins and giggles, I was going to call them today. I imagine it's the sort of like adult entertainment --available if you ask, but not on public display.

34 posted on 09/14/2004 9:03:54 AM PDT by Ol' Dan Tucker
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To: FITZ
It's interesting that such a big plan isn't being discussed at all with the American people. I doubt they really wanted to push this through right before an election but Vicente Fox's political party is having difficulties in Mexico so it's time to hand him something else. Right now we're doing whatever it takes to keep the current elites in power in Mexico even if they won't reform that country.

I don't know.

With all of the important issues facing the `merican people, like which elite white boy served less in a war that ended 32 years ago is much more relevent to this election than billions of taxpayer dollars going to Mexican illegal aliens every year.

Now why would Bush want to keep the corrupt power structure in Mexico intact?...

35 posted on 09/14/2004 9:15:49 AM PDT by Ol' Dan Tucker
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To: raybbr
Oh for God's sake. Don't any of these politicians get this???????

Of course they get it. They wrote it!

They also know what would become of their political careers if it came out that they wrote it.

This is why both presidential candidates are talking about their service in the Vietnam war.

Naturally, the group of people most able to stop this (FReepers) are asleep at the switch because they've allowed themselves to believe they elected a moral and just man --Jorge W. Arbusto.

Nothing could be further from the truth.

In March, 2004 the GAO rapped Arbusto's knuckles over propaganda created by the Arbusto HHS in order to sell the Medicare package to the `merican people.

An honest man doesn't need to resort to propaganda to move his ideas forward. Which means that Arbusto is neither honest nor is his medicare package good for the country.

And still Bush will probably win the election and FReepers couldn't be happier.

Where is Sean Hannity? Ann Coulter? Rush Limbaugh? Michael Reagan?

All drinking deeply from the Republican trough.

36 posted on 09/14/2004 9:24:37 AM PDT by Ol' Dan Tucker
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To: Tailgunner Joe

Every Mexican with half a brain will enroll this will be huge an entire industry will spring up because of this nonsense.


37 posted on 09/14/2004 9:30:27 AM PDT by junta
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To: Ol' Dan Tucker
Now why would Bush want to keep the corrupt power structure in Mexico intact?...

I don't know if he cares about them per se --- but a lot of American businesses are also down there in Mexico --- and many thanks to NAFTA. They're goal is to get rich --- not make Mexico more stable which those low-paying jobs bringing them all up to the border aren't doing obviously. Someone would stand to lose a lot of money if Mexico goes into it's next revolution. It's not about changing the underlying conditions --- but about holding it off for as long as possible.

38 posted on 09/14/2004 4:34:18 PM PDT by FITZ
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To: american spirit

Mexico's own Social Security system is already bankrupt --- we're certainly not combining the two systems to get either one of them working since both are failing --- theirs faster than ours.

This is a major bailout --- we'll add to our growing large deficits to keep their heads above water a little longer --- then maybe we'll go down under together. Both countries pulled under by massive socialism.


39 posted on 09/14/2004 4:37:28 PM PDT by FITZ
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To: Ol' Dan Tucker
With all of the important issues facing the `merican people, like which elite white boy served less in a war that ended 32 years ago is much more relevent to this election than billions of taxpayer dollars going to Mexican illegal aliens every year.

Diversion tactics still working as well as they ever did in past elections!

40 posted on 09/14/2004 4:37:29 PM PDT by Ron H. (Seems Bush isn't all that seriuos on the WoT afterall, else why are our borders still wide open!)
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