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To: Luis Gonzalez
Russia, before democratization was no different than Cuba, now they're going to be no different than Cuba again...and you're arguing that this is a good thing.

Russia is very different from Cuba, same way as Japan is very different from Ireland. Travel more.

71 posted on 09/15/2004 6:38:01 AM PDT by A. Pole (Madeleine Albright:"We are the indispensable nation. We stand tall. We see further into the future.")
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To: A. Pole

I don't need to travel more, I know where you're coming from.

And that "travel more" crap is just that...crap.


72 posted on 09/15/2004 6:48:34 AM PDT by Luis Gonzalez ( Even Jane Fonda apologized. Will you, John?)
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To: A. Pole
I received this reponse on another thread addressing others raising your straw man argument, I'll repost it here as it applies perfectly:

Luis,

Most of these people don't care about what is going on if things aren’t looking so bright, while a very small few here may even wish for the return of communism because they are silently like them. As for the rest, they want to shop, have fun, party, and see nothing but good times from now till they no longer are with us. Anything, and I mean anything that gets in the way of this view will be put down at all costs despite what the facts are. They will ignore those facts, not answer them, come back at you with tripe little comments like:

that their economy is doing so well despite that fact that political structures gives the freedom for this, which ironically is now being sovietized, but I guess I am being negative(another failure of an argument on their part since it does not prove whether something is factual or not) for pointing out reality; or another favorite of theirs is ‘where you there’ or ‘ever visited’, implying then you have no right to say anything even when the news accounts are as plain as day(but this argument falls to the ground as it has nothing to do with the facts as they are here, they have only a feel good mentality that justifies putting some one down for bring a little sobering reality back into their life). Then there was one about how favorable the people of Russia have of the U.S. but as you pointed out relations are not so good. The people have about a 9% favorable rating of us, not a surprise given all the propaganda feed to them over the last 5 years, not to mention life is still hard over there. Yes it is true that many Russians had a high rating of us during the cold war, so what? It didn’t stop the government that enslaved them from doing rotten things. It won’t stop this government from doing rotten things except this time will have the full backing of the people(that scares me), well at least until they realize they have been had which could take a while.

All of their arguments are false unless they are willing to argue the facts and show that the worst is not transpiring before our eyes. But as anyone with an open eye, forget and open mind at this point, can see the facts speak for themselves. The reality doesn’t get anymore blunt than this, well..... maybe with the exception of having all out war. Of course if we wake up in time we might avoid that, but with people like the ones you have been arguing with I have little hope as they seem to be the norm today. However that doesn’t mean anyone should stop trying to point out the truth, God only knows, we need it now more than ever.

DarkWaters


74 posted on 09/15/2004 6:53:48 AM PDT by Luis Gonzalez ( Even Jane Fonda apologized. Will you, John?)
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